Brad Treliving needs to go

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I could be wrong, going off of memory, but I thought I had heard that a player can not be traded back to the team that had traded him in the first place for one year.

I thought that only applied if there’s salary retention involved, bit don’t quote me on it.

[Manhattanboy]

Seems he still is the GM of the Flames. Brutal.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

If Brad would’ve sold all of Tkachuk/Gaudreau/Giordano/Brodie after 2018/19, he would’ve been a genius! He would also likely have been fired. The Flames were actively looking to make moves before this season. The problem was that nobody had cap space! There weren’t very many Blockbuster deals over the summer, and there was a reason for that. As for Brodie he was shopped, see Kadri.

You play it as though the player doesn’t have a choice as to what contract he signs. Would the Flames have been better off playing hard ball with Tkachuk? have him miss half a season? all season? so they can sign him long term? The bottom line is that a team only has control of a drafted player for 7 pro seasons(or until the player turns 27), then the player decides where to play. If a player doesn’t want to stay there’s nothing you can do. Now you have to pay young players, and their agents are the ones fighting for every UFA year.

I think it’s irrational to hold losing a player to free agency as this management’s pit fall. If they think they won’t be able to re-sign Gaudreau or Tkachuk long term they will be traded, that’s simple enough. This management made bad moves with the likes of Neal/Brouwer/Stone/Hamonic etc. The names you mentioned don’t count among them as blunders. If we’re using your strategy we’re probably better off selling every player that has a career year, then we would certainly maximize return.

You keep implying Tkachul held out for a 3 year deal when he himself said he wanted a long term deal.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I only see 3 conceivable landing spots Tre might have sold Gio to, the last being the only realistic option:

NJD - moo since Graves became available

WAS - they ended up protecting bargain contract Trevor Van Riemsdyk over Schultz and Dillon. I doubt they had an appetite to take on significant risk for a modest asset gain.

NAS - Gio would be their 6th D protected in place of 24 yo undrafted forward Tanner Jeanot


The only play I could see is NAS paying a 3rd+prospect for Gio pre ED. Then hoping to flip him for a 2nd+prospect at full salary (or 1st+ if retained) post ED. Essentially a short-term investment play...high risk-low reward for a team like NAS, hence the low acquisition cost.

Gio + Kylington (etc) out
3rd + prospect in

vs.

Gio out

The margins are thin on any deal to recoup value.

This idea that Gio had to be protected or noone would trade for him doesn't make sense. Every year teams buy rentals at the deadline. If they lost him then he's a rental. That may even be an ideal situation for some teams.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Hackey

This idea that Gio had to be protected or noone would trade for him doesn't make sense. Every year teams buy rentals at the deadline. If they lost him then he's a rental. That may even be an ideal situation for some teams.

I think it is more that the Flames were still in the playoff hunt and are not rebuilding. Would have had to be a hockey trade of some kind.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Hackey

This idea that Gio had to be protected or noone would trade for him doesn't make sense. Every year teams buy rentals at the deadline. If they lost him then he's a rental. That may even be an ideal situation for some teams.

Originally Posted by Bonded

I think it is more that the Flames were still in the playoff hunt and are not rebuilding. Would have had to be a hockey trade of some kind.

I think Bonded is correct, but also, if you call Gio a rental, he has to go to a team that can afford the cap space short term. Which contender was that?

Gio also had a LNTC, albeit with a fairly weak condition.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by Hackey

You keep implying Tkachul held out for a 3 year deal when he himself said he wanted a long term deal.

Tkachuk did miss all/most of training camp that year, so he held out for the deal he signed. I'm sure he wanted a long term deal, and he probably looked at the contracts Matthews and Marner signed as comparables. I'm sure he saw himself as an $8M+ player on a long term deal. That's me doing some guesstimating, because he certainly wasn't signing an 8 year $7M per deal. Is Tkachuk worth a lot more than that if he were to turn into a free agent this summer? You would probably still be able to sign him to an ~$8.5M contract as a UFA, because of the flat cap.

[TheScorpion]

I hope Tyler Pitlick isn't the biggest move at forward.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I hope Tyler Pitlick isn't the biggest move at forward.

The draft hasn't even started. It is a bit early to start worrying about this, especially since there is a lot of noise about the Flames being involved on numerous acquisition fronts already.

