2023 PGA tour thread

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

There isn't even really "team" play involved in LIV. They are on "teams", but it's not like they are actually playing another team in anything. Maybe if every LIV weekend was one team played another in like three disciplines across three days (team best ball, match play, stroke play) it could be viewed more as a team thing, and would be more interesting and have potential to develop rivalries, but right now the team aspect doesn't really exist. I would say it might be fun if there were true "home fields", like if Bone Saw GC was hosting Repressive Rights GC and the fans were openly taunting RRGC players, that could make it fun.

I'm basically of the opinion LIV should lean into as much sideshow as possible, because if they intend on going direct as a virtually identical product against the PGA, I can't see myself ever caring. Drunk, belligerent fans? Hardcore on course gambling, drug use and drinking? Yeah, I might be down for that

For sure, that is why I commented that if done properly the team aspect could be really interesting. They could go a lot of different ways with introducing team play and formats, point accumulation, playoffs, player acquisitions, etc. The original one vs the field can still exist every week but side games and competitions could really set them apart from the PGA.

[Flabbibulin]

Great points. Although individual stroke play is probably still the best format for a golf tour, there is simply no need for 2 golf competing leagues that more or less follow the same format- sorry, a limited field, no cut, shotgun start is not reason enough. Perhaps if half of the LIV tournaments were a match play or team format though? I am sure they will be considering these options when LIV gains no ground in the coming year or two.

[nfotiu]

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

Great points. Although individual stroke play is probably still the best format for a golf tour, there is simply no need for 2 golf competing leagues that more or less follow the same format- sorry, a limited field, no cut, shotgun start is not reason enough. Perhaps if half of the LIV tournaments were a match play or team format though? I am sure they will be considering these options when LIV gains no ground in the coming year or two.

It all goes back to Clay's point earlier about no consequences makes it not compelling. If you get to the point where the team's have incentive to win like the winning teams all get to fly private and make millions while losing teams take the bus, and get nothing, then the team's will have incentive to compete and cut players and look for better ones, etc.

The problem is that all the players came for the guaranteed money and to not have to fight for their job and paycheck every week.

For what they are trying to do, they ended up many too many golfers and too many teams. They tried to position themselves as an all star tour where you see battles among the big names every week, instead the fringe players with low guarantees are the ones actually putting effort into it, and the big names are barely noticeable.

Same problem with the teams aspect. 12 teams is too much and there is nothing to identify with. High School and college golf matches are fun to watch when there are just 2 to 3 teams and some rivalries. They are not even close to making something that looks like that.

[Roughneck]

2024 Canadian Women's Open coming to Calgary at Earl Grey.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630598765324238851

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by nfotiu

It all goes back to Clay's point earlier about no consequences makes it not compelling. If you get to the point where the team's have incentive to win like the winning teams all get to fly private and make millions while losing teams take the bus, and get nothing, then the team's will have incentive to compete and cut players and look for better ones, etc.

The problem is that all the players came for the guaranteed money and to not have to fight for their job and paycheck every week.

For what they are trying to do, they ended up many too many golfers and too many teams. They tried to position themselves as an all star tour where you see battles among the big names every week, instead the fringe players with low guarantees are the ones actually putting effort into it, and the big names are barely noticeable.

Same problem with the teams aspect. 12 teams is too much and there is nothing to identify with. High School and college golf matches are fun to watch when there are just 2 to 3 teams and some rivalries. They are not even close to making something that looks like that.

The last paragraph is key. Team sports are great when the team is representing something that is meaningful to the fan. A country, school, city etc.

Made up teams don’t work.

If you want to grant golf franchises to cities, have them play home games, maybe it could work if you were very, very patient. But again there need to be reasons for the players and fans to care about winning. And LIV was designed specifically to remove that pressure from the players, it’s a series of exhibitions.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

The last paragraph is key. Team sports are great when the team is representing something that is meaningful to the fan. A country, school, city etc.

Made up teams don’t work.

If you want to grant golf franchises to cities, have them play home games, maybe it could work if you were very, very patient. But again there need to be reasons for the players and fans to care about winning. And LIV was designed specifically to remove that pressure from the players, it’s a series of exhibitions.

