Kostin is a good player, and was an RFA. They could have offer-sheeted him, and it would have cost a 3rd. Instead they took Yamamoto and it cost them some cap space.
Yzerman has bosses that he reports too, just like CC does.
Kostin didn't receive a qualifying offer and was likely not going to, so Detroit wouldn't have to offer sheet him. They could have just waited a few days and signed him for free if they really wanted. I guess they liked the player enough that they didn't want to take the chance of him signing elsewhere though.
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"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
Kostin didn't receive a qualifying offer and was likely not going to, so Detroit wouldn't have to offer sheet him. They could have just waited a few days and signed him for free if they really wanted. I guess they liked the player enough that they didn't want to take the chance of him signing elsewhere though.
Exactly. If he becomes a free agent, the chances he signs with Detroit are pretty slim.
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Could Yzerman have secured Kostin for nothing or not?
Not.
Anyone could have signed Kostin and, as a free agent, he would have had more leverage for a bigger contract.
They paid to have exclusive negotiating rights and leverage within those negotiations with the player. You can bet that if the negotiations weren’t going how they wanted they would have just qualified him to ensure they still got the player.
Anyone could have signed Kostin and, as a free agent, he would have had more leverage for a bigger contract.
They paid to have exclusive negotiating rights and leverage within those negotiations with the player. You can bet that if the negotiations weren’t going how they wanted they would have just qualified him to ensure they still got the player.
You understand the meaning of the word “could” right?
You literally contradicted yourself. I didn’t say anything about the players leverage. Detroit wanted certainty and taking on Yamamoto’s baggage proved that they value the player, while retaining their rights.
It doesn’t change the fact that they COULD have had the same player & paid upwards of $400,000 more per season and been at the same place without helping the Oilers.
You understand the meaning of the word “could” right?
You literally contradicted yourself. I didn’t say anything about the players leverage. Detroit wanted certainty and taking on Yamamoto’s baggage proved that they value the player, while retaining their rights.
It doesn’t change the fact that they COULD have had the same player & paid upwards of $400,000 more per season and been at the same place without helping the Oilers.
Why is this so difficult to understand?
Yes, I know what words mean, thanks Merriam.
You understand there’s value in changing something from a possibility, or a “could,” to something that can actually be controlled, right? They “could” have had Kostin for the same price, they also “could” have lost out on him entirely, and they “could” have had to sign him for even more than his contract + Yamamoto. They decided the value of avoiding the less desirable “could” situations and paid that value.
Let me know if you still struggle with it and I’ll be happy to explain it again.
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Exactly. If he becomes a free agent, the chances he signs with Detroit are pretty slim.
Why? Klim Kostin isn’t exactly Tyler Bertuzzi. He was a waiver wire pickup last year that several teams had to option of grabbing.
The likelihood he signs in Detroit is as great as almost any other team, if not better. A player in his position wants to be put in a position to succeed.
Why wouldn’t Detroit be a likely destination?
After not being qualified, Sam Steel, with better production, signed in Dallas in arguably a worse position to succeed depth wise, for way less money.
You understand there’s value in changing something from a possibility, or a “could,” to something that can actually be controlled, right? They “could” have had Kostin for the same price, they also “could” have lost out on him entirely, and they “could” have had to sign him for even more than his contract + Yamamoto. They decided the value of avoiding the less desirable “could” situations and paid that value.
Let me know if you still struggle with it and I’ll be happy to explain it again.
Great, now use your finely tuned analytical skills to evaluate how the word “not” applies to the word “could”.
I asked a yes/no question.
“Could Yzerman have secured him for nothing (no assets) or not?
You replied, not.
Followed up with some rambling disconnected rationalizations to the question.
Yzerman obviously did the Oilers a favour and it’s nonsense to think he didn’t.
Yeah it's pretty clear that Yzerman did the Oilers a solid. But they also got the player they wanted for what amounts to be a 2 year 2.5AAV contract. With that being said there is still a future consideration in the mix. Maybe this is a I scratch your back, you scratch mine situation and the Redwings unload a player to the Oilers next season when the cap goes up.
He took an unwanted and troublesome contract off Edmonton's books and cap for ZERO return and then paid actual cash out of his owner's pocket and against his cap to make it disappear.
In return for nothing.
What would you call that?
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He took an unwanted and troublesome contract off Edmonton's books and cap for ZERO return and then paid actual cash out of his owner's pocket and against his cap to make it disappear.
In return for nothing.
What would you call that?
They got the exclusive negotiating rights to a pending UFA 4th liner. I guess that is sort of something. I am not sure that is worth anywhere near the actual dollar amount it costed them though. It seems like an expensive price for something like that.
None of it matters anyway. GMs occasionally do the "you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours later" thing. Nothing wrong with that and why it pays to have a good relationships and trust with other GMs.
