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Old 06-23-2021, 08:20 AM   #5061
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I want 110% vaccinated. All living, dead (fresh corpses anyways) and unborn should be counted too.
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Old 06-23-2021, 08:22 AM   #5062
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Are we seriously arguing about masks again?
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Old 06-23-2021, 08:36 AM   #5063
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I donít want to wear masks and have restrictions any more either, but Iíd rather we be cautious just a little bit for the next month or two. Wearing masks for July would not be a big deal while we wait and see how the month plays out.

My three year old is currently in quarantine as a close contact until the end of the month. Kids arenít often getting very sick from COVID, but there are still very real consequences from quarantine requirements. Iím sure there are plenty of parents of young kids out there that donít want to go through yet another round of isolation.

Iíd happily wear a mask for an extra couple of weeks if it meant avoiding further quarantines.
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Old 06-23-2021, 08:57 AM   #5064
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No country in the world has reached 70 per cent fully vaccinated. Israel is at 56 per cent. The UK at 47 and the U.S. at 45. Are any other countries in the world setting 70 per cent with two shots as their threshold for removing restriction? Even in highly conformist and compliant Canada, itís highly unlikely weíll hit that number by September. The U.S., who we have a border with that 300,000 people cross every day, will likely never reach 70 per cent fully vaccinated.

Variants are going to continue emerging as covid spreads around the globe. Virologists are predicting that covid 19 will become endemic and part of our seasonal viral mix. People need to get their heads around the likelihood that Canadians will continue to get infected with and die from covid this fall, through the winter, and likely in 2022 and beyond. The only reason for it to merit government intervention (beyond encouraging annual shots) is if it threatens to overwhelm the healthcare system.
We set 60% one shot of eligible for removing restrictions. Then more at 65% one shot, and wide open province wide at 70% one shot. But thatís not the finish line.
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Old 06-23-2021, 08:58 AM   #5065
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Whatever happened to "better be safe than sorry"?
Does a mask take too much space in one's pocket? Carry it with you and if you encounter a situation where you have to put it on, put it on.
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Old 06-23-2021, 09:43 AM   #5066
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Whatever happened to "better be safe than sorry"?
Does a mask take too much space in one's pocket? Carry it with you and if you encounter a situation where you have to put it on, put it on.
But, what about my "freedom"?
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Old 06-23-2021, 09:49 AM   #5067
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Hey, America. Please don't **** this up. Thanks.

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WASHINGTON (AP) — The U.S. government is stepping up efforts to get younger Americans vaccinated for COVID-19 as the White House acknowledges it will miss two key vaccination benchmarks and as concern grows about the spread of a new variant that threatens to set the country back in the months ahead.

The delta variant, first identified in India, in the last two weeks has come to represent more than 20% of coronavirus infections in the U.S., the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported Tuesday. That’s double what it was when the CDC last reported on the variant’s prevalence.

“The delta variant is currently the greatest threat in the U.S. to our attempt to eliminate COVID-19,” Dr. Anthony Fauci, the nation’s top infectious disease expert, said at a White House briefing on the virus. “Good news: Our vaccines are effective against the delta variant.”

He added: “We have the tools. So let’s use them, and crush the outbreak.”
https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden...aeabc898533e0?
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Old 06-23-2021, 10:12 AM   #5068
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Hey, America. Please don't **** this up. Thanks.

https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden...aeabc898533e0?



There was never any chance they weren't going to. Going to Wrestlemania in Florida was far too important.
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Old 06-23-2021, 10:18 AM   #5069
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Hey, America. Please don't **** this up. Thanks.



https://apnews.com/article/joe-biden...aeabc898533e0?
Too late, unfortunately.
That, in my opinion, is the problem with the AB reopening plan. And probably all plans. Because politics.
Wide open unrestricted for the fully vaccinated, restrictions like the NFL has on unvaccinated, or the new border policy would be ideal.
Yes, I get there is no way to enforce this, but AB has deincentivised vaccinations now. Unfortunately.
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Old 06-23-2021, 10:32 AM   #5070
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No country in the world has reached 70 per cent fully vaccinated. Israel is at 56 per cent. The UK at 47 and the U.S. at 45. Are any other countries in the world setting 70 per cent with two shots as their threshold for removing restriction? Even in highly conformist and compliant Canada, it’s highly unlikely we’ll hit that number by September. The U.S., who we have a border with that 300,000 people cross every day, will likely never reach 70 per cent fully vaccinated.

Variants are going to continue emerging as covid spreads around the globe. Virologists are predicting that covid 19 will become endemic and part of our seasonal viral mix. People need to get their heads around the likelihood that Canadians will continue to get infected with and die from covid this fall, through the winter, and likely in 2022 and beyond. The only reason for it to merit government intervention (beyond encouraging annual shots) is if it threatens to overwhelm the healthcare system.

This reply isn't entirely aimed at you, because you didn't mention the mask thing, but its one of the few restrictions we've been talking about keeping in place.

I cannot wrap my head around the crying about wearing a mask for 20 minutes here and there. I see zero problem with having to wear one in places like grocery stores etc., the places where people with legitimate health risks, or young children HAVE to go. If nightclubs and bars don't require them, fine, but those aren't necessary for living.

