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Old 10-08-2019, 10:26 AM   #8641
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Its funny how the debate is just a restate anyways.



Singh - The big corporations are the enemy. They are cheaters and evil and holding everyone else down
May - Climate Emergency we're all going to die. Oil is evil hello to my friends in BC
Scheer - Trudeau is an enemy of the people, he's going to tax and spend everyone into the poor house, he's a liar and complete dirt bag.
Blanchette - Leave Quebec alone, we can do what we want no matter how noxious, this is my middle finger, eat it.
Bernier - Immigration is evil, shut up you bunch of socialists.

Trudeau - Harper Harper Harper
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:27 AM   #8642
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I know everyone likes tax cuts, but it seems every election they promise to cut taxes, and often follow through. But at some point, we still have to pay our bills, with taxes. At what point have we cut to much? It seems like it has been decades since taxes have increased. This seems unsustainable to me.
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:30 AM   #8643
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I honestly think that the debate format was worthless.



Between all the yelling to get heard and the short time streams per leader its a useless excercise in sound bite creation.


If they want to make this work maybe the main debate has to set limits on leaders that you have to not only run candidates in like 75% of the ridings but you have to have at least 10 seats in the last debate. If they want they can set up a minor party debate that's streamed on the internet or something. But last nights debate was a uninformitive mess and frankly if you cut out te Bloc and Bernier and probably the Green Party it gives time for the parties that can actually form the government.
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:36 AM   #8644
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Can they not just silence microphones for 45 seconds? Seems a really easy solution to the problem. One mic at a time.
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:37 AM   #8645
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It should be like qualifying.

May, Bernier and Blanchette have a debate. The journalist vote like in the NHL awards and the winner gets to join Trudeau, Scheer and Singh in the big debate.
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:46 AM   #8646
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GirlySports View Post
It should be like qualifying.

May, Bernier and Blanchette have a debate. The journalist vote like in the NHL awards and the winner gets to join Trudeau, Scheer and Singh in the big debate.

Sell advertising, halfway through the debate throw a knife on the floor and tell them that you are holding tryouts for the main debate.


Budget debt vanishes
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:49 AM   #8647
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I know everyone likes tax cuts, but it seems every election they promise to cut taxes, and often follow through. But at some point, we still have to pay our bills, with taxes. At what point have we cut to much? It seems like it has been decades since taxes have increased. This seems unsustainable to me.
Canada's combined provincial and federal tax takes are among the highest in the developed world. The average Canadian now pays more taxes than they spend on food, shelter, and clothing. Almost 50% of every dollar made goes towards taxes, which is a huge increase from years ago.
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Old 10-08-2019, 10:49 AM   #8648
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So may myths and false narratives around equalization.

Manitoba, Nova Scotia, New Brunswick, and PEI are all more reliant on equalization than Quebec.

Equalization Payments as % of Total Provincial Revenue (2017-18)


Québec 9.4
Manitoba 11.8
Nova Scotia 15.6
New Brunswick 18.5
Ontario 1.0
PEI 20.6


And only a fraction of the fiscal gap between Alberta taxes and spending are due to equalization. For instance, the GST transfer is almost as high as the equalization transfer, and that's simply because Alberta spend a lot more per capita than typical Canadians.

The biggest factor, by far, is income taxes. Basically, there are more working people earning higher salaries in Alberta than in other provinces. No changes to the equalization formula - or even scrapping the program altogether - will change that.


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Old 10-08-2019, 10:56 AM   #8649
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Originally Posted by crazy_eoj View Post
Almost 50% of every dollar made goes towards taxes, which is a huge increase from years ago.
Citation needed.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:04 AM   #8650
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Originally Posted by crazy_eoj View Post
Canada's combined provincial and federal tax takes are among the highest in the developed world. The average Canadian now pays more taxes than they spend on food, shelter, and clothing. Almost 50% of every dollar made goes towards taxes, which is a huge increase from years ago.
Is this correct? It doesn't sound correct to me.



In the past I have also looked at taxes in Texas, and once you add health care premiums Texans actually pay more of their income to taxes and healthcare than we do. So I'm not sure I buy that stat.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:06 AM   #8651
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Originally Posted by White Out 403 View Post
It would have been best for him to not answer that and do a political dodge. By answering it honestly he will only give pearl clutches an excuse to freak out.
lol

Had he avoided the question, you and everyone else who is looking for reasons to dislike him, would have jumped all over it and started playing the 'Secret agenda! Boogeyman!' card.

Loudly.

You know you would.

The pro-life, pro-choice debate is deeply personal. And unless someone tries to legislate on it (they wouldn't), it is irrelevant to federal politics. He answered the question honestly. Good for him.

You having a problem with him answering honestly, is on you.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:08 AM   #8652
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzz View Post
I know everyone likes tax cuts, but it seems every election they promise to cut taxes, and often follow through. But at some point, we still have to pay our bills, with taxes. At what point have we cut to much? It seems like it has been decades since taxes have increased. This seems unsustainable to me.
My taxes, both federal and provincial, are higher than 4 years ago. Not so many decades.

And yes, I tend to think half of what I earn going to taxes is a very fair share.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:12 AM   #8653
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My taxes, both federal and provincial, are higher than 4 years ago. Not so many decades.

And yes, I tend to think half of what I earn going to taxes is a very fair share.
And other than that year your taxes have never been lower.

