Official (Alberta) Oil Discussion Thread

[puckedoff]

^ That calls for double meat, even if it means putting the cost on the line of credit.

[Fuzz]

Cenovus Energy is sending a shipment of crude oil down through the Panama Canal as part of its first-ever transaction with New Brunswick's Irving Oil.


The oil shipment will make the 11,900-kilometre journey to Irving's refinery in Saint John by tanker ship, Cenovus announced in a social media post on Wednesday.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...635939?cmp=rss


The good ship "No More Pipelines" begins it's ludicrous journey. Let's wish her well! May many more follow her expeditious trade route.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...635939?cmp=rss


The good ship "No More Pipelines" begins it's ludicrous journey. Let's wish her well! May many more follow her expeditious trade route.

I thought this was a joke.

I had to double check that it wasnt The Beaverton or The Onion.

Everyone who protested and opposed Energy East should be lined up and kicked swiftly and firmly in the groin. Repeatedly.

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...635939?cmp=rss


The good ship "No More Pipelines" begins it's ludicrous journey. Let's wish her well! May many more follow her expeditious trade route.

I was following that ship on marine traffic.com (I like to track tankers out of Vancouver) and wondered if this was the first voyage into stupidity that is uniquely Canada. On the website the destination is just Panama but this article confirmed that is indeed headed for Saint John. Great job gang. That ship left Vancouver on June 18, and it’ll be lucky to get to Saint John before July 18. At least a month to deliver half of what EE would bring in per day. Thinking more about this, maybe if the TMX can fuel this stupid voyage consistently and it’s driven into easterners heads that it makes no sense we could get some traction going for an energy east pipeline. Especially once keystone gets killed by Biden

And with TMX it’s great that this consultation chapter is concluded but we’re still looking down the barrel of over two years of construction. We are now moving from legal obstruction to extra legal obstruction by groups that have no regard for our laws, economy, or national security. What will they try? Another rail blockade? Equipment sabotage like what happened in Merrit this year? Anything’s possible. This is my biggest fear now, you have a highly motivated eco radical movement that has no shame, and a weak federal government. That’s a bad combo for moving a project along on time, we’re going to be very fortunate if we see oil flowing before the end of 2022.

[CaptainCrunch]

Wonder what the cost is for what is basically a 30 day cruise of one days worth of Oil?


While running tankers through sensitive environmental areas for no good reason.


This is so stupid.

[you&me]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Wonder what the cost is for what is basically a 30 day cruise of one days worth of Oil?


While running tankers through sensitive environmental areas for no good reason.


This is so stupid.

Back when producers & oil traders were looking at off shore tankers as a means of storage, I recall reading an article that said super tanker rental had spiked to ~$200k per day, up from a normal price of ~$16k.

So, presumably rates have normalized and it's costing Cenovus around $20k per day, plus expenses that would be in addition to floating storage like fuel and crew, so let's round up to $1mm for the 30 day journey.

The tanker Cenovus is using (Cabo de Hornos) has a capacity of roughly 550,000 bbl, so it's costing Cenovus (very roughly) $2 per barrel for this farce.

[DiracSpike]

I’ve read that it’s like $30,000/day for a tanker this size. Adding in the Panama transit fees and dividing by the capacity of the ship at 600,000 bbls it’s like $2/bbl. Which, for the record, is pretty close to the cost to ship by pipeline so it’s not necessarily an economic inefficiency, ironically it’s an environmental and strategic inefficiency. A bunch of carbon emissions for nothing. Also EE would have supplanted a tonne of ship traffic thru the gulf of st Lawrence and the river itself, which was supposedly something environmentalist cared about. But whatever, I’m still waiting for common sense to reign in this situation but I’ve been waiting a long time.

[cal_guy]

Originally Posted by you&me

Back when producers & oil traders were looking at off shore tankers as a means of storage, I recall reading an article that said super tanker rental had spiked to ~$200k per day, up from a normal price of ~$16k.

