[Rumour] LeBrun: Flames have interest in Toffoli (and other RHS top 6 forwards)

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

The thing is then Treliving needs to make a deal for a #6 Dman. Probably cost a mid round pick? Calgary can’t afford to go into the post season with Stone as a regular imo.

I think you could likely get Ceci as part of the deal if that makes it better. He's an overpaid rental so very low cost. Wasn't he OK in Ottawa?

Or you make a deal for a 6.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

The thing is then Treliving needs to make a deal for a #6 Dman. Probably cost a mid round pick? Calgary can’t afford to go into the post season with Stone as a regular imo.

Sure they can. Mike Stone is going to play 10-12 minutes a night as the #6 and won't be the reason this group doesn't advance.

He's functional. What else do you want from a #6D?

[Harry Lime]

Alternating between Stone and Yelesin on the right side, with Davidson there in case of injury is fine depth. All made possible by the emergence of Kylington. He doesn't have to be sheltered anymore, although he's not ready for big minutes, either.

Hamonic is expendable. Kapanen is in the corner, waving his hands, yelling, "pick me! pick me!". Toffoli is a back up plan.

[GioforPM]

Also, there’s a decent chance Valimaki is good for the POs.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Crown Royal

Kaberle was a significant acquisition at the time, it cost Boston a 1st and a top prospect. He never did what was hoped, but he was absolutely a significant addition.

He was average in terms of performance. The price paid was significant. The impact not as much. Regardless if that is the best and only example over the last decade then I think point proven.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

Alternating between Stone and Yelesin on the right side, with Davidson there in case of injury is fine depth. All made possible by the emergence of Kylington. He doesn't have to be sheltered anymore, although he's not ready for big minutes, either.

Hamonic is expendable. Kapanen is in the corner, waving his hands, yelling, "pick me! pick me!". Toffoli is a back up plan.

While i think Hamonic in a trade for Kapanen makes sense for both teams, I don't think TO would do it straight across. Kapanen is young and on a cost controlled contract. Hamonic is a UFA. Not sure what Calgary would have to add? Hamonic and a 2nd for Kapanen?

[Toonage]

Look at it this way. If others teams find out Kapanen is available, are any of them likely to offer up a 1st round pick - something Toronto doesn't have this year?

My guess is yes. So there is what Toronto would likely want added.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Look at it this way. If others teams find out Kapanen is available, are any of them likely to offer up a 1st round pick - something Toronto doesn't have this year?

My guess is yes. So there is what Toronto would likely want added.

Toronto needs a legit NHL defenseman more than it needs a 1st at the moment. The team is in win now mode but its laughably thin D core has been decimated by injury. And nobody is offering a legit top 4 D and a 1st for Kapanen.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Look at it this way. If others teams find out Kapanen is available, are any of them likely to offer up a 1st round pick - something Toronto doesn't have this year?

My guess is yes. So there is what Toronto would likely want added.

I'm sure they are aware. Of course, said other team has to be in the right position, similar to Calgary - an ability to offer defensive help, an ability to take the Kapanen cap hit going forward, in a PO position but tenuous enough such that they need Kapanen.

I do think the contract different is significant, though perhaps Hamonic as a rental appeals to Toronto because he's not a cap issue going forward after this year (and is likely to sign a decent contract if they offer it).

People dump on Hamonic here, but he'd be one of their best defensive defencemen. He's been pretty good the last few games, if you watch what he does and not just the plays where things don't work out. He block and deflects a lot of shots, blocks out forwards a lot, wins more than his fair share of puck battles. I don't think he's in sync with Hanifin this year and therein lies the duo's issues (and the forwards haven't helped).

[kukkudo]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Hamonic for Kapanen, lesser/conditional pick/prospect for Toffoli

Tkachuk-Lindholm-Kapanen
Gaudreau-Monahan-Toffoli
Bennett-Backlund-Mangiapane
Lucic-Ryan-Dube

Gio-Brodie
Hanifin-Andersson
Kylington-Stone

Thats a nice group add in Gerard Gallant and the Flames could make some noise.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Hamonic for Kapanen, lesser/conditional pick/prospect for Toffoli

Tkachuk-Lindholm-Kapanen
Gaudreau-Monahan-Toffoli
Bennett-Backlund-Mangiapane
Lucic-Ryan-Dube

Gio-Brodie
Hanifin-Andersson
Kylington-Stone

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I would be very happy with that forward group

Originally Posted by kukkudo

Thats a nice group add in Gerard Gallant and the Flames could make some noise.

I think it gives you 1A, 1B, 3A, 3B lines. I also think your defence won't suffer (and I still like Hamonic but you have to give to get). I also think those trades work with perhaps some tinkering.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I think it gives you 1A, 1B, 3A, 3B lines.

More like 2A and 2B lines, and 4A and 4B lines.

Other than Ryan, no one in your bottom 6 is scoring anything these days.

Although I expect we all hope that the addition of the 2 new wingers will propel the fist two lines into something more like their production last year.

