The Democratic Presidential Nomination 2020

[AltaGuy]

I think Trump presents the most unifying and best strategy for Democrats. As the “big tent” party, a heavy focus on policy will lead to infighting between the moderates and left; and even in those broad categories, the candidates have myriad views.

Republicans find it easy to unite behind hatred of HRC, Obama, and dog whistles - time for Dems to do the same.

The institution of democracy is under threat from the right - foreign meddling, money, lies, gerrymandering. That should be the main plank of any Democrat’s messaging. Worked in the midterms.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Red Slinger

Yeah, I think the Democrats have to focus on policy and how they intend to make a positive difference rather than put all of their eggs in the 'Trump is bad' basket. Everyone knows he's a SOB but he's their SOB. The Democrats have to demonstrate how they will make people's lives better.

The people who drive the agenda - the pundits, journalists, academics, activists, and entertainers - need to get out of their bubble and realize that not only are they unrepresentative of Americans, they aren't even representative of Democrats.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/...real-life.html

Twitter and it's 24/7 obsession with Trump is a niche within a niche within a niche. You can say the same for other social media platforms and pop sub-cultures dominated by small numbers of extremely online partisans. If Democrat strategists get their talking points from Twitter, Saturday Night Live, and Samantha Bee, they'll be playing right into the hands of Republicans.

[Nyah]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

If Democrat strategists get their talking points from Twitter, Saturday Night Live, and Samantha Bee, they'll be playing right into the hands of Republicans.

I've posted this here before, but it certainly bears reminding that smug late night talk show hosts do more damage to the Democrats than good. This is a long but great read from Caitlin Flanagan at The Atlantic.

How Late-Night Comedy Fueled the Rise of Trump

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...-trump/521472/

Though aimed at blue-state sophisticates, these shows are an unintended but powerful form of propaganda for conservatives. When Republicans see these harsh jokes—which echo down through the morning news shows and the chattering day’s worth of viral clips, along with those of Jimmy Kimmel, Stephen Colbert, and Seth Meyers—they don’t just see a handful of comics mocking them. They see HBO, Comedy Central, TBS, ABC, CBS, and NBC. In other words, they see exactly what Donald Trump has taught them: that the entire media landscape loathes them, their values, their family, and their religion.

No wonder so many of Trump’s followers are inclined to believe only the things that he or his spokespeople tell them directly—everyone else on the tube thinks they’re a bunch of trailer-park, Oxy-snorting half-wits who divide their time between retweeting Alex Jones fantasies and ironing their Klan hoods.

But somewhere along the way, the hosts of the late-night shows decided that they had carte blanche to insult not just the people within this administration, but also the ordinary citizens who support Trump, and even those who merely identify as conservatives. In March, Samantha Bee’s show issued a formal apology to a young man who had attended the Conservative Political Action Conference and whom the show had blasted for having “Nazi hair.” As it turned out, the young man was suffering from Stage 4 brain cancer—which a moment’s research on the producers’ part would have revealed: He had tweeted about his frightening diagnosis days before the conference...

...I’ve thought about that a lot—but I’ve also thought a good deal about the boy on Samantha Bee’s program. I thought about the moment her producer approached the child’s mother to sign a release so that the woman’s young son could be humiliated on television. Was it a satisfying moment, or was it accompanied by a small glint of recognition that embarrassing children is a crappy way to make a living? I thought about the boy waiting eagerly to see himself on television, feeling a surge of pride that he’d talked about church and Bible study. And I thought about the moment when he realized that it had all been a trick—that the grown-up who had seemed so nice had only wanted to hurt him.

My God, I thought. What have we become?

[GirlySports]

Democrats shoot themselves in the foot all the time.

One cannot be progressive and mock people who have different views simultaneously.

If you're progressive you're progressive. You accept all views to advance society forward.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Democrats shoot themselves in the foot all the time.

One cannot be progressive and mock people who have different views simultaneously.

If you're progressive you're progressive. You accept all views to advance society forward.