So, presumably rates have normalized and it's costing Cenovus around $20k per day, plus expenses that would be in addition to floating storage like fuel and crew, so let's round up to $1mm for the 30 day journey.

The tanker Cenovus is using (Cabo de Hornos) has a capacity of roughly 550,000 bbl, so it's costing Cenovus (very roughly) $2 per barrel for this farce.

The illustrative tolls presented to NEB for Energy East were $9.20 per barrel for a 10 year subscription.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...635939?cmp=rss


The good ship "No More Pipelines" begins it's ludicrous journey. Let's wish her well! May many more follow her expeditious trade route.

This is so ####ing stupid.

I cannot believe as a country that we cannot get behind the logic, rational, and just flat out common sense to have a pipeline to do this, which is considerably cheaper (I imagine), more efficient, and safer which is aligned with being more environmentally friendly.

Idiotic.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Joborule

This is so ####ing stupid.

I cannot believe as a country that we cannot get behind the logic, rational, and just flat out common sense to have a pipeline to do this, which is considerably cheaper (I imagine), more efficient, and safer which is aligned with being more environmentally friendly.

Idiotic.

It's beyond stupid, it's a national embarrassment.

[cal_guy]

Originally Posted by Joborule

This is so ####ing stupid.

I cannot believe as a country that we cannot get behind the logic, rational, and just flat out common sense to have a pipeline to do this, which is considerably cheaper (I imagine), more efficient, and safer which is aligned with being more environmentally friendly.

Idiotic.

Because oil pipelines are really expensive to build and operate. The tanker trip costs less than the tolls on TransMountain.

[Derek Sutton]

Originally Posted by cal_guy

Because oil pipelines are really expensive to build and operate. The tanker trip costs less than the tolls on TransMountain.

You do realize that a pipeline would provide an infinite supply right? Like way more then what a tanker can deliver.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by cal_guy

Because oil pipelines are really expensive to build and operate. The tanker trip costs less than the tolls on TransMountain.

Yeah that’s the reason there are protests. The cost to the oil companies.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by cal_guy

Because oil pipelines are really expensive to build and operate. The tanker trip costs less than the tolls on TransMountain.

[cal_guy]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

Yeah that’s the reason there are protests. The cost to the oil companies.

Transmountain is a common carrier pipeline regulated by the CER which means that tolls are set to compensate the owner for the original capital costs plus a bit more for profit. That means the pipeline can't jack up prices on shippers.

[troutman]

How many tankers would have to arrive every month to equal the amount that could be delivered by pipeline?

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by nik-

It's beyond stupid, it's a national embarrassment.

Another example of Quebec making things worse for spurious reasons.

At the very least, sometime in the mid ‘20s this egress nightmare will hopefully be over with pipelines to a coast flowing, minimal diff, and curtailment policy ended. At the point, the current situation we find ourselves in of the west being choked back with a high differential while the east imports copious amounts of premium priced world cruse, a true national embarrassment and economic calamity, will at least be half over. At the point the east can import our oil, or not, it’d be nice if they did I guess but the benefit of reaching the ocean is that it no longer matters who purchases it. If Quebec wants to support Saudi and Angola that’s their prerogative.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by troutman

How many tankers would have to arrive every month to equal the amount that could be delivered by pipeline?

All of the whales worth.

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by troutman

How many tankers would have to arrive every month to equal the amount that could be delivered by pipeline?

I think energy east was supposed to be 900k bbl/d, the largest tankers that can leave Vancouver harbour are maybe 600k max. So around 45 per month, a constant arc of tankers taking a round 2.5 times longer dependent on a canal.

[Duruss]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...635939?cmp=rss


The good ship "No More Pipelines" begins it's ludicrous journey. Let's wish her well! May many more follow her expeditious trade route.

I've heard a couple stupid things today, but this is by far the dumbest. It's shockingly absurd, like something from Monty Python.