That would make them closer to 1A and 1B. Their production would ultimately determine Calgary's fortunes this year.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

More like 2A and 2B lines, and 4A and 4B lines.

Other than Ryan, no one in your bottom 6 is scoring anything these days.

Although I expect we all hope that the addition of the 2 new wingers will propel the fist two lines into something more like their production last year.

That would make them closer to 1A and 1B. Their production would ultimately determine Calgary's fortunes this year.

Well, I included the new players into my consideration. And I suspect that Backlund at C with Mangiapane contribute some goals. Also Dube is a goal scorer - wait and see.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

More like 2A and 2B lines, and 4A and 4B lines.

Other than Ryan, no one in your bottom 6 is scoring anything these days.

Although I expect we all hope that the addition of the 2 new wingers will propel the fist two lines into something more like their production last year.

That would make them closer to 1A and 1B. Their production would ultimately determine Calgary's fortunes this year.

I get scoring is down this year but now Tkachuk, Lindholm, Monahan, Gaudreau are all second liners?

Backlund, Ryan, Mangipane are 4th liners?

Or are the wings they are paired with so bad they drag them down?

For the top 6 I agree with Gio4PM’s take I think those would be 2 lines closer to number 1 lines. I am okay with the Ryan line being a very good 4th line and I think that Backlund unit could be an average to above average 3rd line.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Well, I included the new players into my consideration. And I suspect that Backlund at C with Mangiapane contribute some goals. Also Dube is a goal scorer - wait and see.

Well, this year, Backlund hasn't been producing much offense in a top 6 role, same for Mangi.

Dube is a goal scorer in the minors getting top 6 minutes. He's done little offensively in the bottom 6.

At the end of the day, the Flames offense from the bottom 6 is likely as responsible for their large deficit in goal differential as the top 6 decreased production.

it's been a total team effort, and will require a total team effort to improve.

I agree that adding 2 new top 6 players is a step in the right direction.

But I'll need to see those results before I anoint the team with 2 first lines and 2 3rd lines, which is generally what the top Stanley Cup contenders have going for them.

[FlamesLitSquad]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I think it gives you 1A, 1B, 3A, 3B lines. I also think your defence won't suffer (and I still like Hamonic but you have to give to get). I also think those trades work with perhaps some tinkering.

GioforPM for GM?


If that is doable it looks like a contender - sure we would have a bit of a hole on D but Stone is serviceable in a sheltered 3rd pairing role and Hanafin and Hamonic doesn't seem to gel anyhow.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Well, this year, Backlund hasn't been producing much offense in a top 6 role, same for Mangi.

Dube is a goal scorer in the minors getting top 6 minutes. He's done little offensively in the bottom 6.

At the end of the day, the Flames offense from the bottom 6 is likely as responsible for their large deficit in goal differential as the top 6 decreased production.

it's been a total team effort, and will require a total team effort to improve.

I agree that adding 2 new top 6 players is a step in the right direction.

But I'll need to see those results before I anoint the team with 2 first lines and 2 3rd lines, which is generally what the top Stanley Cup contenders have going for them.

You are looking at this year where players aren't slotted optimally. Backlund will produce more from the centre. Mangiapane - fair enough, though I suspect he's going to be a lot like Frolik, who produced enough to be called a good 3rd line winger at the very least.

And Dube is going to produce. You can just tell. He's got 4 goals, 10 points in 26 games at age 21, in his first real season in the NHL. That's something like a 32 point pace and he's only getting better. It's 4 times his goals and double his points from last year.

Sure, results are what determines it, but I don't think anyone in the league thinks Tkachuk, Lindholm, Gaudreau and Monahan are "second line" NHLers, no matter what this year's stats say.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by FlamesLitSquad

GioforPM for GM?


If that is doable it looks like a contender - sure we would have a bit of a hole on D but Stone is serviceable in a sheltered 3rd pairing role and Hanafin and Hamonic doesn't seem to gel anyhow.

I think Hamonic is being severley overvalued in this situation. The Leafs would surely be looking for (and receiving) offers that include more than what a pending UFA in Hamonic brings to the table in exchange for a controllable 23 year old offensive winger in Kapanen, that is only trending up.

I'm all for going after him, but it is certainly going to be a far higher cost that includes a notable pick or significant prospect as well.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by New Era

Czarnik is not a NHL player.

I wouldn't go that far. I think he's a clear 12/13 guy, but with his size there are other options.

But yeah he's not the answer.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

I think Hamonic is being severley overvalued in this situation. The Leafs would surely be looking for (and receiving) offers that include more than what a pending UFA in Hamonic brings to the table in exchange for a controllable 23 year old offensive winger that is only trending up.

I'm all for going after him, but it is certainly going to be a far higher cost.

I don't think the price is "far" more, but if you have to add it won't be anyone you miss. It'll be prospects or a lower pick. Like I said before, not every team will be interested, not every team can afford to give a useful defenceman, not every team is in the right window for Kapanen. And some are teams that they'd probably rather not trade with, like divisional rivals.

Leafs are desperate for D. We can accommodate that.