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Old 03-19-2017, 02:38 PM   #21
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Couldn't help but think how 20 years ago the Red Wings and Avalanche was a premir match up. Yesterday it's the bottom feeder from each Confrence....with the Devils mixed in. The three headed dynasty that won 8 cups in a 9 year stretch from 1995 to 2003.
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Old 03-19-2017, 02:40 PM   #22
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Couldn't help but think how 20 years ago the Red Wings and Avalanche was a premir match up. Yesterday it's the bottom feeder from each Confrence....with the Devils mixed in. The three headed dynasty that won 8 cups in a 9 year stretch from 1995 to 2003.
Finally paying for all the past success like the Oilers have been for so long now.
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Old 03-19-2017, 02:42 PM   #23
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Just like the rank the Canadian teams thread I'm pretty sure there is a thing called the standings that answers this.

What I'm interested in is how does this Avs team rank on the list of all time worst teams? If you don't count expansion teams in their first three seasons I'm thinking at least top 5, maybe even 2nd behind the Penguins team that tanked for Mario.
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Old 03-19-2017, 03:00 PM   #24
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Finally paying for all the past success like the Oilers have been for so long now.
The Avs are the puzzler though with many high picks and potential front line players but somehow none of it is working. They are the WDF team of the NHL
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Old 03-19-2017, 03:04 PM   #25
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I think it's had to overstate just how awful the Avs are this year. I'm only in my early 30s, but I think they're the worst team I've ever seen since as long as I've been following the NHL.

In an era where the difference from first to last is probably as small as its ever been, they're this strange outlier that looks like they belong in a different league. How competitive would they even be in the AHL?

I feel like we're watching a historic season for them. It's like the rough equivalent of the president's trophy winner finishing with 135 points. You might not see it again in your life. I bet Vegas next year is significantly better than these Avs.
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Old 03-19-2017, 03:08 PM   #26
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Finally paying for all the past success like the Oilers have been for so long now.
Hopefully the same fate occurs for the current trivecta of Chicago, Pittsburgh, and LA that's owned the cup since 2009.

Really it's remarkable how the league is pretty much where it was 15 years ago today. No offence and pretty much being dominated by the same group of teams every year.
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Old 03-19-2017, 03:15 PM   #27
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1. Edmonton
2. Edmonton
3. Edmonton
4. Edmonton
5. Edmonton

My list is not up for debate.
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Old 03-19-2017, 03:20 PM   #28
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03-04 Hawks: 20 wins
05-06 Blues: 21 wins
06-07 Flyers: 22 wins
03-04 Caps: 23 wins
03-04 Pens: 23 wins

Those 5 teams don't even rank in the top 15 worst ever. The Avs collapse (lol), while bad, isn't that bad

The 3 worst teams ever are tied with 8 wins
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Old 03-19-2017, 03:43 PM   #29
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Pretty crazy that Detroit is in that conversation. Didn't know if I'd ever see the day.
In 1986, Detroit was dead last trailing second last by 14 points. They were brutal.
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Old 03-19-2017, 03:45 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by JiriHrdina View Post
The Avs are the puzzler though with many high picks and potential front line players but somehow none of it is working. They are the WDF team of the NHL
See Edmonton over the past decade. Skill doesn't mean anything if all you have are a bunch of z shaped tetris blocks.

As it is, if the Oilers don't move Hall out and finally add D in Larsson, they would firmly be on this list.
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Old 03-19-2017, 03:51 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by doctajones428 View Post
03-04 Hawks: 20 wins
05-06 Blues: 21 wins
06-07 Flyers: 22 wins
03-04 Caps: 23 wins
03-04 Pens: 23 wins

Those 5 teams don't even rank in the top 15 worst ever. The Avs collapse (lol), while bad, isn't that bad

The 3 worst teams ever are tied with 8 wins
A year or two after the Oilers' SCF appearance in 2006, they had a stretch of 70+ games, where if you removed Shootout wins, (keeping OT wins), they only had 8 wins.

