Summer 2015 Prospect Ranking - Round 3

[kehatch]

Ferland for me. But Gilles (who is ahead right now) is my number 4. After those 4 it gets really murky, but in a good way. There are 10 guys I would be fine with taking number 5.

[FlameZilla]

Voted Gillies as I believe he has the potential to be an elite starting goalie.

Hickey is very much on my radar as well. He's one of the most improved prospects this year league wide.

[herashak]

I dont think ferland has the consistency and upside outside of his physical game for me to put him ahead of gillies. I also think guys like klimchuk, ortio and even hickey should be considered better prospects. If klimchuks injuries are just flukes than I think hes tied for 3rd with gillies.

[Vulcan]

When I see a player regressing as a 17 year old, I think of Angelo Esposito who was taken 20th overall and hasn't been heard of since. Kylington has a lot to prove and being taken at 60th, was probably a good gamble but lets not get overexcited about him.

Like others say goalies are another gamble. I like Ortio and Gillies in that order because Ortio has proven a lot more and in their only comparable at the World Juniors, Ortio outshined Gillies.

My pick is still Ferland who I also picked at 2nd. A blossoming power forward, already a difference maker who's shown some scoring touch. What's not to like?

[868904]

Love Ferland's game but he's going to max out as a high end bottom 6 guy, maybe a 20 goal 40 point enforcer. Extremely valuable type of player and very hard to obtain but still a bottom 6 guy.

Gillies and Macdonald have star goalie potential and with Gillies more advanced, I'm going with him.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Vulcan

When I see a player regressing as a 17 year old, I think of Angelo Esposito who was taken 20th overall and hasn't been heard of since. Kylington has a lot to prove and being taken at 60th, was probably a good gamble but lets not get overexcited about him.

Like others say goalies are another gamble. I like Ortio and Gillies in that order because Ortio has proven a lot more and in their only comparable at the World Juniors, Ortio outshined Gillies.

My pick is still Ferland who I also picked at 2nd. A blossoming power forward, already a difference maker who's shown some scoring touch. What's not to like?

Do some background reading on both Kylington and Espositio and you'l realize that the Esposito comparison id a terrible one.

[Go_Flames4ever]

Aside from Poirier, it doesn't look like our prospect pool have any other top-line potential winger. Even Poirier may top out at 2nd line winger.

Top-end goaltending we may possibly have addressed with both Ortio and Gillies. I picked Ortio as he's progressing nicely and will be graduated this year most likely.

Top-end D we may have in Kylington, Andersson, and Hickey. The possibility of them hitting that ceiling is very slim, but there is still potential for it to happen.

I think we'll need to address the top6 winger positions going forward as Hudler won't be at that level for too long, and Frolik shouldn't be in that spot for the entirety of his contract.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Do some background reading on both Kylington and Espositio and you'l realize that the Esposito comparison id a terrible one.

Yes and no. They do share some things in common
- Both were considered elite skaters
- Esposito suffered from consistency issues. Also something we've heard about Kylington
- There were also concerns about Esposito's attitude - another thing we've heard about Kylington.

The thing is - Esposito may have proved to be a great value selection for the Pens. The problem is the kid went through multiple knee surgeries that took away his greatest asset - his skating.

So absent of that, we don't know if he would, or would not have proved to be an NHL player.

[Vulcan]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Do some background reading on both Kylington and Espositio and you'l realize that the Esposito comparison id a terrible one.

Oh I've done my reading and I'm not saying Kylington is another Esposito but the trend is the same. He's a gamble as shown by where he was drafted.

[1qqaaz]

Ferland doesn't appear to have high upside
Ortio has been terrible (89.9%)in the NHL and average in the AHL.

Gillies is the easy choice for me.

[Enoch Root]

The sky is the limit for Ferland: big, fast, tough, soft hands, nose for the net, great attitude...

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

Ortio has been terrible (89.9%)in the NHL and average in the AHL.

This is the second time you've said this. Instead of taking his starts from years ago into the equation why don't we look at what he's done lately.

Last season in his 6 games in the NHL he was excellent.
His last 2 seasons in the AHL his SV% were 9.912 and .926, and he was easily the team's best player last season.

He's obviously trending upwards. He hasn't been terrible in the NHL - at all.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

Ortio has been terrible (89.9%)in the NHL and average in the AHL.

