Climate change and human responsibility

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by zamler

This is how Canada generates electricity



On the surface it would seem like we'd greatly benefit from battery electric vehicles. Only partially true, in mild areas yes the carbon footprint would be much lower than a gas burner. But in cold areas a BEV has poor efficiency overall, not the car itself but it takes a lot of power to heat the cabin.

For example a Tesla Model 3 goes about 400km on the equivalent energy as 7.5 liters of gasoline, driven in mild weather. In cold weather the wasted heat of a petrol car keeps you warm, in the Tesla there is little waste energy so you end up using a similar amount of energy as the petrol car.

The way around this is you can “warm them up” when they are plugged in. Doesn’t help you if you stop somewhere, but helps your daily work commute.

[zamler]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

The way around this is you can “warm them up” when they are plugged in. Doesn’t help you if you stop somewhere, but helps your daily work commute.

The amount of energy it takes to heat the cabin is fixed. And that energy comes from being plugged in, so how do you think that's "the way around this" exactly?

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Muta

Agreed. One thing we should stop doing too, is buying big-ass, unnecessary gas guzzling tanks as personal vehicles. These behemoth trucks / SUVs have, for a large part, moved away from their utilitarian purpose in recent decades and now people drive them simply because... they want one. The Western provinces are really guilty of this.

A transition to more fuel-efficient / electric models with less of an environmental footprint, including reducing the amount of driving we need to do by investing in clean / robust / easy-to-access public transportation and cycling infrastructure, is a great start.

Do you have facts for this? I thought it was country-wide that everyone is buying trucks and SUV's.

[zamler]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Do you have facts for this? I thought it was country-wide that everyone is buying trucks and SUV's.

It's a trend in all of North America. To the point where GM and Ford are not bothering with sedans anymore.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by zamler

It's a trend in all of North America. To the point where GM and Ford are not bothering with sedans anymore.

Ya, I know, it just seemed odd to throw shade at Western Canada, unless it is based on fact.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Ya, I know, it just seemed odd to throw shade at Western Canada, unless it is based on fact.

It isn’t.

Originally Posted by zamler

The amount of energy it takes to heat the cabin is fixed. And that energy comes from being plugged in, so how do you think that's "the way around this" exactly?

Well, the energy sources need fixing obviously. I don’t know what every province uses, but Ontario is 60% Nuclear, 24% hydro, 6% natural gas, 2% solar, and 8% wind. We need more nuclear in this country.

Who’s using all that coal?

[dre]

Originally Posted by Muta

Agreed. One thing we should stop doing too, is buying big-ass, unnecessary gas guzzling tanks as personal vehicles. These behemoth trucks / SUVs have, for a large part, moved away from their utilitarian purpose in recent decades and now people drive them simply because... they want one. The Western provinces are really guilty of this.

A transition to more fuel-efficient / electric models with less of an environmental footprint, including reducing the amount of driving we need to do by investing in clean / robust / easy-to-access public transportation and cycling infrastructure, is a great start.

Give it time. Electric vehicles will be more affordable, but we just need to have rich people buy more of them to bring down price. Kind of like the flatscreen tv was unattainable for most families when they first came out.

[burn_this_city]

That was rich coming from the guy who was asking if he should buy a used Range Rover a couple months ago.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Do you have facts for this? I thought it was country-wide that everyone is buying trucks and SUV's.

My observation is anecdotal. However, I've lived in Ontario and internationally, and I see more trucks and SUV's, per capita, here in the west. Not saying stats back that up, but I do trust my eyes and experiences enough to make that statement. If you have stats that prove otherwise, I'd be happy to see them.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

That was rich coming from the guy who was asking if he should buy a used Range Rover a couple months ago.

Yeah, I didn't buy it because of its fuel inefficiency, among many other things. Get off your high horse.

Also, your creep level is x1000.

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by Muta

Yeah, I didn't buy it because of its fuel inefficiency, among many other things. Get off your high horse.

Also, your creep level is x1000.

Haha not all of us have goldfish memory.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Muta

My observation is anecdotal. However, I've lived in Ontario and internationally, and I see more trucks and SUV's, per capita, here in the west. Not saying stats back that up, but I do trust my eyes and experiences enough to make that statement. If you have stats that prove otherwise, I'd be happy to see them.

That's...uhm..not how this usually works.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Muta

Yeah, I didn't buy it because of its fuel inefficiency, among many other things. Get off your high horse.

Also, your creep level is x1000.

No, but you were still looking for something you wanted buy, regardless of inefficiency.

It's basically the climate change argument in miniature. No one wants to substantially change their lives, but still seem to think this needs to be immediately addressed, just by someone else though.

[burn_this_city]

So long as it doesn't affect my fake baller status, I'm 100% willing to do whatever it takes to save the climate.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

That's...uhm..not how this usually works.

Too bad. I said it was anecdotal, and I don't really care what others think of that. I don't feel like diving any further into it either.

If you're so interested in sticking it to me though, put the stats up. I'll admit I'm wrong.

[troutman]

Is this really a thing?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Green_Wall

[Ozy_Flame]

Whether it's real or not, I do believe that climate change and the global collaboration to respond will be the great galvanizing force of our time. Ambitious projects are what can bring some of our leaders and countries together to share common concerns.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Muta

Too bad. I said it was anecdotal, and I don't really care what others think of that. I don't feel like diving any further into it either.

If you're so interested in sticking it to me though, put the stats up. I'll admit I'm wrong.

It doesn't seem like those stats are collected, only passenger cars vs trucks, and it isn't clear where suv's fall in that.


https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1...0101#timeframe

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

It doesn't seem like those stats are collected, only passenger cars vs trucks, and it isn't clear where suv's fall in that.


https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1...0101#timeframe

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1...pid=2010000201

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

No hysteria. And it isn’t just coal. Even if it was, they are still real people.

Look no further than Alberta for an idea, jobs in the oil industry were lost or people changed career paths. Oil and gas is never going away 100%, but it is going to continue to scale down just as coal and steel has. Automation aside.

It’s necessary, but I want to see solid re-education/work training programs offered along side any major industry shift.

That is an unfair comparison. Alberta oil jobs are being lost not because OIL is being replaced, but because our government didn't have the foresight to make sure our biggest resource can find its way to the market.

And no, oil is NOT scaling down. I don't even know where you are getting that information from. The issue in Saudi Arabia showed exactly how worldwide demand works.