Anybody else on a keto diet?

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by TheSutterDynasty

You know that all of those benefits are the same with a healthy, carb-filled diet, right?

At the end of the day there is no evidence that a ketogenic diet has benefits over regular healthy eating that includes carbohydrates.

I’d like to point you back to the three PubMed papers that suggest otherwise. [shrug]

[TheSutterDynasty]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

I’d like to point you back to the three PubMed papers that suggest otherwise. [shrug]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/30194696/

Among meta-analyses, 4/5 with critically low quality showed low-carbohydrate diet superiority for weight loss (0.7-4.0 kg), while high quality meta-analyses reported little or no difference between diets.

[oldschoolcalgary]

really any diet is a fad of sorts... by definition, a lot of things can be labelled that...

Keto has been around a long time, in various forms, so i don't see it as a "fad" per se because its been around for a long time and never disappeared, but it has seen ups and downs in its level of popularity...and this is an up cycle

Any diet can work, so long as you have the discipline to follow them to a T.

For some, a keto diet works best... for others IF works for them...I think if it helps people feel physically better, psychologically better, then more power to them.

[dissentowner]

I didn't make the thread to debate if the diet is a fad or any of that stuff, I made it for people following the diet to talk about their journey. Obviously any of us on the keto diet already did the research, can we not turn this into a debate?

[rubecube]

So anyone have a solution to keto breath?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by rubecube

So anyone have a solution to keto breath?

Gin? That'll come with its own problems of course...

[TheSutterDynasty]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I didn't make the thread to debate if the diet is a fad or any of that stuff, I made it for people following the diet to talk about their journey. Obviously any of us on the keto diet already did the research, can we not turn this into a debate?

I'm being proactive.

Have you ever been talking to a buddy about hockey when suddenly he jumps to the topic of his keto diet? Super annoying.

Then a month later he's gone vegan. Still hasn't lost any weight.

Instead of being surprised in a beer thread or something I've come straight to the source of annoyance.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by TheSutterDynasty

Have you ever been talking to a buddy about hockey when suddenly he jumps to the topic of his keto diet? Super annoying.

Um, no? Typically that conversation happens if someone who hasn't seen me since my fat days says "Wow, you're fit as hell" and proceeds to ask what I did to reach where I'm at. If someone asks, I tell them. If they don't, it doesn't come up unless it's related to the conversation we're having.

Originally Posted by TheSutterDynasty

Then a month later he's gone vegan. Still hasn't lost any weight.

Sounds like the problem is less about keto diets and more about who you're keeping company with.

[TheSutterDynasty]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

Um, no? Typically that conversation happens if someone who hasn't seen me since my fat days says "Wow, you're fit as hell" and proceeds to ask what I did to reach where I'm at. If someone asks, I tell them. If they don't, it doesn't come up unless it's related to the conversation we're having.

Sounds like the problem is less about keto diets and more about who you're keeping company with.

For sure it is. And good for everyone here focusing on their health, regardless of how.

You missed that systematic review post though.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by TheSutterDynasty

You know that all of those benefits are the same with a healthy, carb-filled diet, right?

At the end of the day there is no evidence that a ketogenic diet has benefits over regular healthy eating that includes carbohydrates. The one thing it does have is poorer long term compliance. Most people don't have problems losing weight, but 99% of those who lose it will regain it all back.

All that being said, good for everyone in here trying to make themselves healthier.

I just hate fads. And people always talking about keto when I don't ask. Yes I realize I walked into a keto thread.

I don't things there's any debate that a diet with all macros in good proportions and from good sources is the optimal diet for most people.
If everyone could eat that way, we wouldn't even know what the Keto diet is.

But I get that Keto works well for a lot of people and for those people it may have better compliance then general good nutrition, portion control, etc.
Maybe being able to binge on bacon, cheese and butter just makes it easier for a lot of people.
It is cheating or a shortcut in a sense, but if it works for people and has minimal side effects, why not.
Good to see people finding something that works for them.

[Robo]

I havent done keto but I have started a daily 16/8 intermintent fast about 7 weeks ago now, I started trying to get in better shape 1.5 years ago at 5'9 190 pounds. I kinda stalled at 160 and 14.5 percent body fat. Since i started 16/8 intermittent fasting I have got down to 150 and lost 1 percent bodyfat while still keeping my muscle. Daily I consume between 2000-2300 calories in 3 meals I resort to weighing my food and I'm quite active I thought my Fitbit was off it says I burn between 3000-3600 calories a day, But it must be pretty close with the weight loss I am seeing since starting intermittent fasting. my goal body fat is somewhere in between 12 percent and I'm probably going to try to get down to 145 pounds and then up my caloric intake by a couple hundred calories to try to pack on more muscle. But at 34 I want to finally have abs lol I can see the top abs a bit and obliques but not enough lol. The first couple days of intermittent fasting were hard but after about a week i completely lost any cravings i have had for snacking at all and with 3 pretty big meals a day I dont have room for junk food anymore because I am usually quite full

