Minneapolis PD Suffocate Unarmed Black Man Who Later Dies in Hospital

[Azure]

Originally Posted by GGG

I don’t think anyone is actually saying this.

Independant of this situation Do you believe that at some point when an Officers life is threatened He has the right to respond with lethal force?

And

Do you believe that at some point when an Officers life is threatened he has the right to respond with lethal force even if there is risk of an innocent person dying (stray bullet or something)

If you believe that Officers have at some point the right to defend themselves and that innocent people could be hurt in this defense then not much separates you from the posters you are criticizing. It’s really just a matter of degree that you believe the officers life is at risk and the amount of risk to the public that is acceptable for the officer to protect themselves. Having a discussion around when these thresholds are breached would be much more productive than accusing people of not caring about teenagers and calling cops pigs.

Thank you.

This is my entire point.

At some point there is no good choice to make anymore.

Obviously you want to avoid being in that situation as much as possible, and in this specific case, it seems like things could have been prevented by some better planning. Surely the police should have some intelligence on these protests and should realize that driving into a crowd could quickly turn ugly. Don't do that.

But, that doesn't mean it can be avoided all the time, and my problem is we are simply not allowing a scenario where the police need to protect their own lives. Instead we we accuse cops of being ' stirring sh&t up' and see the solution as defunding them.

Strange world we live in.

Also not sure if anyone noticed, but this isn't about George Floyd or cop violence anymore.

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by Azure

Also not sure if anyone noticed, but this isn't about George Floyd or cop violence anymore.

Oh this should be good.

[OMG!WTF!]

The funny thing is it never was just about George Floyd.



The police released their dash cam footage and you can clearly see the car bump in to protestors first starting the whole thing. Of course it pisses people off when you run into them. The cops were there to block protestors which was stupid in the first place. They were not prepared to actually block the protestors and so they tried to stop them the hard way. I'm a hundred percent pro protestor now. The cops messed this one up.



Also I do not for a second buy the story about them thinking it was a gun shot. There would have been hundreds of cops called in looking for the gun and shooter. I'm pretty sure you don't just run away when the shooting starts. Anyway, that could easily be verified by the call the cop made when he "heard" the shot. There should be a record of that. Just bad policing all around.


https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/29/us/de...rnd/index.html

[Azure]

My point is that many of the protests are turning violent or about wrecking and burning stuff and not about actually protesting what the original issue was.

I know that is hard for someone like PsYcNeT to understand, but it is what is happening.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Azure

My point is that many of the protests are turning violent or about wrecking and burning stuff and not about actually protesting what the original issue was.

I know that is hard for someone like PsYcNeT to understand, but it is what is happening.

Are they really?

I mean, I know a few poor statues have come down. But they don't seem to be getting more violent.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Azure

My point is that many of the protests are turning violent or about wrecking and burning stuff and not about actually protesting what the original issue was.

I know that is hard for someone like PsYcNeT to understand, but it is what is happening.

Interesting that you bring this up in response to a video of police hitting protestors that were, by all accounts, peaceful before the incident and continued to be peaceful after.

The protests have been and continue to be primarily peaceful, so I have to question what narrative you're following if your only focus is on the "violent or about wrecking and burning stuff" and you're no longer seeing the protests for their purpose.

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by Azure

My point is that many of the protests are turning violent or about wrecking and burning stuff and not about actually protesting what the original issue was.

I know that is hard for someone like PsYcNeT to understand, but it is what is happening.

Just a bunch of thugs and ne'erdowells.

All those Peaceful Protesters should be going out there and protesting the bad protesters for making them look bad!

[Azure]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

Are they really?

I mean, I know a few poor statues have come down. But they don't seem to be getting more violent.

Have there not been violent outbreaks from some of the protests? Would you not agree that those outbreaks are not about George Floyd or the actual issue at hand and instead just about wrecking stuff and hurting people?

Every single time the violent parts of the protests are brought up and it is mentioned how they take away from the original intent, people get all defensive.

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by Azure

Every single time the violent parts of the protests are brought up and it is mentioned how they take away from the original intent, people get all defensive.

Wow I wonder if there's a strong parallel to this surrounding the discourse around police brutality and systemic racism?

Naw, that would be stupid because obviously police and political institutions are held to a higher standard than the average citizen!

[Azure]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Interesting that you bring this up in response to a video of police hitting protestors that were, by all accounts, peaceful before the incident and continued to be peaceful after.

The protests have been and continue to be primarily peaceful, so I have to question what narrative you're following if your only focus is on the "violent or about wrecking and burning stuff" and you're no longer seeing the protests for their purpose.

Many if not most of the protests have been peaceful. Many cops have walked alongside the protesters.

Some protests have turned violent, which in my view deter from what the actual purpose of the protests has been.

[ResAlien]

Originally Posted by Azure

Have there not been violent outbreaks from some of the protests? Would you not agree that those outbreaks are not about George Floyd or the actual issue at hand and instead just about wrecking stuff and hurting people?

Every single time the violent parts of the protests are brought up and it is mentioned how they take away from the original intent, people get all defensive.