They've tried team tennis forever and it's never gotten off the ground really.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_W...mTennis_season

[Sylvanfan]

I think F1 shows that you can bring a team aspect to an Individual sport. But you need teams who want to beat each other and be willing to cast the underperformed aside. You'd need Titlelist and Taylormade wanting to beat the other and be ruthless in trying to do it

So the idea of having elite golfers traveling the globe and competing in front of fans may not be completely off. But you need to make people think it's really elite players, and that they're going all out to compete. So if you equipment manufacturers pushing the limits and recruiting the best guys to compete and bring willing to cast guys aside who don't get it done...people might buy that. But it would also be full time too...at which point...it likely no longer appeals to players.

[Senator Clay Davis]

54 hole events and shotguns can't be far behind.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630945619694047233

[jayswin]

LIV golf reportedly set to stop paying travel expenses of players and caddies, which was one of their huge perks when recruiting last season. And is looking for other ways to cut back spending.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

54 hole events and shotguns can't be far behind.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630945619694047233

But I thought not having cuts is bush league?

[Flabbibulin]

Originally Posted by Roughneck

2024 Canadian Women's Open coming to Calgary at Earl Grey.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630598765324238851

It will be interesting to see what they do about pathways along both sides of the course- particularly the one on the reservoir side. There is a lot of room for people to go watch incredibly close, and for free.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Roughneck

2024 Canadian Women's Open coming to Calgary at Earl Grey.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630598765324238851

Sounds like a great course for a tea time

[jayswin]

See yourself out Winsor.

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

It will be interesting to see what they do about pathways along both sides of the course- particularly the one on the reservoir side. There is a lot of room for people to go watch incredibly close, and for free.

Putting up the bannering along the fences will solve most of the issues with that. But the main issue for viewing is that Earl Grey doesn’t have a lot of good viewing corridors. It’s an easy walk, but everything is pretty tight. Not much room spectators and have them move around. It will be interesting to see what they come up with since Brooke being even more established now than in 2016 plus the Covid golf surge will, I’d imagine, make this a busier open than the previous ones at Priddis. Compare it with Canyon Meadows for the Shaw, there’s a bit more breathing room between holes and more space behind around greens. I say all that, but it’s not like St. George’s was some expansive venue for the RBC that was super busy, they’ll make it work.

In a similar vein, it will also be a challenge just getting people in and out, especially if Lakeview puts up a fuss. Deals with Grey Eagle and MRU for parking and shuttles seems like the most likely option, but Earl Grey is rather isolated for access points. I wonder if they’ll try to get something set up at the Canoe Club end to spread out the traffic rather than trying to funnel everybody in through the main entrance since that will be busy enough with players and staff and VIPs.

[Muffins]

Bob Weeks mentioned that they'll have the 10th hole playing as the 18th and work back from there, which makes sense for space as the Par 3 course is around that green and I imagine that will be overtaken by all the crowd/media/player stuff. A bunch of room on the 11th tee which would become the 1st tee as well.

[jayswin]

They should have just used canyon meadows. It's the perfect your course in calgary.

[jayswin]

I wouldn't worry about parking though. Canyon meadows gets 30-40k for shaw charity and they literally have zero on-site parking and most of their shuttled parking comes from southcentre which is further than MRU.

Grey Eagle will probably be a shuttle point as well. It'll be fine. People treat golf differently than a 2-3 hour hockey or baseball game. It's an all day event and most are fine parking a ways and getting a shuttle or walking.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Parking is never on site for any event, all of the on site parking is reserved for the players and media. Chinook is pretty close to Earl Grey so could see that as an option as well.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GirlySports

They've tried team tennis forever and it's never gotten off the ground really.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_W...mTennis_season

Yeah I have watched some of that and it is a joke honestly.

M

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Parking is never on site for any event, all of the on site parking is reserved for the players and media. Chinook is pretty close to Earl Grey so could see that as an option as well.

Build a dock and do it like Disneyworld, bringing people in by boat.