Ongoing thread for Neal/Lucic discussion - Page 163 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

powderjunkie · 10-13-2019, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bingo

Just amazed how many people are making season long decisions about a roster after five games.

I'm sure you know most people are talking about the last 10 games.

Neal's inability to fit into the lineup (and the team's inability to fit him in) is a concern that goes a little deeper than just Neal.

I've long questioned whether you can win a Stanley Cup with Gaudreau and Monahan as your two best forwards. And I really like them both. But the lineup options are pretty limited when they can't be separated and need a certain kind of player to fill out their line.

If Lindholm and Tkachuk are actually our two best forwards, we may be on to something (Bergeron-Marchand?). The team is still struggling to figure out the 6th guy of the top 6. I'm not saying Neal would have been the right long term solution, but it seems likely that he could have at least pushed his trade value higher than Lucic's contract.

ricardodw · 10-13-2019, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bingo

No they didn't get a spectacular playoff performance out of him. They got production sure, but if a player is getting run in five on five play he's a detriment to the team because his defense exceeds his goal impact.

That was my point. He was ranked 18th in xGF% out of 22 skaters in that post season. That's a bad hockey player. He got some puck luck but he certainly wasn't spectacular.

I guess that coach Gallant missed that memo.... he played him 4th most ice time of all his forwards over 20 games the like of which Gio (for example) has never experienced).

he had 6 goals in 20 games tied for 3rd on the team

I would take Coach Gallant's judgement over your puck possession analysis 10 time out of 10.

You wrote a intense article on how bad Neal was with the Flames compared to his last 3 years and how he might be close to getting back to meeting expectations

Both you and I loved it in the poll after the UFA signing. That was a big surprise for me as I am against big UFA signings most of the time

mrdonkey · 10-13-2019, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bingo

Just amazed how many people are making season long decisions about a roster after five games.

Five games, the playoffs, and most of the season post-ASB with a virtually identical roster.

redforever · 10-13-2019, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

The Brouwer, Neal signings really set the Flames back both on te ice and in terms of cap flexibility. Despite how bad both Brouwer and Neal played they still got ice time. Some poor decisions overall leading to some wasted opportunities. That said this is still a strong Flames team, and should make an impact this season.

The Morrison signing never impressed me either, although it was probably the best of the 3 free agent signings. All 3 were has beens.

Jiri Hrdina · 10-13-2019, 05:09 PM

^Both of his contracts were close to league minimum and he scored 43 points in his first year. Weird to group him in with those others

Textcritic · 10-13-2019, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrdonkey

Five games, the playoffs, and most of the season post-ASB with a virtually identical roster.

Maybe it means something; maybe it means nothing at all. I get why people are anxious this early, but those of us who prefer to take a measured approach are not doing so because we are content to ignore problems. It is because we have seen how misleading the first few weeks of the new NHL season are every single year. Why should this year be any different?

Stay Golden · 10-13-2019, 06:09 PM

As long as Lucic continues to play with an edge the Flames are still better off without Neal.
He was out of shape and played very lazy last year with CGY.
The trade was a big wake up call for Neal and his sucess with the Greasers is early. I suspect he will fall back into his lazy habits by Dec1.

the_only_turek_fan · 10-13-2019, 06:56 PM

Anyone listen to 31 Thoughts?

Friedman alluded to Neal coming to Calgary talking about Vegas all the time and it didn’t go over well. Something along those lines.

Zoller · 10-13-2019, 07:18 PM

I was thinking of the worst case scenario for this trade.

What if Neal scores 40 this year, oilers win the cup, and Neal scores the cup winning goal in overtime.

Would that qualify this trade as the worst trade of all time for Calgary?

Also what does everyone think the current worst trade is?

powderjunkie · 10-13-2019, 07:22 PM

Will these October games be meaningless if the Oilers beat us to the last playoff spot by a point or two?

GreenLantern2814 · 10-13-2019, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redforever

The Morrison signing never impressed me either, although it was probably the best of the 3 free agent signings. All 3 were has beens.

Brendan Morrison? What? 43 points in 66 games before a dirty knee ruined his career?

Why do you have a problem with that one? It's one of the least offensive transactions in team history

Manhattanboy · 10-13-2019, 07:23 PM

Neal does not need to score 40 nor does EDM need to win the cup for this to qualify as the worst deal ever crafted by a CGY general manager.

DeluxeMoustache · 10-13-2019, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Neal does not need to score 40 nor does EDM need to win the cup for this to qualify as the worst deal ever crafted by a CGY general manager.

No, no matter what happens, this deal will never qualify for that

EldrickOnIce · 10-14-2019, 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Will these October games be meaningless if the Oilers beat us to the last playoff spot by a point or two?

Oil are over 40% on PP and scoring on more than 25% of their shots.

Zoller · 10-14-2019, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

No, no matter what happens, this deal will never qualify for that

So what is the worst trade of all time for the Flames?

And how could it be worse than the theoretical situation where Neal scores 40+ and the Stanley Cup winning goal for the Oilers? I have to admit, I can't think of a worse trade off the top of my head.

Strange Brew · 10-14-2019, 08:43 AM

The Gilmour trade to the Leafs is the worst. Even if Neal does all of that, which is next to impossible, the Gilmour trade gutted the team for next to nothing in return.

If you're going to imagine this worst case scenario, what if Hamilton wins the Norris and the Hurricanes win the Cup? I would say that is more likely.

Shazam · 10-14-2019, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

Neal does not need to score 40 nor does EDM need to win the cup for this to qualify as the worst deal ever crafted by a CGY general manager.

Oh to be young. Riser says "hold my beer".

gt4flames · 10-14-2019, 09:21 AM

I just hope that third rounder turns into a Gostisbehere.

Flames1217 · 10-14-2019, 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gt4flames

I just hope that third rounder turns into a Gostisbehere.

Or Point

Erick Estrada · 10-14-2019, 09:39 AM

I sure hope the scouts are working overtime this season as that 3rd round pick may be the lone chance of the Flames erasing egg on their face with this deal. They did it with the Baertschi trade so it can be done. Another thing that doesn't get discussed enough is the fact that the Flames are only getting a 3rd round pick for the scenario of Neal outscoring Lucic. IMO Treliving really should have pushed harder to get a 2nd round pick as it's not like Holland had other offers on the table for Lucic as I feel personally they were probably giddy that the trade was even being entertained by the Flames. A few weeks of sitting on their hands and I have a feeling the Oilers come back and take the deal. Just seems like Treliving didn't play this very well.