I'm so tired of hearing things like, well "you can wear a mask if you want to". I don't want to, and me wearing one is only for your benefit. That's the biggest problem with the whole mask thing. We've been telling people it's for others benefit, and people are selfish.

So things can open up, but maybe in retail businesses, and things like transit, masks can still be required for awhile longer until vaccination rates increase. Even at 50% double vaccinated, which I'm sure we'll hit, that would have a significant impact on transmission.

This government has done a terrible job to motivate people to get vaccinated, and there's all the potential in the world for low transmission during to the summer to give people a false sense of security, when instead we could have put way more of a beating on this virus. Our best opportunity is right now, not September. Then again, maybe things will be entirely fine, but I'd rather get it right. Who cares about Stampede and Canada day, we're being stupid to please the Calgary Stampede and Jason Kenney's buddies. This whole thing is about Calgary Stampede and that's just wrong to me. I have friends with small businesses that will end up paying the price if this does happen to go sideways (which I don't necessarily think will happen, but why push it so much). Stampede should have been moved to the end of August.

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Old 06-23-2021, 11:27 AM   #5071
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I donít get the mask complaints but when you say Stampede should of moved it sounds like you are saying you want to continue to limit both indoor and outdoor gathering size. That is a more significant restriction for a lot longer.
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Old 06-23-2021, 11:41 AM   #5072
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My prediction is that the Stampede itself (i.e. what happens on the Stampede grounds) will be a big nothingburger. With the border closed attendance will be down significantly, and it sounds like there will be enough measures/restrictions on indoor events to keep things manageable.

Where the damage could be done is the bars, nightclubs, etc where people are hanging out indoors without masks (especially if you're unvaccinated or have only had one shot). But that was going to happen with or without stampede, and it's not going to make a difference whether they're wearing jeans and cowboy boots.
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Old 06-23-2021, 11:44 AM   #5073
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This reply isn't entirely aimed at you, because you didn't mention the mask thing, but its one of the few restrictions we've been talking about keeping in place.

I cannot wrap my head around the crying about wearing a mask for 20 minutes here and there. I see zero problem with having to wear one in places like grocery stores etc., the places where people with legitimate health risks, or young children HAVE to go. If nightclubs and bars don't require them, fine, but those aren't necessary for living.

I'm so tired of hearing things like, well "you can wear a mask if you want to". I don't want to, and me wearing one is only for your benefit. That's the biggest problem with the whole mask thing. We've been telling people it's for others benefit, and people are selfish.

So things can open up, but maybe in retail businesses, and things like transit, masks can still be required for awhile longer until vaccination rates increase. Even at 50% double vaccinated, which I'm sure we'll hit, that would have a significant impact on transmission.

This government has done a terrible job to motivate people to get vaccinated, and there's all the potential in the world for low transmission during to the summer to give people a false sense of security, when instead we could have put way more of a beating on this virus. Our best opportunity is right now, not September. Then again, maybe things will be entirely fine, but I'd rather get it right. Who cares about Stampede and Canada day, we're being stupid to please the Calgary Stampede and Jason Kenney's buddies. This whole thing is about Calgary Stampede and that's just wrong to me. I have friends with small businesses that will end up paying the price if this does happen to go sideways (which I don't necessarily think will happen, but why push it so much). Stampede should have been moved to the end of August.
You make a lot of good points, but I don't agree with your statement about the government not "motivating" people to get vaccinated. Vaccinations rates in Canada, and especially Alberta, are the highest in the world.

The anti-vaxxers are just being bad people. Having an NDP government rant at them about vaccinations would only add fuel to their moronic flames.
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Old 06-23-2021, 11:54 AM   #5074
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You make a lot of good points, but I don't agree with your statement about the government not "motivating" people to get vaccinated. Vaccinations rates in Canada, and especially Alberta, are the highest in the world.

.
not sure about the especially Alberta part?


Canada's first dose vaccination record is exceptional- Alberta's is good- but trails the national average by several points



Canada's total vaccination record (total doses) is really good and improving. Alberta is about average for total doses nationally



Canada's fully vaccinated (double dose) record is (intentionally) low right now , but definitely improving. here for Canada, Alberta is great (but still sits below all 50 states for example)
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Old 06-23-2021, 11:54 AM   #5075
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If everything is open, having to wear masks in some places shouldn’t even be looked at as a restriction. It’s not.
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Old 06-23-2021, 12:17 PM   #5076
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Not all people refusing the vaccination are true anti-vaxxers. Many are concerned about side effects and waiting for the "issues" to be ironed out and will get a vaccine once more anecdotal evidence is available for the vaccine with the lesser issues. For instance, my wife said she is an acquaintance to the guy who was apparently paralyzed by the AZ vaccine. A month ago, she and I at one point were more than OK to get any vaccine (AZ included), but once that article came out, it was Moderna/Pfizer or bust. Her parents were open to AZ, but we were vocal about our opinion they should try for Moderna/Pfizer if possible due to the fact they have current issues like high blood pressure which were at far higher risk to be affected by the AZ side effects.

