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Old 12-04-2022, 11:26 PM   #541
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Phillips will get his chance. I don't understand why folks are freaking out about this.

He's a good prospect, who also isn't the magical answer to the team's issues. Folks were freaking out about kylington last year too but sutter knew what he was doing there, and I don't see any reason to freak out about other prospects.
I'm not 100% sold Phillips will be anything, but the major difference between Phillips and Kylington is that Phillips is 100% gone if we don't figure out what he is this season. So the fan frustration is "we're having trouble scoring, we have a prospect that's leading the AHL in scoring, how in the **** is that not worth sitting one of our four plugs for a week or two to see how Philips plays on the Flames?".

We've put all this work into him, if you give him a cup of coffee in February due to a short injury then you may as well call up someone else as Phillips will be gone from the organization if that's all he gets.
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Old 12-04-2022, 11:31 PM   #542
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And I'm with TheScorpion, I also contest the motto "You either bring a scoring prospect up to the top 6 or you don't bring him up at all".

Why is 8-10 minutes seen as this detrimental ice time distribution for a farm/prospect scorer? It's literally how Mangiapane was utilized when he was breaking in and he took it and sailed. And especially on a Sutter team. Its like what, 7-8 minutes less than a star forward in ice time on the Flames?
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Old 12-05-2022, 12:20 AM   #543
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Philips certainly has NHL skill. No one doubts that. Can he up his speed to NHL levels though. Thatís the only thing other than his size that I think would hold him back. He needs to come up and work with the big club. Hes maxed out in the A
Phillips is not slow, he may not have straight line race horse speed but he's very quick,has elite acceleration and has great edgework. his overall skating would be top half in the NHL.

The only thing holding him back is size, which is dumb in todays NHL.
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Old 12-05-2022, 12:50 AM   #544
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Listening to a Sutter interview a few days ago more or less addressing this I can’t see Phillips getting a shot.

He essentially downplayed Phillips accomplishments in the AHL saying it’s night and day from the NHL.
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Old 12-05-2022, 01:00 AM   #545
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Phillips is not slow, he may not have straight line race horse speed but he's very quick,has elite acceleration and has great edgework. his overall skating would be top half in the NHL.

The only thing holding him back is size, which is dumb in todays NHL.
Looks like an absolute pest on the forecheck too.

Created a turnover in a recent game that lead to a score. Size doesn't hold him back
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Old 12-05-2022, 06:38 AM   #546
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I wonder if the fact that he can go auto Ufa at end of season is keeping him held down too. It would be a super ####ty thing to do, but Brad may be the type to value his image/job and doesn't want to get walked by a high performing Ufa again. So instead he's just not giving him a chance.

This makes more sense to me than believing this guy doesn't have a chance at this point.
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Old 12-05-2022, 06:53 AM   #547
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Originally Posted by jayswin View Post
And I'm with TheScorpion, I also contest the motto "You either bring a scoring prospect up to the top 6 or you don't bring him up at all".

Why is 8-10 minutes seen as this detrimental ice time distribution for a farm/prospect scorer? It's literally how Mangiapane was utilized when he was breaking in and he took it and sailed. And especially on a Sutter team. Its like what, 7-8 minutes less than a star forward in ice time on the Flames?
I agree with this is as well. I'd rather have a guy who's average at defending who can get the puck out of the defensive zone than a guy who's a guru at defending but is constantly hemmed in his end because he handles the puck like a grenade. We clearly need to score more goals. Goals scored by the 4th line count as much as goals scored by the 1st line.

We have the same problem we had in previous Sutter eras where we have a bunch of old guys on the 4th line. They are responsible, etc, but you need a mix of these guys and guys who can bring energy and spark, guys who play every shift like it could be their last in the NHL.
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Old 12-05-2022, 07:37 AM   #548
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I wonder if the fact that he can go auto Ufa at end of season is keeping him held down too. It would be a super ####ty thing to do, but Brad may be the type to value his image/job and doesn't want to get walked by a high performing Ufa again. So instead he's just not giving him a chance.

This makes more sense to me than believing this guy doesn't have a chance at this point.
So Treliving has a vanity issue, and he's protecting his image with a 24 year old AHL UFA over what he thinks is best for his hockey team?

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Old 12-05-2022, 07:46 AM   #549
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This discussion is getting ridiculous.

Brad is not going to call-up a player unless there is an injury. He's saving cap for the trade deadline. If any forward is injured I'm sure Phillips is the first call-up.

People just need to be patient.
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Old 12-05-2022, 08:02 AM   #550
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So Treliving has a vanity issue, and he's protecting his image with a 24 year old AHL UFA over what he thinks is best for his hockey team?

Maybe it's the club in general. Maybe it's an owner.

There's definitely a vanity issue with the franchise.
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Old 12-05-2022, 08:10 AM   #551
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Maybe it's the club in general. Maybe it's an owner.

