Special Teams 2018-2019

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Red

Predictions time?

Lets hear them.

I predict that Czarnik will not be a regular and will not have more than 15 - 20 points this season.

Why would you basically be rooting for the guy to fail?
Again do you care more about being right or him doing well?
Seems like the former

[Calgary4LIfe]

Don't understand some of the outrage over potentially using Czarnik on the PP.


He may or may not be there. What we do know are these points:


1) Flames scouted him heavily and flew their GM and head coach to speak with Czarnik, and even showed Czarnik some of the potential line combos that he would find himself in.
2) 23 other teams expressed interest in this kid. Czarnik picked Calgary.. why? Because that was such a high dollar contract? Or was it because Calgary showed him the potential opportunity he would get in Calgary?
3) Czarnik is a RHS. Lindholm will definitely be on one of the two PP units, but who is the other? Brouwer? Ryan? Neither have strong PP numbers. That one time shot from the slot is an option that would help create for a more dynamic PP.


I don't see why a couple of posters are getting so worked up. Hey, if he fails, he fails and that will be the end of that. I would bet my account here that unless Czarnik walks into pre-season unfit or unprofessional, or performs very poorly, that he would get a look at one of the PP units and see how he fits.



However, I guess I am no better than other fans from different teams if I think Czarnik will get a look on the PP.

[Red]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Why would you basically be rooting for the guy to fail?
Again do you care more about being right or him doing well?
Seems like the former

I am not.
Seriously?

Short and 160lbs
25 years old
5 carreer goals
Not signed by original team

Am I missing something?

The guy kind of looks like a long shot.

Here is the thing. How many 24-25 year olds that size have made the bigs after going ufa?

So if we talk about odds here, who has an advantage?

I really see it as a cheap way of getting a potential player. But its highly unlikely that he will be more than a depth or an up and down player. I think the odds are on my side.

It has nothing to do with winning an argument or not liking the guy. I am on board with signing him. I just think that pencilling him as a regular is premature. Like the oiler fans and Yamamoto.

[Stay Golden]

In the preseason games Czarnik definatly will get PP time. I think he catches the attention of the coaches in a positive way and earns a longer look.

[Red]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

Don't understand some of the outrage over potentially using Czarnik on the PP.


He may or may not be there. What we do know are these points:


1) Flames scouted him heavily and flew their GM and head coach to speak with Czarnik, and even showed Czarnik some of the potential line combos that he would find himself in.
2) 23 other teams expressed interest in this kid. Czarnik picked Calgary.. why? Because that was such a high dollar contract? Or was it because Calgary showed him the potential opportunity he would get in Calgary?
3) Czarnik is a RHS. Lindholm will definitely be on one of the two PP units, but who is the other? Brouwer? Ryan? Neither have strong PP numbers. That one time shot from the slot is an option that would help create for a more dynamic PP.


I don't see why a couple of posters are getting so worked up. Hey, if he fails, he fails and that will be the end of that. I would bet my account here that unless Czarnik walks into pre-season unfit or unprofessional, or performs very poorly, that he would get a look at one of the PP units and see how he fits.



However, I guess I am no better than other fans from different teams if I think Czarnik will get a look on the PP.

Again. Some PP time to try? Sure. Thats what the preseason is for.

Read the 'guarantee' post on pg1? That is what I have a problem with.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Red

Short and 160lbs
25 years old
5 carreer goals
Not signed by original team

Am I missing something?

The guy kind of looks like a long shot.

Here is the thing. How many 24-25 year olds that size have made the bigs after going ufa?

I don’t know the odds, and yeah they are probably slim, but Martin St. Louis comes to mind.

[spuzzum]

I'm curious for his development path why he had 49 games with the Bruins in 16-17 followed by only 10 in 17-18? Did the Bruins get deeper at C or RW?

We're basically looking at a 25 year old with 3 AHL seasons at essentially a PPG pace. 59 games with 5 goals and 17 points. The dude made the AHL All Star team this past season.

The dude is relatively small at 5'9 and 160 lbs. Is he super fast or does he have good play making abilities / goal scoring sense?

Looking at his resume and age, he's entitled to nothing for ice time, being on the PP or even making the team. I'm not too sure what the excitement is about.

If the Flames found a diamond in the rough, wonderful. No different than any other year GMs trying to hit home runs with late draft round projects.

[AustinL_NHL]

Originally Posted by Red

Outrage? Lol. It's a discussion forum.

Its called not being a moron and expecting every new shiny toy to be a star.
I care about a place where one can have a conversation without people talking nonsense. Read the posts from Austin and tell me you agree with him. You tell me that im wrong in curbing his expectation, which BTW he says is a guarantee. Just go to pg1.

I am excited to have a crack at TESTING Czarnik. But im not expecting him to be a full time player with tons of PP time. Becasue that would be a pretty dumb statement to make about a 25 yesr old with 5 goals to his carreer. No?

But yet, here we are....

Super strange how I could say he could play awful in the NHL and quickly flame out and at the same time also guarantee he'll be a star, which I guess all top 9 forwards who play on the PP (which I said will be his case to start out) are now considered stars.

Your posts provide lots of humor, which give me lots of joy

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Red

Based on?