Disagree. All views includes white supremicists, nazis, totaliatarians, climate change deniers, etc.

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Democrats shoot themselves in the foot all the time.

One cannot be progressive and mock people who have different views simultaneously.

If you're progressive you're progressive. You accept all views to advance society forward.

I'm going to mock this view: you accept "all views?" Not all views are equal - facts remain facts, much to Republicans' chagrin - and those mean, mocking progressives are hardly the major problem facing modern society.

I do think the fracturing of the Democratic party is an issue. There is a white, liberal elite setting the mainstream agenda, and I agree with Cliff and Nyah above that there is an undercurrent of elitism and NIMBYism that flows through much of current Democratic discourse. And my own, truth be told.

My major problem with a focus on it - however - is what is the alternative? The Republicans have become a dangerous neo-fascist party. They cheat. If the other side isn't playing by the rulebook, the first thing to do is to focus on re-establishing some rules. I can recognize that Russian influence on the election had far less of an effect than say, Citizen's United, but they're part and parcel, and I believe foreign meddling offers an opportunity for cohesion that the Democratic party needs to prevent the power grabs of Republicans.

What is the end goal of pointing out that the Democratic party doesn't represent workers anymore? Or that the liberal elites don't see eye-to-eye with minority voters? Or that Bernie is too far left for the suburbanites? It's just reinforcing divisions, fracturing a broad tent - somewhat ironically for those who decry "identity politics." That's why right-wing media are very happy to point out that Betty in midtown Manhattan doesn't represent the same viewpoint as Juan in the Bronx.

There is no easy way for a massive country to align classes, races, cultures, educations, and experiences under the tent of the Democratic Party. But, it's a two-party system, and one party is throwing out the democratic rulebook. Mostly because demographics are not on their side.

It's always going to be an uneasy truce in the Democratic Party. It's a huge mess of divergent viewpoints and competing interests. Whichever candidate emerges from the fray will need to attract and entice a huge swath of very different people to vote for them. To me, that means attacking the Republicans and what they've become. Worry about internal division once the rules have been agreed upon once more.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by Nyah

I've posted this here before, but it certainly bears reminding that smug late night talk show hosts do more damage to the Democrats than good. This is a long but great read from Caitlin Flanagan at The Atlantic.

snowflakes are going to vote Republican anyways.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Disagree. All views includes white supremicists, nazis, totaliatarians, climate change deniers, etc.

Accept all views. Debate them. And break them down.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Democrats shoot themselves in the foot all the time.

One cannot be progressive and mock people who have different views simultaneously.

If you're progressive you're progressive. You accept all views to advance society forward.

yet Republicans, can mock people who have different views, and be regressive, and that's ok?

[Nyah]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

yet Republicans, can mock people who have different views, and be regressive, and that's ok?

No! Why is it always whataboutism with you? It's not okay to mock people with different views, period. Not when Republicans do it, not when Democrats do it, not when the right does it, not when the left does it. It should be called out regardless of who's doing it as it erodes discourse and furthers political division.

[GirlySports]

Atlaguy. The Republicans can cheat all they want but there just arent enough of them. If it wasn't for Trump I'm not sure the GOP would win another presidential election. The voting class is younger and more progressive. We are global.

So it's basically a get out the vote machine.

The election is 17 months away

Which candidate will excite people?
What is the ground game like?
What steps are needed to get voters registered?
What organization is needed to get people out to vote on voting day?
People cant take a day off work to vote, can a fund be started?

Democrats cant do nothing and then complain that xxx didn't come out to vote. Address these issues now.

There was a article posted earlier that democratic presidential candidates were using Google translate for the Spanish version of there website. Get that #### straightened out.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

yet Republicans, can mock people who have different views, and be regressive, and that's ok?

I think it is ok. It's the platform you present.

The Republicans are regressive and dont apologize for it.
Thats their consistent gameplan. We dont have to vote for them.