Had the shootout not been in place, as if it was a couple years earlier, they would have been right up there in the worst seasons of all time.
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Old 03-19-2017, 03:53 PM   #32
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Who needs the worst season of all time when you can have the 'worst decade of all time'!
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Old 03-19-2017, 04:08 PM   #33
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I know it's been said before, but, with New Jersey looking like they're a long way from contention, I really hope the flames are in the mix when Schneider becomes available
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Old 03-19-2017, 07:49 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by Lanny'sDaMan View Post
1. Edmonton
2. Edmonton
3. Edmonton
4. Edmonton
5. Edmonton

My list is not up for debate.
Kind of was the point of my earlier post, existentially, I have Edmonton, Vancouver, and Detroit (which sucks!) perpetually on my "worst" list, no matter where they are in the standings.
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Old 03-19-2017, 09:24 PM   #35
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I would feel bad for my Avs fan buddies, but I hate the Avs.
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Old 03-19-2017, 09:40 PM   #36
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I remember this saying though: Detroit has 2 Chevy in the garage but don't know which one will start.

But I can only remember one is Cheveldae.....couldn't recall who's the other one is, I was too young
Alain Chevrier, I believe. The two were playing for Detroit for a while in 1990-91.

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/l...000341991.html
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Old 03-19-2017, 09:57 PM   #37
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1. Edmonton
2. Edmonton
3. Edmonton
4. Edmonton
5. Edmonton

My list is not up for debate.
Came here to post the same list.

Minus McHolyone, the Oilers are still terrible. A lottery is the only reason they improved at all. Disgraceful franchise.
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Old 03-19-2017, 10:45 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by doctajones428 View Post
03-04 Hawks: 20 wins
05-06 Blues: 21 wins
06-07 Flyers: 22 wins
03-04 Caps: 23 wins
03-04 Pens: 23 wins

Those 5 teams don't even rank in the top 15 worst ever. The Avs collapse (lol), while bad, isn't that bad

The 3 worst teams ever are tied with 8 wins
The Avs have 20 wins and I'm not confident they will increase that number.

Also, most of the bad teams in history are expansion teams in their first three seasons. The Avs should be better than an expansion team.
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Old 03-20-2017, 04:22 PM   #39
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As Iain Fyffe has pointed out, the badness of a team can't be quantified by points or winning percentage alone, but by how much of an outlier it is from the rest of the league. In the 1970s there was very little parity in the league; the Original Six teams were still substantially better than most of the expansion clubs, and the later a franchise was formed, the worse it tended to be. In a league where Montreal was blowing away all records for winning percentage, we should expect to find teams with a high losing percentage as well.

The striking thing about this year's Avalanche is that they have managed to be this bad at a time of strong parity in the league. I took the trouble of calculating z-scores on each year's standings for the three ‘worst’ teams (10 wins or fewer in the post-expansion era) and for this season to date.

1974-75: NHL mean was 80 points by definition. (Ah, the days before three-point games!)
Standard deviation was 25.190 points – very little parity in the league.
Washington Capitals had 21 points.
Washington's z-score was –2.342.

1980-81: Mean 80 points.
Standard deviation 18.956 – increasing parity, despite the WHA merger.
Winnipeg Jets, 32 points.
Winnipeg's z-score was –2.532.
The Jets got more points than the '74-75 Caps, but they had to work harder at sucking, as they were almost 0.2 standard deviations further below average.

1992-93: Mean 84 points.
Standard deviation 23.869 – a spike upwards due to renewed expansion.
Ottawa Senators AND San Jose Sharks, 24 points. (Yes, San Jose won more than 10 games. They still stank, so we have a twofer this season.)
Ottawa and San Jose's z-score, –2.514.

2016-17 so far (ignoring games in hand): Mean 79.6 points.
Standard deviation 13.081 – exceptionally strong parity.
Colorado Avalanche, 43 points.
Colorado's z-score, –2.798.

In terms of standard deviations below average, thee winnah and new champeen, this year's Avs! They have actually outsucked all of the first- or second-year expansion teams that failed to top 10 wins in a season. But with three-point games inflating the numbers, and no true powerhouse teams to leech points away from them, they look like they've had better success than they have.

It is remarkable that a franchise could be this bad after 37 years in the NHL, and even more remarkable that it could do so with a salary floor to meet. It takes something like genius to pick a group of 23 players who will play that badly for that much money.
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Old 03-20-2017, 04:25 PM   #40
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Too young to remember the Dead Things?

They were doormats for 20 years before this great run started.
That's how they got Stevie Y. IRRC
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