I think the Moderna/Pfizer side effects are also scaring a few people too who are delaying the inevitable as long as they can (kinda like how you might do the same with a dental visit). Sure, it's just a few days, but I think many are now high gear hypochondriacs and easily freaked out about any form of illness symptoms.

Vaccination wise, I think another issue is the confusing availability. How many of us have been put on waiting lists for half a dozen pharmacies waiting for the ability to book an appointment vs it would be so much nicer to just mass vaccinate people at the Saddledome or McMahon with majority walk ins? I don't know about others, but I basically shopped for the earliest convenient time to get vaccinated. I think this would have helped get a ton of people vaccinated earlier vs having to cross reference availability from several pharmacies.


When the masks mandate is lifted, I'm not opposed to optional mask requests. Like longer term if someone is hacking away at the office, I don't want your cold/flu even though it'll be gone in a few days. Shorter term, I think I'll be fine going back to normal with people I know and people I know are relatively lower risk, but strangers and certain people I think are at a slight risk, I'll mask up. I feel it's reasonable if I treat Covid going forward like how I do not want pneumonia or listeria. This because my kids are not in the correct age range to be vaccinated against Covid yet.

If I don't like the people around me, I'll probably keep masks on hand and mask up. If someone gets mad you're wearing a mask and kinda just keeping to yourself about it (and not imposing them to wear a mask), treat them with the same mentality as whose who get upset about people who wear hijabs and turbans. An idiot is an idiot, so don't let yourself get brought down to their level and be beaten by experience. With a mask on, I don't have to breathe as much of the same crappy air as those idiots.


The Stampede doesn't bother me too much. I agree that I think 17th Ave and other establishments will be the bigger hot spots. We still need to be aware of the variants, unvaccinated and those that are double vaccinated, but are unlucky to be on the other side of the efficacy rate (approx 6% Pfizer/Moderna, 15% JJ and 24% AZ).
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Old 06-23-2021, 12:28 PM   #5077
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Looking at the US probably isn't a great way to measure how successful Canada will be in terms of reopening. Our vaccinations are pretty equal across our provinces with a few outliers. Only 8 states are even in excess of 60% for first doses and 28 of them are not yet above 50%. Nationally, we've exceeded their first doses by percentage of total population and will exceed their second doses pretty quickly.
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Old 06-23-2021, 12:34 PM   #5078
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Looking at the US probably isn't a great way to measure how successful Canada will be in terms of reopening. Our vaccinations are pretty equal across our provinces with a few outliers. Only 8 states are even in excess of 60% for first doses and 28 of them are not yet above 50%. Nationally, we've exceeded their first doses by percentage of total population and will exceed their second doses pretty quickly.
that's interesting data from Mayo clinic, the numbers I've been looking at has about 13 states over 60% but your point still holds either way. some of the data I am seeing is from ourworldindata and has some states (such as Washington and California) over 60% but not according to your link.

hmm
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Old 06-23-2021, 12:45 PM   #5079
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What I find odd is that 10% of seniors in Canada still aren't vaccinated. Places like the UK and most of the US states with similar overall coverage to Canada are seeing 95-99% uptake among that age group. Canada's coverage among seniors is barely better than Kentucky or Florida's.
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Old 06-23-2021, 12:47 PM   #5080
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You make a lot of good points, but I don't agree with your statement about the government not "motivating" people to get vaccinated. Vaccinations rates in Canada, and especially Alberta, are the highest in the world.

The anti-vaxxers are just being bad people. Having an NDP government rant at them about vaccinations would only add fuel to their moronic flames.
I don't think our rates are terrible at all, but I don't think those rates have much to do with the government providing more incentive. With a little more effort I think we could have a higher rate, and that comes from incentivizing people. I'd like it if Alberta wasn't the most hesitant in the country, but I fully expected that. None of that involves an NDP government ranting at anyone.

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I don’t get the mask complaints but when you say Stampede should of moved it sounds like you are saying you want to continue to limit both indoor and outdoor gathering size. That is a more significant restriction for a lot longer.
I don't think the Stampede midway is a huge issue, (I won't be going anywhere near it myself), but I'm not particularly concerned with that (based on my very limited knowledge of how it's going to run this year). My issue with Stampede is that it's clear everything we're rushing is for Stampede. So if they had just been more flexible, and moved to August, we wouldn't have to lift every single restriction by the 1st. We could take an extra week or two at each phase, ease into the opening a little more, and just make sure this is done correctly. It actually has little to do with the stampede event itself.

I have no problem with opening things up, I want to open things up. I thought some of the things that were closed could have remained open with effective restrictions (like gyms by appointment etc). I just don't care about pleasing stampede at the expense of small businesses if this does go wrong. I'm just in favour of the very simple, least restrictive actions as a bit of shield while our double doses increase and reduce transmission, it's not like it's going to take months to hit 50% double dosed.

Overall I think it will be ok, but this government has ignored experts at every single turn and it's failed every single time. Maybe they need to realize the line they have been trying to walk is just a touch ambitious.

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