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[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Hackey

This idea that Gio had to be protected or noone would trade for him doesn't make sense. Every year teams buy rentals at the deadline. If they lost him then he's a rental. That may even be an ideal situation for some teams.

I was talking about this off-season.

It was a pretty weak TDL to be selling. The best returns went to double retained players under 1.4M, and a 2 for 1 deal for Lou to get his former guys.

There especially doesn't seem to have been much market for LHD. BOS paid a 3rd for Mike Reilly. WPG seemed keen on Oleksiak...who knows if there might have been a deal there for Gio.

Staal = 3rd+5th
J Carter = 3rd+4th

Both guys have cups and lots of playoff experience. And they are both younger than Gio. No doubt Gio is the superior player at this point, but there just wasn't the demand for a guy like him.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I hope Tyler Pitlick isn't the biggest move at forward.

You must be losing your hair from all your worry.

Let’s wait to see how things play out.


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[MillerTime GFG]

If there isn’t a significant change made, there is little point in watching next season if you’re watching for success. I’ll be livid if we stand pat.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

Tkachuk did miss all/most of training camp that year, so he held out for the deal he signed. I'm sure he wanted a long term deal, and he probably looked at the contracts Matthews and Marner signed as comparables. I'm sure he saw himself as an $8M+ player on a long term deal. That's me doing some guesstimating, because he certainly wasn't signing an 8 year $7M per deal. Is Tkachuk worth a lot more than that if he were to turn into a free agent this summer? You would probably still be able to sign him to an ~$8.5M contract as a UFA, because of the flat cap.

If he wants to sign here. I think Brad thought the team was on the rise so getting a deal done after the bridge would be easy. Not so sure it will be now. Tkachuk has all the leverage and can pretty much decide his fate. Massive contract if he wants or head to free agency if he wants.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I hope Tyler Pitlick isn't the biggest move at forward.

Least of my worries. We know Treliving will spend to the cap and he still has money.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by MillerTime GFG

If there isn’t a significant change made, there is little point in watching next season if you’re watching for success. I’ll be livid if we stand pat.

My biggest concern is we won't get the trades/signings we really want, but will sign leftover free agents because we have to go to backup plans to fill the roster.

I don't want Tre to overpay for players but we could get left settling for lesser players.
In fairness, I was really happy with signing Markstrom & Tanev last year, so hopefully BT pulls off his targets.

[MillerTime GFG]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

My biggest concern is we won't get the trades/signings we really want, but will sign leftover free agents because we have to go to backup plans to fill the roster.

I don't want Tre to overpay for players but we could get left settling for lesser players.
In fairness, I was really happy with signing Markstrom & Tanev last year, so hopefully BT pulls off his targets.

If we don’t get the trades we want, then that’s on Tre. No more excuses in my opinion. If the market isn’t great for our core players, then our core players aren’t great. Either way, we ain’t winning with them so make the changes already. Rip the bandaid.

I was happy with Tanev and Markstrom too, but given our lack of success with them, it just further highlights our problem.

[868904]

If Treliving lands Eichel tommorow, will that get the haters off his back or will the complaints be about paying too much?

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by 868904

If Treliving lands Eichel tommorow, will that get the haters off his back or will the complaints be about paying too much?

No

The team needs to be a contender otherwise he is a failure

I know a team that has mcdavid and still a loser

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by 868904

If Treliving lands Eichel tommorow, will that get the haters off his back or will the complaints be about paying too much?

I don’t think anything short of a cup will get the haters off his back. It always takes (at least) 2 teams to make a trade. A player has to want to sign in Calgary, so we can sign him. It seems that if a good signing/trade happens it’s Brad’s fault for not taking advantage.

All the criticism is pointless anyways. I get that people want to be realistic, but we’re going to cheer for the Flames regardless. There will be good moves, bad moves, and lots of average play. At the end of the day I just hope the players play like they care. I want them to start on time, and be a hard team to play against. Hopefully a team that hates to lose.

[Moneyhands23]

I actually want to see him sign Johnny to a fair contract. Then either sign or trade Tkachuk, I'd prefer he is signed and wants to be the captain. Then just keep making picks and moving guys when needed.