It’s also unlikely that half your income goes to taxes. Your marginal rate may be near 50% but the actual rate you pay on al your income is less. Even including GST and property taxes you probably don’t get there.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:16 AM   #8654
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There are more taxes than just income taxes.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:18 AM   #8655
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So just looking at federal taxes at the table here, and I'll focus on the second column since that's where most Canadians are(present company excluded, of course!).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income...inal_tax_rates

They have decreased from 26% in 1998 to 20.5% today. GST was also 7% then.

In Alberta, business tax rates have dropped as well:

https://www.alberta.ca/about-tax-lev...aspx#corporate

I can't find historical Alberta rates, but I assume it has been 10% since Ralph's days, with a minor increase recently. So adding all this up, I don't see how we are possibly paying more than ever, or even 50%. Yes, I know there are things like gas tax and property tax that aren't captured, but they haven't increased enough to override the decreases elsewhere, I don't think.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:30 AM   #8656
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Originally Posted by Fuzz View Post
So just looking at federal taxes at the table here, and I'll focus on the second column since that's where most Canadians are(present company excluded, of course!).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income...inal_tax_rates

They have decreased from 26% in 1998 to 20.5% today. GST was also 7% then.

In Alberta, business tax rates have dropped as well:

https://www.alberta.ca/about-tax-lev...aspx#corporate

I can't find historical Alberta rates, but I assume it has been 10% since Ralph's days, with a minor increase recently. So adding all this up, I don't see how we are possibly paying more than ever, or even 50%. Yes, I know there are things like gas tax and property tax that aren't captured, but they haven't increased enough to override the decreases elsewhere, I don't think.
Add in: Provincial Sales Taxes, Fuel Taxes, Payroll taxes, Property Taxes, Liquor Taxes, Tobacco Taxes, Carbon Taxes, Health Taxes, Excise Taxes, among others. Combined they are almost equal to income taxes for an average family.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:31 AM   #8657
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Your original question was has there been a tax increase in decades. The answer to that is yes, in the last 4 years.

And yes you are correct that marginal tax rates are around the 50% mark, depending on the province. Several are over 50, here in Alberta we are just under. When I go to work tomorrow, half of what I make will be instantly gone to income tax, before we even talk about any other taxes that will take effect on that money.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:35 AM   #8658
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Originally Posted by Fuzz View Post
So just looking at federal taxes at the table here, and I'll focus on the second column since that's where most Canadians are(present company excluded, of course!).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income...inal_tax_rates

They have decreased from 26% in 1998 to 20.5% today. GST was also 7% then.

In Alberta, business tax rates have dropped as well:

https://www.alberta.ca/about-tax-lev...aspx#corporate

I can't find historical Alberta rates, but I assume it has been 10% since Ralph's days, with a minor increase recently. So adding all this up, I don't see how we are possibly paying more than ever, or even 50%. Yes, I know there are things like gas tax and property tax that aren't captured, but they haven't increased enough to override the decreases elsewhere, I don't think.
You're cherry-picking one tax bracket though. And $46k - $93K is not the same thing as it was in 1998. The highest tax rate has risen from 29 to 33%, which is a 13.8% increase.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:37 AM   #8659
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So just looking at federal taxes at the table here, and I'll focus on the second column since that's where most Canadians are(present company excluded, of course!).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Income...inal_tax_rates

They have decreased from 26% in 1998 to 20.5% today. GST was also 7% then.

In Alberta, business tax rates have dropped as well:

https://www.alberta.ca/about-tax-lev...aspx#corporate

I can't find historical Alberta rates, but I assume it has been 10% since Ralph's days, with a minor increase recently. So adding all this up, I don't see how we are possibly paying more than ever, or even 50%. Yes, I know there are things like gas tax and property tax that aren't captured, but they haven't increased enough to override the decreases elsewhere, I don't think.
I suspect people are including CPP, EI, etc. But even with all that included, even the Fraser Institute has it well below 50%. They have the "average" family income in Alberta being $138K. I have no idea how they arrive at that figure, they claim they do it by removing "outliers", but I suspect there's some funny math to drive the average up to make the tax burden look higher.

But regardless, at a net income of $138K after deductions, they have the tax burden for an Alberta family including income tax, CPP/payroll taxes, sales tax, property tax, profits tax (whatever that is), Liquor/tobacco/excise taxes, auto/fuel/carbon taxes + vehicle license fees, other taxes, import duties, and natural resource levies being 38.4%.

And some of the figures they use are laughably inflated. The "average" family in BC apparently pays almost $5K in property taxes in their model, which in a place like Vancouver or Victoria is about $2M worth of real estate.


As for historical rates, they have Alberta's "tax freedom day" being the earliest it has been as far back as their chart goes (to 1981) which would suggest that rates are lower than ever.
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Old 10-08-2019, 11:38 AM   #8660
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Add in: Provincial Sales Taxes, Fuel Taxes, Payroll taxes, Property Taxes, Liquor Taxes, Tobacco Taxes, Carbon Taxes, Health Taxes, Excise Taxes, among others. Combined they are almost equal to income taxes for an average family.
But most of those existed before thoguh I'm not sure what a "health tax" is, but if it is premiums, well, we got rid of that. And we don't have a PST. Liqour taxes and cigarette taxes are voluntary. So the carbon tax is the only new one. The question was, what evidence is there that taxes have increased, and the facts I posted indicates that they haven't, they have decreased. Unless you can show the remaining ones I didn't look at have increased, I'm left with looking at the facts I have, which disprove your assertion.
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