The Democrats are progressive and inclusive.
But not really. That's the issue.

For example, Democrats are for womens rights.
Not really. What if I'm a pro-life housewife? Do a fit in? Im a woman. What are my rights? Or will they throw me out of the march?

They are pro-some-specific-womens-rights. You have to fit they're niche. That is the problem.

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

Atlaguy. The Republicans can cheat all they want but there just arent enough of them. If it wasn't for Trump I'm not sure the GOP would win another presidential election. The voting class is younger and more progressive. We are global.

So it's basically a get out the vote machine.

The election is 17 months away

Which candidate will excite people?
What is the ground game like?
What steps are needed to get voters registered?
What organization is needed to get people out to vote on voting day?
People cant take a day off work to vote, can a fund be started?

Democrats cant do nothing and then complain that xxx didn't come out to vote. Address these issues now.

There was a article posted earlier that democratic presidential candidates were using Google translate for the Spanish version of there website. Get that #### straightened out.

Haha - you know what's really not going to excite the American public? A candidate's political machinery.

I don't disagree, of course - a healthy ground game and good political organization are necessary to defeat Trump. I think it's a very positive outlook for Democrats that the midterms showed increased enthusiasm and better organization with much-improved turnout.

What the Democrats absolutely must not do is allow this crowded field to wreck party cohesion. If a dozen jilted Democratic contenders take their ball and go home, and focus on ripping into whomever is up against Trump, that's when things get really bad. See: HRC and Bernie.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by Nyah

No! Why is it always whataboutism with you? It's not okay to mock people with different views, period. Not when Republicans do it, not when Democrats do it, not when the right does it, not when the left does it. It should be called out regardless of who's doing it as it erodes discourse and furthers political division.

I'm just saying 99% of the things people keep saying the Dems are guilty of and will bring them down, easily, easily applies to the Republicans and their base. But because they are lowIQ snowflakes, we should only point out the Dems dong it, just ignore the fact the Repubs are doing the same x 10.

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

The Democrats are progressive and inclusive.
But not really. That's the issue.

For example, Democrats are for womens rights.
Not really. What if I'm a pro-life housewife? Do a fit in? Im a woman. What are my rights? Or will they throw me out of the march?

I'm not sure, how does it work for pro-choice Republican women marching in a white power parade?

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by DuffMan

I'm not sure, how does it work for pro-choice Republican women marching in a white power parade?

I think it would be fine, cause "white" is the point of the march.

There is too much mixed messaging on the democratic side and I think what Altaguy fears will happen, the candidates will tear each other apart, especially with Biden in the race now.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by AltaGuy

Haha - you know what's really not going to excite the American public? A candidate's political machinery.

That's behind the scenes stuff.
The stuff the DNC should be doing regardless of who the candidate will be.

Everyone's favorite person, Jordan Peterson, is currently helping the Democrats put this in place now.

[CliffFletcher]

The Democrats are a coalition. But the social elites in the party (and in America as a whole) have become so homegenous in their beliefs, and spend so much of their time in their bubbles, that they've begun to act as though they have consensus on a host of issues. There aren't enough educated, liberal, white, urban voters who watch Jimmy Kimmel and devote 7 hours a week to sharing how much they hate Trump to win a general election.

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The Democrats are a coalition. But the social elites in the party (and in America as a whole) have become so homegenous in their beliefs, and spend so much of their time in their bubbles, that they've begun to act as though they have consensus on a host of issues. There aren't enough educated, liberal, white, urban voters who watch Jimmy Kimmel and devote 7 hours a week to sharing how much they hate Trump to win a general election.

So which of the Democratic challengers best represents your view? Who is outside of the bubble?

[DuffMan]

Originally Posted by AltaGuy

So which of the Democratic challengers best represents your view? Who is outside of the bubble?

the racist, homophobic, xenophobic, gun loving, anti vax, Obama is a Kenyan, NO COLLUSION NO OBSTRUCTION, god loving old white dude on faux, could win, oh wait.