The Social Dilemma

[surferguy]

Anybody watch this yet? Thoughts?

It certainly paints an alarming picture of how social media is rather harmful - which I fully recognize as being the bias in the documentary.

That said I think the show could garner a fair bit of discussion.

[CaptainCrunch]

I haven't watched it.



I'm torn on the whole idea of social media being harmful. I certainly don't believe that we have to have a program of censorship of social media by the government for example. The idea of the internet is access to information and self moderation by the community.


I believe that maybe we need to do a better job of teaching people critical thinking, social media self filtering and coping tools.


Plus if I want to look up the ingredients to create a back yard fusion reactor and the shopping lift of components and ingredients it should be a google search away man.

[surferguy]

I recommend taking it in Capn based on a few things you say here. It discusses that very notion of the good parts verses the bad parts. The bad parts being how we are being used and manipulated based on our data without us realizing our views are being skewed to be better able to advertise to us. It’s very interesting.

I’m hoping some more people can chime in with their views of it

[Ozy_Flame]

Watched it this morning, happy to see a post about it here.

I really enjoyed it, and would recommend. I think it speaks to a lot of what we already know/suspect about how these tech platforms operate, but to hear it from high profile people in the tech industry ('pioneers' if you will for some of them), it really hits home.

I genuinely believe they didn't know what they were going to create in the early days. It was more of, "let's see where this goes because the popularity is rising". Ironically I don't think they could have predicted the resulting long-term implications on society and democracy (I think economically they knew it would disrupt, just not sure how).

[Harry Lime]

An interesting possible solution brought up at the Senate committee meeting. Charge companies for data mining. Put a monetary number on the information that that can take from a person. It's scary how unprotected everybody is, and there is zero regulation.

[Raekwon]

If the product doesn't cost money then you are the product

[KTrain]

I watched it and, while it's all stuff I had basic knowledge of, it still frightened me to see it presented in one film.

This year I've been trying to actively push myself away from social media. I've removed most of the apps from my phone (Instagram is my only vice there) and I've blocked access to the sites at a router level during the day so I'm not distracted during work. It's definitely helped to stop the "doom scrolling" you do on Twitter and Facebook.

My wife, kids and I need to have watch it together now so we can make some decisions about their consumption of social media and how it might be affecting them.

That said, CP is another form of social media that you can tell a few people are addicted to and could use a break from.

[White Out 403]

incredible documentary that really everyone should be watching

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by KTrain

I watched it and, while it's all stuff I had basic knowledge of, it still frightened me to see it presented in one film.

This year I've been trying to actively push myself away from social media. I've removed most of the apps from my phone (Instagram is my only vice there) and I've blocked access to the sites at a router level during the day so I'm not distracted during work. It's definitely helped to stop the "doom scrolling" you do on Twitter and Facebook.

My wife, kids and I need to have watch it together now so we can make some decisions about their consumption of social media and how it might be affecting them.

That said, CP is another form of social media that you can tell a few people are addicted to and could use a break from.

I'm about halfway through the documentary, and I was thinking about places like CP and other forums, and I don't really think this bit is true, at least not in the way described in the film. With Facbook and Twitter, you get to select who you talk to, or see updates from, and the algorithms will also do that. There is active prompting, and tracking, and analyzing going on. So you are actively filtering what you see, and selecting only the things you like, at the same time the algorithms are doing it for you, but also feeding you stuff that you haven't selected, typically not to your benefit.

Around here, we are forced to interact with the people who are here. They are not necessarily our friends, or even people we would typically spend time with. You can't really unfriend those that say, love Trump, like you would on Facebook. Yes, you can ignore, but I don't think it is used much.

Perhaps the most dangerous feature here is the "thanks button", and if that is the worst of it, well, it's pretty innocuous. I think you need to separate interacting with people online form being force fed other people's thoughts and opinions, along with products and advertisements. Having meaningful interactions online isn't a bad thing, it's just a different way to discuss topics. Social media is an entirely different thing.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

incredible documentary that really everyone should be watching

No it isn’t.

It is a docudrama.

[KTrain]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

I'm about halfway through the documentary, and I was thinking about places like CP and other forums, and I don't really think this bit is true, at least not in the way described in the film. With Facbook and Twitter, you get to select who you talk to, or see updates from, and the algorithms will also do that. There is active prompting, and tracking, and analyzing going on. So you are actively filtering what you see, and selecting only the things you like, at the same time the algorithms are doing it for you, but also feeding you stuff that you haven't selected, typically not to your benefit.

Around here, we are forced to interact with the people who are here. They are not necessarily our friends, or even people we would typically spend time with. You can't really unfriend those that say, love Trump, like you would on Facebook. Yes, you can ignore, but I don't think it is used much.

Perhaps the most dangerous feature here is the "thanks button", and if that is the worst of it, well, it's pretty innocuous. I think you need to separate interacting with people online form being force fed other people's thoughts and opinions, along with products and advertisements. Having meaningful interactions online isn't a bad thing, it's just a different way to discuss topics. Social media is an entirely different thing.

Where I see the similarities of CP with other social media (Reddit specifically) is the addictiveness of the interactions and, sometimes, the group-think mentality.

CP is where many people find out about news first. Whether it's political, sports, entertainment, etc. That news isn't alway fact checked or information is cherry picked to support the posters view. Sure it could and usually is debunked or errors pointed out by other posters but that's not always the case.

Contrary opinions get piled on and I see forms of bullying happen all the time. If someone says something that's incorrect or is a personal opinion that might seem "out there", it doesn't take the next 10 posters to tell them so.