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Robo

I havent done keto but I have started a daily 16/8 intermintent fast about 7 weeks ago now, I started trying to get in better shape 1.5 years ago at 5'9 190 pounds. I kinda stalled at 160 and 14.5 percent body fat. Since i started 16/8 intermittent fasting I have got down to 150 and lost 1 percent bodyfat while still keeping my muscle. Daily I consume between 2000-2300 calories in 3 meals I resort to weighing my food and I'm quite active I thought my Fitbit was off it says I burn between 3000-3600 calories a day, But it must be pretty close with the weight loss I am seeing since starting intermittent fasting. my goal body fat is somewhere in between 12 percent and I'm probably going to try to get down to 145 pounds and then up my caloric intake by a couple hundred calories to try to pack on more muscle. But at 34 I want to finally have abs lol I can see the top abs a bit and obliques but not enough lol. The first couple days of intermittent fasting were hard but after about a week i completely lost any cravings i have had for snacking at all and with 3 pretty big meals a day I dont have room for junk food anymore because I am usually quite full

Good job! Keep at it and you will be sporting that 6 pack in no time.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by TheSutterDynasty

You missed that systematic review post though.

It wasn't that I missed it so much as it's not much of an obstacle. It is specifically focusing on weight loss as the sole point of analysis. It makes this very clear in its final sentence:

"Better quality reviews and RCTs are needed, before recommending low-carbohydrate diets as preferred to other approaches for energy restriction."


I would agree with that 100%. It's hard to ensure patient compliance and to ensure they aren't accidentally eating sugars they weren't aware of. More trials and reviews are needed, no question.

However, you said this:

Originally Posted by TheSutterDynasty

You know that all of those benefits are the same with a healthy, carb-filled diet, right?

in response to this:

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

The benefits are weight loss, improved outcomes for / prevention of cardiovascular disease, diabetes, metabolic syndrome, PCOS, Alzheimer's, acne, cancer, ALS, and improved HDL levels.

And I don't see how a review that concludes "more research is needed" with respect to one benefit cancels out the rest of them.

[TheSutterDynasty]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

It wasn't that I missed it so much as it's not much of an obstacle. It is specifically focusing on weight loss as the sole point of analysis. It makes this very clear in its final sentence:

"Better quality reviews and RCTs are needed, before recommending low-carbohydrate diets as preferred to other approaches for energy restriction."


I would agree with that 100%. It's hard to ensure patient compliance and to ensure they aren't accidentally eating sugars they weren't aware of. More trials and reviews are needed, no question.

However, you said this:
in response to this:And I don't see how a review that concludes "more research is needed" with respect to one benefit cancels out the rest of them.

Because all of those benefits apply for a regular change in diet and weight loss.

[#-3]

I'm gonna tap out here, not going to win against the converted in this forum. Like I said annoying as hell fad diets are one area where calling people on their pseudoscience isn't acceptable in society yet.

I particularly get sick of people taking weak correlations, with alternative known causal impacts and claiming they have science behind them, then proselytizing there BS to everyone who will listen.

Nobody anywhere is arguing that if the average north american cuts allot of sugar out of their diet they will be healthier.

The names of science and evidence just shouldn't be used in this way, its a gateway drug to other BS; juicing cleanses, chiropractor, cupping, needling, and then you have some acupressure quack telling my mom he can cure her allergies with juice, or a naturopath telling your uncle that he will cure his cancer with imaginary mercury in his water. And I think its important that anyone starts down this path is at least warned, so they can see the signs when it escalates.

Leave those two words out of it and eat whatever the hell you want if you think it will help you control your weight or energy...

[blankall]

Originally Posted by TheSutterDynasty

Because all of those benefits apply for a regular change in diet and weight loss.

There's actually an inflammation benefit you get from keto/no carb diets. We don't know enough about metabolic pathways to know why, but it does happen. Doctors go as far as to prescribe keto diets to treat certain inflammation prone forms of epilepsy:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2796387/

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by #-3

I'm gonna tap out here, not going to win against the converted in this forum. Like I said annoying as hell fad diets are one area where calling people on their pseudoscience isn't acceptable in society yet.

I particularly get sick of people taking weak correlations, with alternative known causal impacts and claiming they have science behind them, then proselytizing there BS to everyone who will listen.

Nobody anywhere is arguing that if the average north american cuts allot of sugar out of their diet they will be healthier.

