Official WWE/ECW/WCW/TNA talk, or whatever v2

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Muta

Yeah I'm not sure what benefit it is to be doing a crossover with Impact, which is very much less popular than AEW to begin with. This would have had much more (sorry for the pun) impact if this was an NJPW double-cross. Makes WAY more sense for a bunch of reasons.

100%

Omega getting helped by a NJPW wrestler and taking the belt to Japan should have been an angle they used eventually, but a cross-over with Impact...bleh.

AEW is already more mainstream than Impact ever has been, no idea what the benefit of putting your Champion on AXS TV is.

Plus Omega being the one to take the belt to Impact and needing to do that to win the belt makes about as much sense as when Austin joined team WCW in that invasion.

If you want to have a dusty finish and put the belt on an Impact show then you might as well have put it on Brian Cage or Matt Hardy who had a history with Impact, and it would make more sense that they’d need to cheat to win.

[Blaster86]

Sting?


Lol.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Muta

Yeah I'm not sure what benefit it is to be doing a crossover with Impact, which is very much less popular than AEW to begin with. This would have had much more (sorry for the pun) impact if this was an NJPW double-cross. Would have made WAY more sense for a bunch of reasons, including a renewed feud with Okada.

The only benefit is it creates a actual woman's division if they follow it through. Other then that Impact is really nothing, and the last time I watched it, it wasn't great.


I was cool with Sting, though I have no interest in seeing him wrestling because his age was really showing, then I saw that Khan had signed him to a multiyear full time contract, and I said, really? Why?

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I was cool with Sting, though I have no interest in seeing him wrestling because his age was really showing, then I saw that Khan had signed him to a multiyear full time contract, and I said, really? Why?

Same reason all the old WCW guys ended up in TNA when ol' Money Bags Carter was in charge. The owner is a mark.

[Ozy_Flame]

I'm down for this Impact/AEW angle. Give me some Chris Bey / Kenny Omega and I'll call 2020 a draw.

[rubecube]

Yeah, I'm 50/50 on Sting and the partnership with Impact, but I'm willing to see where both lead. As long as Sting isn't being brought in to go over younger guys and wrestle on a regular basis, he could be fine for a few novelty appearances.

[d_phaneuf]

Does every AEW match have to end in a brawl?

[CaptainCrunch]

Seems like. Its a old WCW trick, every match of importance would either end in a DQ or a brawl.



The problem with WCW was they started doing it during PPVs and the NWO was keeping belts by getting DQ'd and the fans lost interest.

[SuperMatt18]

That is my take on AEW...trying too hard to be WCW.

Some interesting talent, and at times the product feels fresh.

But then the booking ends up just feeling like "Bad' WCW at times.

Undefeated Champion gets hit with a Taser/Mic while the ref is distracted, and the heel runs away with the belt....where have I seen that before.

[Ozy_Flame]

Regarding Sting:

I bet he was signed to a multi-year deal so they can include his likeliness in merchandise, video games, appearances, etc. Dude has incredible brand appeal and still is a household name in the wrestling demographics.

He doesn't need to wrestle one match for AEW. His marketing potential is very high.

Outside of Jericho, Sting is probably the biggest household name now in the company. People will literally buy the AEW video games so they can play as Sting.

This might actually be a solid win for Tony Khan.

[Muta]

I was really hoping AEW would go the way of NJPW; higher quality matches, do your storytelling in the ring. Focus on the builds, the teases, the suspense, the character development. They do this okay as is.... but it does feel very WCW - lots of run-ins, lots of DQ's, brawls, that stuff isn't necessary to satisfy your fans. Show great matches, give clean wins, and make their talent the story. If done right, someone can lose and they still look like a million dollars.

[CaptainCrunch]

The talent is there, a fairly decent upper card, a ok mid card, but when you look at their roster it to me is over bloated (Kind of like WCW). The Woman's division really isn't working.

The booking to me is too fan boyish. What I like and what draws me to NXT is for the most part the storylines aren't the preventable thing, its the driver to the match, and their matches are good, and there's not a ton of bizarre run ins and stuff.

Though I will admit on the main roster side, The Reigns story and the Bliss/Fiend story have really captured my attention. Mainly because the Reigns story is simple and makes sense. And Bray Wyatt to me is a brilliant character developer, and Bliss has been stellar.

The problem with a ton of run ins and belt stealing and stuff like that is it eventually burns out the audience to it, and they start to hate it because it takes away from the basic premise of wrestling, which is resolution of issues.

People didn't tune out the WCW because of the talent. Well they did in the end because WCW didn't do a great job of developing stars, except with Goldberg, and they screwed him up in the end. But people tuned out from WCW because of the booking, constant run ins. Dusty finishes, and hot shoting belts to the point of devaluing them.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

The booking to me is too fan boyish. What I like and what draws me to NXT is for the most part the storylines aren't the preventable thing, its the driver to the match, and their matches are good, and there's not a ton of bizarre run ins and stuff.

I can agree with this. There are many times where you can clearly tell Cody/Bucks/Omega/Khan are booking to get the IWC on their side, but it doesn't execute as well.

One that really bothers me is Omega's new entrance. This pre-build with the sweepers, the shilouette and the weird music is just a buzzkill. He's high energy, incredibly talented, and this seems like a weird character design. It doesn't fit, and I can only imagine Omega has near full input on that too.