I also sometimes question the mental health of posters who are unable to let go of an argument. They keep coming back to get in their two cents. If they didn't have this forum, would they just transfer that mentality to something else or would they be a little more relaxed because they didn't have this place to argue with someone?

You can't tell me that someone who posts on here 20-30 times a day isn't a little addicted to the interaction here?

I've spoken to 4 or 5 CPers in the real world, who have said they've had to take breaks from the site because they waste too much time here or the constant negativity is causing it to lose the fun or that they can't stop going to threads they know are just going to piss them off (usually the political stuff).

While CP doesn't force things on you the way other forms of social media do, it can be addictive and is a form of social media.

[Weitz]

I'm about a half hour in last night and I would say its pretty meh so far. Nothing new or groundbreaking.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by KTrain

Where I see the similarities of CP with other social media (Reddit specifically) is the addictiveness of the interactions and, sometimes, the group-think mentality.

CP is where many people find out about news first. Whether it's political, sports, entertainment, etc. That news isn't alway fact checked or information is cherry picked to support the posters view. Sure it could and usually is debunked or errors pointed out by other posters but that's not always the case.

Contrary opinions get piled on and I see forms of bullying happen all the time. If someone says something that's incorrect or is a personal opinion that might seem "out there", it doesn't take the next 10 posters to tell them so.

I also sometimes question the mental health of posters who are unable to let go of an argument. They keep coming back to get in their two cents. If they didn't have this forum, would they just transfer that mentality to something else or would they be a little more relaxed because they didn't have this place to argue with someone?

You can't tell me that someone who posts on here 20-30 times a day isn't a little addicted to the interaction here?

I've spoken to 4 or 5 CPers in the real world, who have said they've had to take breaks from the site because they waste too much time here or the constant negativity is causing it to lose the fun or that they can't stop going to threads they know are just going to piss them off (usually the political stuff).

While CP doesn't force things on you the way other forms of social media do, it can be addictive and is a form of social media.

I think both have different issues. Most people post news from legitimate sources, and if they don't, they get called out pretty quick. Nobody could legitimately post about the flat earth here, because they'd get ridiculed. Is that group think? I think that's more self-regulating, something the social media giants suffer from because they steer you to groups of people with similar views. You want to believe in flat earth? Here's a hundred videos and friend groups of them, enjoy the conversation! I find that far more dangerous.

Yes, there is the potentially addictive nature, but there is no direction from the forum guiding posters, other than the rules. CP doesn't track which threads you visit, and point you to ones that it thinks you might like. It isn't manipulating you. Anything can be addictive, be it video games, or gambling, or running, or watching and discussing sports. All can be done in moderated ways that are healthy, but taken to far, are dangerous.

So I guess the difference is on forums you aren't being manipulated behind the scenes by algorithms that have been designed to create addiction. As mentioned in the show, these systems aren't going to get worse at it, only better.

[Harry Lime]

Originally Posted by Weitz

I'm about a half hour in last night and I would say its pretty meh so far. Nothing new or groundbreaking.

AI controls humans and topples governments.....YAWNNNNN.

omg i just figured out that Weitz is a sentient smart phone that is going to kill us

[curves2000]

I read a book years ago called "How to survive modern technology" by Dr. Charles T McGree. It's not so much a tech book as a book describing some of the advancements we have made over the years in life and how it has affected our general health. Think food processing, automobiles, lifestyle etc. It was published in the 70's so its not really a computer based book.

Long story short I am one of the few younger people (35) who doesn't have social media but we are really starting to see a lot of the negative health affects of this.

There is an explosion of depression, anxiety, OCD, lack of concentration, FOMO, fighting online and a whole host of other things going on these days.

I just don't think people realize to the extent that life has really changed with a lot of this stuff, its scary and its getting worse. The level of fakeness and the extent that people are going to do things for their online profile and presence is baffling and completely foreign to other generations before us.

People spending an insane amount of time trying to get the perfect shot for their instagram, moving an item here, changing an angle there, changing lighting and taking how many pictures? All this so that they can post a picture of........their breakfast consisting of some coffee and a breakfast sandwich as if they are unique in that regard.

It's even gotten to the point where porn has been completely changed but people's comfort level online and wanting to be famous. People sometimes forget that porn production was literally professionals with full sets, directors, production crews and big name stars. Stars that were in a lot of ways kept in the dark from mainstream society. Very very few people were interested in having a career in porn.

Now? Porn sites are literally jam packed with people filming themselves having sex all over the place. Doesn't matter, young, old, ugly, beautiful. How comfortable would our parents, grandparents and other generations be at this ? The funny thing is that people like Paris Hilton and others became famous with their leaked sex tapes where only a short time later, the amount of people filming and posting is wild.

I am not judging anybody at all but I do think there is a normalization of specific behaviors in a very short period of time that isn't healthy. We can't continue to go down this exponential growth and changes without questioning things.

These devices and this technology is really affecting everybody in ways they don't even know!

[topfiverecords]

Well this show sure put me to sleep. Which is one way to keep people off social media.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Well this show sure put me to sleep. Which is one way to keep people off social media.

Yah I tried to finish it last night and fell asleep as well.

[Lil Pedro]

Thought it was pretty well done, very interesting documentary.

[The Yen Man]

I watched it last night. It was OK. It didn't really tell us anything we don't already know and have seen a ton of messaging on, to be honest.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

I watched it today, and thought it was fantastic. But I've thought a lot of what Tristan Harris has been doing since I saw his Ted talk a couple of years ago. This truly is one of the more pressing existential threats to society.