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"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
They got the exclusive negotiating rights to a pending UFA 4th liner. I guess that is sort of something. I am not sure that is worth anywhere near the actual dollar amount it costed them though. It seems like an expensive price for something like that.
None of it matters anyway. GMs occasionally do the "you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours later" thing. Nothing wrong with that and why it pays to have a good relationships and trust with other GMs.
Really? And when has Edmonton ever made good?
They traded an injured player to LA 'promising' that he passed his medical.
He did not.
They traded us Ladislav Smid whose skull was attached to his spine with chicken-wire and hope.
It may not matter much in the end, but I'm also not going to categorically dismiss that Yzerman 'did a solid' for his good buddy Holland in this particular instance.
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I don't understand all of this talk of Kostin being a UFA/being able to sign anywhere. Isn't he an RFA? He just turned 24 and Cap Friendly seems to indicate him as an RFA.
Edmonton is no good!
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I don't understand all of this talk of Kostin being a UFA/being able to sign anywhere. Isn't he an RFA? He just turned 24 and Cap Friendly seems to indicate him as an RFA.
Edmonton is no good!
He was an RFA until Detroit didn’t qualify him. Probably as a technicality to avoid arbitration ability by the player, but they were clearly down the path in negotiating the 2x$2M. He’ll still be RFA after this new deal too.
I don't understand all of this talk of Kostin being a UFA/being able to sign anywhere. Isn't he an RFA? He just turned 24 and Cap Friendly seems to indicate him as an RFA.
Edmonton is no good!
No qualifying offer was tendered by Edmonton, so before the trade happened, he would have been a UFA unless they had a change of heart. Given their cap situation, it was unlikely that they were going to qualify him.
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"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
Great, now use your finely tuned analytical skills to evaluate how the word “not” applies to the word “could”.
I asked a yes/no question.
“Could Yzerman have secured him for nothing (no assets) or not?
You replied, not.
Followed up with some rambling disconnected rationalizations to the question.
Yzerman obviously did the Oilers a favour and it’s nonsense to think he didn’t.
They could have in the sense that “anything could happen” I guess, sure. But as I pointed out and can explain in simpler terms for you: in the real world we all live in, no, they could not have had him for “nothing.” Let me know if you need the word “nothing” explained to you. I prefer Oxford if that’s OK.
“Could Yzerman have secured Kostin for nothing or not?”
Not
“Could Yzerman have secured Kostin for the same value he spent on Kostin + the buyout?”
Sure, but it would have been harder to do, as a whole bunch of other “could”s enter the situation, as pointed out. The value of buying out Yamamoto’s contract was having Kostin as an RFA and being able to have exclusive negotiating rights for a player who likely would have gotten at least 2.5 and probably more than 2 years as a UFA. Not sure why you’re struggling so hard with that.
You’re free to keep believing everyone is just helping out a mid-market Canadian team with the biggest superstar in the league out of the kindness of their hearts though, if you want.
Excellent and well thought out point.
Even the AI knows the Oilers are no good:
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As an AI language model, I don't hold personal opinions or biases, but I can provide you with an analysis of the Edmonton Oilers based on historical performance and common criticisms.
The assertion that the Edmonton Oilers are "no good" is subjective and can vary depending on the context and timeframe considered. However, it is worth noting that the Oilers have had a mixed performance in recent years. Here are some factors that critics often point out when assessing the team's success:
Playoff Struggles: One of the most significant criticisms of the Oilers in recent years has been their inability to find consistent success in the playoffs. While they have qualified for the playoffs in certain seasons, they have often faced early exits or struggled to advance deep into the postseason. This lack of playoff success can be frustrating for fans and can contribute to the perception that the team is underperforming.
Defensive Weaknesses: Another commonly mentioned issue is the Oilers' defensive play. Over the years, the team has faced challenges in terms of defensive structure, goaltending, and overall defensive depth. This has resulted in a higher number of goals conceded and difficulties in shutting down opponents, which can hinder their chances of winning games.
Dependency on Star Players: The Oilers have been criticized for relying heavily on their star players, particularly Connor McDavid and Leon Draisaitl. While both players are exceptionally talented and have won numerous awards, some argue that the team lacks depth beyond these key individuals. This over-reliance on a few players can make the team more predictable and vulnerable to injuries or slumps in form.
Front Office Decisions: Criticism of a team's performance often extends to the front office and management decisions. Some have questioned the Oilers' ability to build a well-rounded roster, make effective trades, or acquire impactful players through free agency. Poor drafting decisions or questionable player signings can also contribute to the team's struggles.
It's important to note that sports teams' performances can fluctuate over time, and the Oilers' fortunes can change in the future. As with any analysis of a sports team, it's essential to consider a range of factors and viewpoints to form a balanced assessment.
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