The Following User Says Thank You to TheSquatch For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 03:25 PM
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#2
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#1 Goaltender
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSquatch
I have this feeling, backed up by nothing (except watching a very mediocre Flames team for long years bring up very mediocre AHL players) that the Flames draft record is worse than other teams.
I realize that they were happy to trade picks for players and weren't drafting at #3 overall. But I just remember years and years where our very best prospects were.... borderline NHLers, and guys who are actually pretty good (Brodie and Backlund off the top of my head) were really, really rare.
Has anyone looked at how many flames picks (at whatever spot) panned out vs other teams? I'm curious what those stats would look like. Is there a team that consistently drafted better talent in picks.... 40 to 100 say? than the Flames?
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Why not do the research yourself?
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The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to mikephoen For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 03:35 PM
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#3
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikephoen
Why not do the research yourself?
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Haha, start a new thread and ask people to do the research for him.
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The Following User Says Thank You to midniteowl For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 03:38 PM
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#4
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Crash and Bang Winger
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Cancun
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Johnny was an ok hit
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The Following User Says Thank You to Dube For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 03:47 PM
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#5
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSquatch
I have this feeling, backed up by nothing (except watching a very mediocre Flames team for long years bring up very mediocre AHL players) that the Flames draft record is worse than other teams.
I realize that they were happy to trade picks for players and weren't drafting at #3 overall. But I just remember years and years where our very best prospects were.... borderline NHLers, and guys who are actually pretty good (Brodie and Backlund off the top of my head) were really, really rare.
Has anyone looked at how many flames picks (at whatever spot) panned out vs other teams? I'm curious what those stats would look like. Is there a team that consistently drafted better talent in picks.... 40 to 100 say? than the Flames?
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Calgary has been at the lower end of that until more recently. Getting useful guys later on in the drafts has started to change since 2008 and we're probably on the top half now since then.
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The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Caged Great For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 03:50 PM
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#6
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Scoring Winger
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Wow, the OP simply asks if anyone has done the research (presumably to save duplicating effort) and gets a smack down.
I was thinking the same thing Squatch. We’ve obviously had lots of misses over the years with 1st round picks such as Chris Chuko, Morgan Klimchuk and others not working out. I’d even say Bennett was a bust as our highest ever draft pick and looking like a 3rd line guy (middle 6 at best).
I’d balance that out with hits such as a Johnny and Moneyhands, Andersson, Valimaki.
My gut tells me the last 6 years has been good, but the 10 years before that, not so much. Someone (who may have already done the research) will probably price be wrong.
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The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to CanadaMatt For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 03:58 PM
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#7
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Calgary
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Things more or less started to change with the Backlund pick, but didn't really pick up until Tree.
In 2008, got Bouma in the 3rd, Brodie in the 4th
10, got Ferland in the 5th
11, Grandlund in the 2nd, Gaudreau in the 4th
15, Andersson, Kylington, and Eat Bread
16, Dube, Fox, Phillips and Parsons
18, Koumontzis, Pettersen and Zavgorovdniy
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The Following User Says Thank You to Caged Great For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 04:21 PM
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#8
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Powerplay Quarterback
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It’s been pretty decent the last few years.
It is fair to say the Flames stink at drafting goalies though.
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07-21-2019, 04:25 PM
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#9
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Powerplay Quarterback
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Why not do the research myself....
2 reasons - First, I suspect someone has it all packed up and ready to go. Second, I don't really know how to efficiently access whatever data bases people use for this kind of thing. It's not important enough to me to spend 10 hours on, frankly.
If someone knows the answer, great, if not, great.
If asking a question elicits such a sour faced response, I'll be sure and do it again.
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The Following User Says Thank You to TheSquatch For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 04:26 PM
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#10
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Powerplay Quarterback
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madmike
It’s been pretty decent the last few years.
It is fair to say the Flames stink at drafting goalies though.
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Or stink at developing them, not sure which. Maybe both.