There's definitely a vanity issue with the franchise.
Maybe ... Maybe and then Definitely huh?
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Old 12-05-2022, 08:22 AM   #552
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Listening to a Sutter interview a few days ago more or less addressing this I canít see Phillips getting a shot.

He essentially downplayed Phillips accomplishments in the AHL saying itís night and day from the NHL.
I suspect he's saying that so fans temper expectations, not as a slight to Phillips.

Phillips isnt going to get called up to play 4th line minutes. It's p clear that the 4th line has a role, and I dont think Phillips strengths play into that role. Eventually we will lose a top 9 winger and Phillips will be recalled. It's a long season.

And when Phillips does get recalled everyone needs to not expect the kid to come up and light the world on fire, or fix a lot of our problems.

With that said, when Phillips does get his opportunity, he's got to find a way to make the most of it. Otherwise he will get lost in the shuffle.
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Old 12-05-2022, 08:28 AM   #553
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So Treliving has a vanity issue, and he's protecting his image with a 24 year old AHL UFA over what he thinks is best for his hockey team?

Yeah he's probably being as hands off as possible here letting Darryl do his thing. He's in a situation where he sees no point in bringing in a forward the coach may not play and I don't think he's going to force him on the coach.
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Old 12-05-2022, 08:28 AM   #554
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This discussion is getting ridiculous.

Brad is not going to call-up a player unless there is an injury. He's saving cap for the trade deadline. If any forward is injured I'm sure Phillips is the first call-up.

People just need to be patient.
sounds like we need a little Nancy Kerrigan incident or two
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Old 12-05-2022, 08:29 AM   #555
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Maybe ... Maybe and then Definitely huh?
Ok Mr. Pedant pants in the house this morning. Someone feeling chipper today eh?

I think its pretty clear the franchise has a longstanding vanity problem. Heres a quick hit list of all the instances i can think of top of head, but many more are there too:

Constantly threatening to move the team when you don't get your way. Always pumping out how it's about the process but never winning a damn thing. Always talking about big plans but never actually prepared for big moments (botched calgary next proposal, botched presentation to Johnny gaudreau for big contract). Putting all their focus on a massive real estate vanity deal that required enormous environmental cleanup with no concept on how to pay the bill. Notably passing on giving chances to guys because of size, even while the franchise has some of the most notable undersized performers in history. Focusing for years on drafting giants with pea brains because size is best and we're the west... etc.
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Old 12-05-2022, 08:33 AM   #556
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Yeah he's probably being as hands off as possible here letting Darryl do his thing. He's in a situation where he sees no point in bringing in a forward the coach may not play and I don't think he's going to force him on the coach.
Yeah I could see the GM steering things if he has a first time coach behind the bench and lots of experience himself.

But with Sutter's experience, and personality there's no way he's in charge of the day to day roster.
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Old 12-05-2022, 08:35 AM   #557
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Ok Mr. Pedant pants in the house this morning. Someone feeling chipper today eh?

I think its pretty clear the franchise has a longstanding vanity problem. Heres a quick hit list of all the instances i can think of top of head, but many more are there too:

Constantly threatening to move the team when you don't get your way. Always pumping out how it's about the process but never winning a damn thing. Always talking about big plans but never actually prepared for big moments (botched calgary next proposal, botched presentation to Johnny gaudreau for big contract). Putting all their focus on a massive real estate vanity deal that required enormous environmental cleanup with no concept on how to pay the bill. Notably passing on giving chances to guys because of size, even while the franchise has some of the most notable undersized performers in history. Focusing for years on drafting giants with pea brains because size is best and we're the west... etc.
The bolted is literally conflicting itself.

Most of that is opinion not fact ... I posted a list of players 5'11" and under drafted in the past few drafts on the weekend.

You don't like the team. Get it.
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Old 12-05-2022, 08:48 AM   #558
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I don't think Monahammer's post contradicts itself.
The organization has a long history of drafting/signing quality small player.

But certain coaches have passed on playing/developing these players.

For that reason, these players have been passed on, but the organization has also had notable undersized performers.

And he just said that the organization has a long history of elite small players. Sounds like someone who likes the team, at least to me.
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Old 12-05-2022, 09:11 AM   #559
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I don't think Monahammer's post contradicts itself.
The organization has a long history of drafting/signing quality small player.

But certain coaches have passed on playing/developing these players.

For that reason, these players have been passed on, but the organization has also had notable undersized performers.

And he just said that the organization has a long history of elite small players. Sounds like someone who likes the team, at least to me.
You don't see a contradiction between being a franchise with a long history of elite small players, but also being against small players because of vanity?

Which is it?

None of the things Monahammer listed was evidence of a franchise with a vanity issue. It was simply a bunch of things Monahammer doesn't like. And he's trying to create a villain to justify his dislike
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Old 12-05-2022, 09:19 AM   #560
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I think we are the point that if Phillips does get a recall, Sutter will probably bury him and have him sent down the next day.
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