I'm not doing the work for you. You made the claim. Go look at their numbers Red. Czarnik has better numbers than Bill Arnold at every level, and then once they turned pro it's no contest....Czarnik by a landslide.

Czarnik's AHL numbers are better than Marchessault's were at the same age.

I don't even know why you pulled Bill Arnold's name out of your ass anyways. Not even close to comparable players.

[bax]

Originally Posted by Red

I am not.

Seriously?



Short and 160lbs

25 years old

5 carreer goals

Not signed by original team



Am I missing something?



The guy kind of looks like a long shot.



Here is the thing. How many 24-25 year olds that size have made the bigs after going ufa?



So if we talk about odds here, who has an advantage?



I really see it as a cheap way of getting a potential player. But its highly unlikely that he will be more than a depth or an up and down player. I think the odds are on my side.



It has nothing to do with winning an argument or not liking the guy. I am on board with signing him. I just think that pencilling him as a regular is premature. Like the oiler fans and Yamamoto.

Why do you keep comparing Czarnik to much younger prospects that have zero pro experience? It honestly makes no sense.

[Red]

Originally Posted by bax

Why do you keep comparing Czarnik to much younger prospects that have zero pro experience? It honestly makes no sense.

I am comparing delusional Flames delusional Oilers fans actually.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Red

I am comparing delusional Flames delusional Oilers fans actually.

Delusional and morons
Oh a roll

[Red]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I'm not doing the work for you. You made the claim. Go look at their numbers Red. Czarnik has better numbers than Bill Arnold at every level, and then once they turned pro it's no contest....Czarnik by a landslide.

Czarnik's AHL numbers are better than Marchessault's were at the same age.

I don't even know why you pulled Bill Arnold's name out of your ass anyways. Not even close to comparable players.

He is very much comparable. UFA hopeful trying to get on an NHL team.

Both are long shots.

[Jiri Hrdina]

When was bill Arnold a ufa?

[Red]

Originally Posted by AustinL_NHL

Super strange how I could say he could play awful in the NHL and quickly flame out and at the same time also guarantee he'll be a star, which I guess all top 9 forwards who play on the PP (which I said will be his case to start out) are now considered stars.

Your posts provide lots of humor, which give me lots of joy

Wow. You yourself made a rediculous claim that he was guaranteed this and that. You disagreed with a person telling you to cool with your expectations.

Read your own post, you pretty much proclaimed him a roster player.

[Red]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

When was bill Arnold a ufa?

He wasnt. My bad. I guess this discredits all of my exisrance here, right?
P
Point stands, both are long shots. All teams have a bunch of these guys and very few make it. Almost none are guaranteed ice and PP.

What are you arguing about exactly?

Do you agree that Czarnik will be a top 9 regular and a PP regular? Yes or no?

[Jiri Hrdina]

I don’t know much about him but given the number of teams that were in pursuit sure why not
The point about Arnold is that he shares nothing in common with this player
So using him as a comparison point is just weird

[Red]

I use many prospects to compare because we get all giddy about them until they become 20, 22 - and dissapear to our disappointment.
This guy is 25. A definition of a long shot. Yet some put him on the top line and in this thread he is a top 9 with PP time.
How is this guy a better bet than Mangipane (yes another hopeful)?
Dont see anyone guaranteening Mangipane a top 9 spot. Not a new shiny toy?

I just dont get the hype. And definetely dont get those so upset that I put doubt on his guy.
But just step back and ask yourself. A tiny 25 year old with 0 success at this level is seen as a regular top 9 player for the Flames. Reasonable or delusional? Which way does the needle move?

[bax]

Originally Posted by Red

He wasnt. My bad. I guess this discredits all of my exisrance here, right?
P
Point stands, both are long shots. All teams have a bunch of these guys and very few make it. Almost none are guaranteed ice and PP.

What are you arguing about exactly?

Do you agree that Czarnik will be a top 9 regular and a PP regular? Yes or no?

You're not even making sense anymore. So far in this thread you have compared Czarnik to Foo, Yamamoto, and Arnold, despite no similarities between those players and their situations. You have mentioned that every teams has a player like Czarnik (why did 24 teams reach out to him?). You have moved the goal posts from "let's see if he makes the NHL" to "being a top 9 forward with PP ice time". You have called people delusional and morons, yet you ignore every piece of evidence that has been thrown your way.

It's okay to doubt a player and think he won't succeed. There is no harm there, but you appear to have a very large misunderstanding of the situation here. You keep claiming that people think he will be a star, which isn't the case at all.

If he breaks out, people are expecting 30-45 points of depth scoring. Nothing outrageous. People are pencilling him into the line up and on the second PP unit because Treliving and Peters have all but confirmed he will get those opportunities.

If it works out, great. If it doesn't than no harm no foul. Nobody has said he is a sure thing. I have no idea why you are so hell bent on him being an AHL player.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Doesn’t have to be so binary
Reasonable or delusional?
I don’t view it as being that black and white
It isn’t about you not feeling he will be an impact player or the level of outrage you have towards that are more optimistic when you clearly know zero about the player
I have no idea if he’ll be successful but I’m not going to slam those that are excited