I hope they are running some of these ideas by guys like Billy Gunn, Dustin Runnels, and Tully Blanchard.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Muta

Show great matches, give clean wins, and make their talent the story. If done right, someone can lose and they still look like a million dollars.

And I think this is the most disappointing thing about last night.

IMO you had the opportunity to make both Mox and Omega look like stars. Give them 45 minutes to end the show and let them put on a match that could have been just a hard hitting battle that made both guys look like superstars.

Then in the end have the ruthless side of Omega come through and he ends up getting the edge on Mox when he hits the v-triggers with the kneepads removed. Have Mox kick out of a One Winged Angel, and make Omega hit it with him twice to get the pinfall.

Mox still looks strong and is protected in the loss being the only guy to kick out of the One Winged Angel.

It makes Omega look like the true superstar that he can be, and showcases this new ruthless personality.

And both guys come away looking better than they are. What they did last night didn't really protect Mox all that well IMO, and Omega comes away looking weaker as well as he went from this new ruthless personality to now more of a gutless heel.

Instead of both guys being better off, I actually feel like both guys are worse off due to this.

[CaptainCrunch]

I've never liked the Young Bucks to be honest, and the idea of their writing is just wrong to me. They've never understood psychology or story telling in the ring.



I agree they need a filter point for Khan and the rest, because yeah, the writing is too much slanted to a specific area of the IWC, that maybe are the hardcore independent fans where multi episode storylines don't happen.



Instead when I watch AEW it just feels like hotshot booking to get massive effect in one episode. Maybe its just me.



The best guy, and AEW should do everything to get him, though I'm not convinced that he would leave WWE is Paul Heyman, he's a back stage disruptor for sure, and a lot of talents out there don't trust him. But as a writer, and producer and a guy that believes in storylines and can teach the little things, and push back on the back stage writing team.


He's also exceptional at being able to project future stars.

[Ozy_Flame]

I'm still hoping they eventually sign Ryan Ward as a writer. That guy is so underrated at getting a good show in place.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

I'm still hoping they eventually sign Ryan Ward as a writer. That guy is so underrated at getting a good show in place.

He's the VP of Creative at WWE. I doubt he's jumping ship to AEW anytime soon as a writer.

[Blaster86]

I mean, my issue from the get-go with AEW is that it was giving off a lot of Early-TNA/Late WCW vibes in the booking. I think talent having the book is an awful, AWFUL idea. It never works out because they just can't help but try and get their buddies over, if not themselves. We were seeing a lot of ex-WWE talent coming in, with the thought that they had the talent and were just misused by WWE, only for them to not work out. It was touted as a NJPW-style promotion in North America, took a lot of the top North American NJPW talent but it's never really delivered that.

I'll be honest and say I've never really watched much Kenny Omega. I heard he was great, the small amount of stuff I saw was great. He really understood how to play his role as a gaijin, and when you can do that you're usually pretty good anywhere. I didn't really get into him until the Alpha vs Omega storyline. So with AEW, him coming over, I was excited because I was expecting to get the guy that had been main eventing Wrestle Kingdom and was the "Best Bout Machine". I was expecting him to be a focal point and really carry the program with Moxley and Jericho. Instead, he was the only member of the Elite without a constant focus, and other than Hangman, he was the only one I gave a #### to see. And now that he is a focus, we aren't getting the best of him. I don't mind that they are doing the IMPACT thing. I think it could work. I wish they had done a solid build up to it. I'd have loved to see something like the Styles/Nakamura build. Where Omega just can't quite seem to beat Moxley, for whatever reason, and so he starts doing more extreme things to win. Get the Elite involved first, and lose. Then go nuclear, go to his good buddy Don Callis and get him to help. But at least give me that dream match that a couple people talked about here. Show me, a north american who only had a passing knowledge of NJPW, why I should be so excited for Omega. Give me 45 minutes of Moxley and Omega. I don't think that's asking too much, is it?


The Sting thing is a joke. The Sting thing is the type of thing that the "#### the Fed" folks would absolutely #### on the WWE for, but they're lauding this like it's the best idea. A full time, multi-year deal for a guy who shouldn't be in the ring anymore, certainly not in make-up and as a regular performer. This isn't a licensing business deal by Khan. This is a mark-out moment by Khan, and I think anyone can see that the plan is to put this guy in the ring.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

He's the VP of Creative at WWE. I doubt he's jumping ship to AEW anytime soon as a writer.

I know that, but his work on NXT in 2015 and Smackdown in 2016 was pure money. Both those products were on fire, especially Smackdown after the 2016 draft.

Khan should throw buckets of money at him and offer his dad's stake in Everton to get him on board

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

I mean, my issue from the get-go with AEW is that it was giving off a lot of Early-TNA/Late WCW vibes in the booking. I think talent having the book is an awful, AWFUL idea. It never works out because they just can't help but try and get their buddies over, if not themselves. We were seeing a lot of ex-WWE talent coming in, with the thought that they had the talent and were just misused by WWE, only for them to not work out. It was touted as a NJPW-style promotion in North America, took a lot of the top North American NJPW talent but it's never really delivered that.

Exactly.

We thought we were getting the best of NJPW.

Instead we are getting late era WCW or the Main Event Mafia era of TNA.