If you think Ortio has been terrible in the NHL and average in the AHL, then you... weren't paying attention.

Also, the sample size for his NHL save percentage is the size of a pea. Just removing his two most recent games played (one of which was playing injured behind AHLer defensemen like Ramage, Kulak, Engelland, and Wotherspoon against NHLers, and the other of which was in a building the Flames get destroyed in every single time, just ask Hiller or Ramo their success rates in the Honda Center) and his NHL career save percentage jumps to .917 which would place him in the upper echelon of NHL starters. Two games later, neither of which could possibly be considered his fault if you actually watch them, he's down to a "terrible" .899. Hmm

And let me guess, Jon Gillies is better than Carey Price too, since Price's save percentage in his series vs Tampa Bay was only .896

[Fire]

Originally Posted by New Era

Gillies has future starter written all over him and has future star potential.

You could say the same thing about Ortio. I don't see how Gillies has more chance of being a future star than Ortio. It wouldn't surprise me at all to see Gillies struggle in his first year pro. It's a huge jump from college.

[Pierre "Monster" McGuire]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

Ferland doesn't appear to have high upside
Ortio has been terrible (89.9%)in the NHL and average in the AHL.

Gillies is the easy choice for me.

He's been far from terrible in the NHL. Those stats are misleading.

First off, let's not count the last game of the season versus Winnipeg because that was a sh*t show with half an AHL roster. Then there was an Anaheim game... Anaheim is good. Those two games amounted to 9 goals.

In his other four games, he allowed four goals total, including a shutout.

As far as the AHL goes, he was named rookie goalie of the year the season before last... average goalies don't get that award. Plus, his numbers in the AHL are actually considered good in terms of AHL numbers.

Gillies has proven nothing as a pro. I'm sorry, but I'm still of the opinion that Ortio's the better goalie right now.

EDIT - beaten to all these points. I suck.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Pierre "Monster" McGuire

He's been far from terrible in the NHL. Those stats are misleading.

First off, let's not count the last game of the season versus Winnipeg because that was a sh*t show with half an AHL roster. Then there was an Anaheim game... Anaheim is good. Those two games amounted to 9 goals.

In his other four games, he allowed four goals total, including a shutout.

As far as the AHL goes, he was named rookie goalie of the year the season before last... average goalies don't get that award. Plus, his numbers in the AHL are actually considered good in terms of AHL numbers.

Gillies has proven nothing as a pro. I'm sorry, but I'm still of the opinion that Ortio's the better goalie right now.

EDIT - beaten to all these points. I suck.

Difficult to argue otherwise.

But some of us think Gillies' potential is enough to tip the scales the other way.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

But some of us think Gillies' potential is enough to tip the scales the other way.

some of us think Ortio has 04-07 Kiprusoff potential, except better at interviews.
Do you think Gillies will be even better than that to the extent of tipping the proverbial scales?

[FBI]

Yup if gillies didn't win this, I would be voting Ortio after Ferland.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

some of us think Ortio has 04-07 Kiprusoff potential, except better at interviews.
Do you think Gillies will be even better than that to the extent of tipping the proverbial scales?

That's not how it works.

(obviously, anyone who thinks Ortio is the next Kiprusoff would vote Ortio)

[1qqaaz]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

This is the second time you've said this. Instead of taking his starts from years ago into the equation why don't we look at what he's done lately.

Last season in his 6 games in the NHL he was excellent.
His last 2 seasons in the AHL his SV% were 9.912 and .926, and he was easily the team's best player last season.

He's obviously trending upwards. He hasn't been terrible in the NHL - at all.

How is Ortio obviously trending upwards when his AHL stats were a lot lower this year than last year? His AHL stats went from good to mediocre. The NHL sample size from this year was small (smaller than the previous season).

Leeland Irving: 16 games in the NHL and 90.2%. This was not good enough, so the Flames cut ties with him. He was about the same age as Ortio is now.

Joni Ortio: 15 games in the NHL and 89.9% Leeland Irving was often stated to be among the best on the Abbotsford Heat.

In terms of Jon Gillies, you can look at what he did in the USHL years ago (which was good), or you can look at what he has done in the past 3 years (which is utterly outstanding).

I just think that it's ridiculous to rate Ortio higher than Gillies. Just look at the stats/championship record and it's not even a comparison.