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07-21-2019, 04:33 PM
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#11
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSquatch
Why not do the research myself....
2 reasons - First, I suspect someone has it all packed up and ready to go. Second, I don't really know how to efficiently access whatever data bases people use for this kind of thing. It's not important enough to me to spend 10 hours on, frankly.
If someone knows the answer, great, if not, great.
If asking a question elicits such a sour faced response, I'll be sure and do it again.
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An unbiased (at least towards the Flames) hockey fan has done something that you might be interested in over at HF. Should answer some of your questions fairly thoroughly, actually. Just go look in their prospects section under "Best Drafting Teams in the NHL". If anyone can find some better and more thorough work out there somewhere, I would be interested in knowing about it myself, but this is the best work I have seen on this subject thus far.
*spoilers*
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The Following User Says Thank You to Calgary4LIfe For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 04:52 PM
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#12
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First Line Centre
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Ever since Treliving took over, the Flames have been one of the top drafting teams in the NHL, if not the very best.
Someone actually did research on the value each team has gotten from their draft picks based on draft position and everything over the last 5, 10 and 15 years I believe and the Flames under Treliving were #1 I believe
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07-21-2019, 05:24 PM
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#13
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Calgary
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The lasting legacy of Feaster and Weisbrod's time here was making clear criterion for what the Flames valued, what it looked like, and how that structured their draft lists.
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The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Freeway For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 05:36 PM
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#14
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Powerplay Quarterback
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Interesting, yes, they rank better than I expected by those metrics.
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07-21-2019, 05:42 PM
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#15
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Alberta
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Came to mention the great work that Hf poster did. One of the few good posts on that terrible echo box.
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07-21-2019, 05:50 PM
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#16
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Owner
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSquatch
I have this feeling, backed up by nothing (except watching a very mediocre Flames team for long years bring up very mediocre AHL players) that the Flames draft record is worse than other teams.
I realize that they were happy to trade picks for players and weren't drafting at #3 overall. But I just remember years and years where our very best prospects were.... borderline NHLers, and guys who are actually pretty good (Brodie and Backlund off the top of my head) were really, really rare.
Has anyone looked at how many flames picks (at whatever spot) panned out vs other teams? I'm curious what those stats would look like. Is there a team that consistently drafted better talent in picks.... 40 to 100 say? than the Flames?
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Recently saw a study that had the Flames in top spot in the last five years, and something like 7th overall in the last ten for mining talent.
I'll look for it.
Hard not to like the recent success though, especially with the lack of 1st and 2nds.
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The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Bingo For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 06:18 PM
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#17
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Powerplay Quarterback
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According to the analysis on Hfboards, Calgary has been the best drafting team in the past four years. From 2012-2015 however, Calgary ranked 21st.
https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threa...e-nhl.2665533/
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751
The Oilers won't finish 14th in the West forever.
Eventually a couple of expansion teams will be added which will nestle the Oilers into 16th.
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The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Point Blank For This Useful Post:
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07-21-2019, 06:23 PM
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#18
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Crash and Bang Winger
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I am amazed with all the scouting and tools in teams hands what a complete crapshoot the draft still is. I have always felt anything 4th round or later is nothing more than luck. Sometimes you are lucky and sometimes you are not. I am too lazy but I wonder if you could fire your whole scouting department and just draft solely on the scouting bureaus number. I bet over 20 years you wouldn’t look out of place.
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07-21-2019, 06:46 PM
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#19
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Franchise Player
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Most of the current team drafted by Flames. Can't be that bad lately?
Wish we'd keep more picks TBH
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07-21-2019, 06:47 PM
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#20
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Rocky Mt House
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Squatch you are a relatively new member to the boards (welcome to CP! btw) and have begun a thread with negative implications. Well maybe not, but there was a time where Calgary was terrible at drafting the the memory remains sour. That might have got a couple members feeling defensive. Sorry if I/we misjudged you.
Glad to say, as others have, that good drafting is now a Flames strength.
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The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Yrebmi For This Useful Post:
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