Pronman: Flames have #31-ranked farm system in NHL - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

TheScorpion · 08-12-2019, 05:46 PM

https://theathletic.com/1125383/2019...algary-flames/

Pronman omits Valimaki, Dube, and Kylington

Top 5:

1. Pettersen
2. Pelletier
3. Nikolaev
4. Wolf
5. Sveningsson

Pronman has never been super high on the Flames but I think his criteria (omit 25+ GP) deal the Flames a pretty hard blow more than anything here.

Huntingwhale · 08-12-2019, 05:50 PM

The headline should be "Flames have #31-ranked farm system in NHL, yet have 2nd best team in NHL".

RedHawk12 · 08-12-2019, 05:52 PM

To be fair, our farm team is very weak without Dube, Valimaki and Kylington. No true superstars and many boom or bust prospects.

I don't mind though. We have a young core and good depth in the NHL. If we can just draft well enough every year to keep cheap young depth coming up to support the core we have, I'm happy. Would be nice if once in a while we hit a home run like Johnny, but not really needed at the moment.

Heavy Jack · 08-12-2019, 05:53 PM

Not too concerned when you look at the list of graduated talent via previous 5 or so drafts:

Gaudreau
Monahan
Tkachuk
Bennett
Andersson
Jankowski
Mangiapane

Dube, Valimaki and Kylington are soon to follow suit in terms of full time at the NHL; I’m a little surprised at the 31st overall ranking though when you look at our D prospects we are beyond thin in terms of future talent but again it’s easier to stomach when you look at Valimaki, Andersson and Kylington all likely graduated full time NHLers by next year.

TheScorpion · 08-12-2019, 05:54 PM

Worth noting that Pronman ranked the Flames 29th last year and then they proceeded to graduate Valimaki, Kylington, Dube, Mangiapane, and Andersson

monkeyman · 08-12-2019, 05:57 PM

Not really surprising, considering, our finish last year, the fact we traded away multiple 1,2,3 round picks over the last few years. But these things are fluid and ultimately, these rankings are hit and miss.

Huntingwhale · 08-12-2019, 06:00 PM

I wonder if there is a relation between having a highly ranked farm-system, and the NHL team being good years down the road. Would be interesting to see the numbers.

BACKCHECK!!! · 08-12-2019, 06:01 PM

We've got 4 rostered defencemen who are 22 and under. And 4 of the top 6 forward are 25 and under.

The Flames could make an NHL playoff team solely made of players who can't rent a car without using their parents' credit card.

CorsiHockeyLeague · 08-12-2019, 06:34 PM

He specifically says that the ranking is a result of graduation of most of their good prospects, combined with dealin away picks and prospects to climb the standings. I think it's totally fair. At best you're just quarreling over where they fall in the bottom 5.

Rando · 08-12-2019, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

He specifically says that the ranking is a result of graduation of most of their good prospects, combined with dealin away picks and prospects to climb the standings. I think it's totally fair. At best you're just quarreling over where they fall in the bottom 5.

Sure but they were also ranked 29 in 2018 then graduated three defensemen aged 22, 21 and 20. And two forwards of similar age. How many teams ranked near them did that.

It's totally fair to give his rankings proper context.

Caged Great · 08-12-2019, 07:09 PM

Good team has graduated half a team worth of high quality prospects and the farm team suffers. News at 11.

It would be more surprising if the Flames didn't have a horrid farm team.

AC · 08-12-2019, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caged Great

Good team has graduated half a team worth of high quality prospects and the farm team suffers. News at 11.

It would be more surprising if the Flames didn't have a horrid farm team.

Except he had us 29th last year in his list that did include Valimaki, Dube, Kylington, Mangiapane, and Andersson. Which seems odd.

Erick Estrada · 08-12-2019, 07:13 PM

It’s his opinion but it’s fair as I can’t overly disagree when comparing the Flames prospects to other teams. Still rankings like this are nothing more than fan bragging rights and selling hope for fans of mediocre/bad teams. If this was regarding the Kings or Hawks it would be worrisome but the Flames have a solid, young NHL core that should be good for some time.

Strange Brew · 08-12-2019, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Worth noting that Pronman ranked the Flames 29th last year and then they proceeded to graduate Valimaki, Kylington, Dube, Mangiapane, and Andersson

That is a very good point. Wonder if he would admit that he was really far off as I can’t imagine many teams graduated that many prospects.

Caged Great · 08-12-2019, 07:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AC

Except he had us 29th last year in his list that did include Valimaki, Dube, Kylington, Mangiapane, and Andersson. Which seems odd.

Pronman has always ranked the Flames rather low, even back a few years if I recall correctly.

I'd put the Flames at 31st as well right now under the parameters given. That previous ranking was a bit poor. The Flames were probably in the 18-20th ish range.

RedHawk12 · 08-12-2019, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

That is a very good point. Wonder if he would admit that he was really far off as I can’t imagine many teams graduated that many prospects.

Pronman ranks his prospect pools based on high potential, not based on how many players are graduated. With all due respect to Mangi, Kylington and even Dube, they were 3rd/4th line or 3rd pairing guys last year and may not ever be more than that. Compare that with a team like New York Rangers for example, who has Kakko ready to immediately step into the top 6 and power play and who comes in with huge hype. Teams with those types of players have higher rankings.

That being said, I do think 29th is a bit low, but not by much. Last year we should have probably been around 20-25.

If we had a top 15 pick in our prospect pool, we would be ranked around 25. If we had a top 10 and a top 15 pick, we would be ranked around 15. It's just the nature of prospect rankings.

CorsiHockeyLeague · 08-12-2019, 08:14 PM

Exactly. Last year Buffalo was first by a country mile. We'll see how that holds up with Dahlin and Middlestat graduated and Nylander gone.

The Cobra · 08-13-2019, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

The headline should be "Flames have #31-ranked farm system in NHL, yet have 2nd best team in NHL".

Why, the article is about farm teams, not NHL superiority.

How would you like an article last year stating "Flames # 2 Team in Hockey, but Farm Club Ranked #31"?

The article on farm teams is not an insult to the current NHL team.

flamesfan55 · 08-13-2019, 07:32 AM

This really isn't surprising or offending. The prospect pool is very light as most of the Flames top prospects have graduated already.

Its the typical circle that happens. When a team is competitive they mortgage there future (trading picks and prospects). In 5 years this list will be much different.

Rangers probably have the top prospect pool right now. After they play 25 games (Pronman's games played criteria) this year take a look at there prospects and its a substantial drop.

Lanny_McDonald · 08-13-2019, 08:17 AM

I'm not a Pronman fan by any stretch, but he's pretty accurate in this assessment. The Flames prospect pool is very thin. There is not much on the immediate horizon after years of dealing away the top picks in drafts to make the NHL team better. This has to be an expected outcome. What is most concerning IMO is the lack of prospects that seem to be sure fire players in some capacity. The Flames have stocked up on smallish players who have similar potential to fill similar slots. Not saying that some of these guys will hit - I think a few of them are very interesting prospects and could surprise - but in weighing the system the Flames have a really poor group of prospects and little balance in that group.