The names of science and evidence just shouldn't be used in this way, its a gateway drug to other BS; juicing cleanses, chiropractor, cupping, needling, and then you have some acupressure quack telling my mom he can cure her allergies with juice, or a naturopath telling your uncle that he will cure his cancer with imaginary mercury in his water. And I think its important that anyone starts down this path is at least warned, so they can see the signs when it escalates.

Leave those two words out of it and eat whatever the hell you want if you think it will help you control your weight or energy...

This ranks right up with one of the most ridiculous posts in the history of CP. Keto is the gateway drug to seeing a witch doctor, who knew?

[Firebot]

Originally Posted by #-3

I'm gonna tap out here, not going to win against the converted in this forum. Like I said annoying as hell fad diets are one area where calling people on their pseudoscience isn't acceptable in society yet.

I particularly get sick of people taking weak correlations, with alternative known causal impacts and claiming they have science behind them, then proselytizing there BS to everyone who will listen.

Nobody anywhere is arguing that if the average north american cuts allot of sugar out of their diet they will be healthier.

The names of science and evidence just shouldn't be used in this way, its a gateway drug to other BS; juicing cleanses, chiropractor, cupping, needling, and then you have some acupressure quack telling my mom he can cure her allergies with juice, or a naturopath telling your uncle that he will cure his cancer with imaginary mercury in his water. And I think its important that anyone starts down this path is at least warned, so they can see the signs when it escalates.

Leave those two words out of it and eat whatever the hell you want if you think it will help you control your weight or energy...

So, in your mind, you saw a thread about keto diet, and you decided to post here to do what exactly? To try to convert people, or just hate the idea that people are losing weight despite the ingrained social mantra that fat = bad? Does someone eating 4 strips of bacon and saying he is losing weight makes your blood boil or something?

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition...tosis#section1

Ketosis is a metabolic state, it's not a diet or pseudo science. It's a real state. A keto diet is the idea of promoting ketosis as a tool to burn fat.

Oh and just because, science.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23651522

The present meta-analysis aimed to investigate whether individuals assigned to a VLCKD (i.e. a diet with no more than 50 g carbohydrates/d) achieve better long-term body weight and cardiovascular risk factor management when compared with individuals assigned to a conventional low-fat diet (LFD; i.e. a restricted-energy diet with less than 30% of energy from fat).

Individuals assigned to a VLCKD achieve a greater weight loss than those assigned to a LFD in the longterm; hence, a VLCKD may be an alternative tool against obesity.

Honestly, cannot expect anything less from someone who can't differentiate between ketosis and ketoacidosis and provides diabetic studies on ketoacidosis as arguments against the keto diet...one has the name acid in the middle, while the other does not.

[dissentowner]

So a year ago I got diagnosed with fatty liver disease. Like bad fatty liver disease. Today I went for a fibroscan and I no longer have fatty liver disease, as a matter of fact I have lower levels of fat in my liver than most 45 year olds that my liver specialist has seen. No damage either.

[troutman]

Stanford Medicine has a blog about many popular diets:

https://scopeblog.stanford.edu/tag/a...popular-diets/

How ketogenic should you go?

https://scopeblog.stanford.edu/2019/...should-you-go/

Analysis: When people consume a ketogenic diet, the liver produces ketones from fat as an alternative to using glucose as a circulating source of energy for the body. This state of ketosis mimics what occurs during starvation. A ketogenic diet can facilitate weight loss and lower blood sugar. A keto diet also reverses insulin resistance, an early stage in the development of type 2 diabetes. A big attraction: keto dieters don’t experience the same degree of hunger while losing weight.

Despite these benefits, the diet has many potential problems. As the body initially adapts to the lack of carbohydrates, people often feel miserable and develop fatigue, body aches, and headaches. These symptoms are often temporary, but only if the diet is strictly followed and ketosis is maintained.

The high saturated fat content typical of many keto diets unfavorably increases LDL cholesterol. In starvation mode, muscle is also used as an energy source and loss of muscle mass is a problem. Furthermore, the unusual stress that ketosis places on the body can result in long-term problems, such as kidney stones and kidney disease. A very high fat and very low carbohydrate diet is typically low in fiber; low-fiber diets are associated with increased risk of colon cancer and may lead to unhealthy gut bacteria.

To make it healthier: Focusing on healthier, plant-based fats (such as oils) may give you the potential benefits of a ketogenic diet without the negative impact of saturated fats, and cutting back on or eliminating all added sugars and refined grains will have a positive impact on metabolism.

Conclusion: A diet only for die-hards who are willing to subject themselves to the rigors of starting and sticking to this diet. Realistically, intermittent use could prove beneficial for weight loss, but even then, caution is necessary.