The violence seems to always be preceded by the police initiating it. The times when the police have backed off of their heavy handed tactics the protests have remained almost entirely violence free. It’s almost like the cause is the same thing being protested. Wild.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

The violence seems to always be preceded by the police initiating it. The times when the police have backed off of their heavy handed tactics the protests have remained almost entirely violence free. It’s almost like the cause is the same thing being protested. Wild.

See, I don't get this.

The cops are often at fault. I agree with that.

But lets not sit here and pretend that the cops made people loot and break stuff. Some people want to see the world burn, and people like you simply can't admit that those people are equally at fault as a cop is when he runs over people.

Every day I'm amazed at the idea of defunding the police. Until I come here and realize how people actually look at the police and hold them solely responsible for all the wrongs that are being committed.

"Innocent peaceful protesters"
"Cops are just sh&t disturbers"

It amazes me, honestly. And it won't end until the people simply don't want to be cops anymore. Which, from all accounts is only a matter of time.

They don't get trained properly, and people want to defund the force. Gee, I wonder where that will end up.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Azure

See, I don't get this.

The cops are often at fault. I agree with that.

But lets not sit here and pretend that the cops made people loot and break stuff. Some people want to see the world burn, and people like you simply can't admit that those people are equally at fault as a cop is when he runs over people.

Every day I'm amazed at the idea of defunding the police. Until I come here and realize how people actually look at the police and hold them solely responsible for all the wrongs that are being committed.

"Innocent peaceful protesters"
"Cops are just sh&t disturbers"

It amazes me, honestly. And it won't end until the people simply don't want to be cops anymore. Which, from all accounts is only a matter of time.

They don't get trained properly, and people want to defund the force. Gee, I wonder where that will end up.

It will probably end up in better training and a revised model that prioritizes community outreach, like it historically has.

You don't even have to wonder. You could just go and look it up.

[underGRADFlame]

Posting because I'm in disbelief of how upside down things are getting the the states...

Warning due to language...

https://twitter.com/user/status/1277882681922064386

[Acey]

Originally Posted by underGRADFlame

Posting because I'm in disbelief of how upside down things are getting the the states...
NSFW due to language...

Meh this isn't even the worst thing I've seen on Twitter today. The failed initial tackle attempt is fantastic though.

[Crown Royal]

Originally Posted by Acey

Meh this isn't even the worst thing I've seen on Twitter today. The failed initial tackle attempt is fantastic though.

I sat there waiting for the assault to take place, then the video ended. I mean technically it was assault, but hardly worthy of having it spread on the internet.

[socalwingfan]

After seeing the footage of the Neo-Nazis attacking protesters in Norco, CA, i am starting to get a sick feeling in my stomach. I used to scoff at the posters who suggested that the US is headed toward a civil war, and while I don't think it will be anywhere near that extreme, i feel some real bad #### is going to happen over this weekend.

[OMG!WTF!]

It's turning into cop porn at this point. And I probably don't need to post this. But I find it alarming that after everything that has happened a cop would act this way on film. The way he bumps right into her and stands a inch from her face hoping she touches him so he can arrest her for assault. And of course calling her nasty names. And objecting to being filmed in general. All of it just sucks. I'd say he should be fired but it doesn't matter. They should all be fired and then rehired based on record, recruitment standards and training. Don't watch it if you have sensitive ears....

NSFW!

[wittynickname]

Originally Posted by Azure

My point is that many of the protests are turning violent or about wrecking and burning stuff and not about actually protesting what the original issue was.

I know that is hard for someone like PsYcNeT to understand, but it is what is happening.

"many" of the protests are not turning violent. At this point rarely are the protests violent, most of them are extremely peaceful, but you wouldn't know that because peaceful protests get zero attention. The media doesn't care about peaceful protests. Which makes one wonder how effective they actually are at getting anything done.

Originally Posted by ResAlien

The violence seems to always be preceded by the police initiating it. The times when the police have backed off of their heavy handed tactics the protests have remained almost entirely violence free. It’s almost like the cause is the same thing being protested. Wild.

This is extremely accurate. During the first week of protests here in Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh police deployed tear gas, pepper spray, rubber bullets, etc. Those are the only protests that got at all violent. Once the mayor got the police to stand down a little bit, we've had weeks of peaceful protesting with zero incidents.

Almost like when the police don't brutalize people, when the police aren't causing the chaos, the protests about police brutality remain calm and incident-free.

Originally Posted by Azure

Every day I'm amazed at the idea of defunding the police. Until I come here and realize how people actually look at the police and hold them solely responsible for all the wrongs that are being committed.

Here in the US public services are constantly being defunded. Schools are the biggest victim of this. Police never have their budgets touched, they just keep getting bigger and bigger, to the detriment of the community.

We insist that teachers continue to do their jobs on limited budgeting, it's about time we get police to do the same. Shift that money to better schooling, better access to services for the homeless, counseling for the mentally ill, etc etc.

It's not just saying we eliminate all the police. It's about properly using the budgets that we have to focus on the problems that exist, and armed, militant police are rarely the fix for those problems.

[handgroen]

Originally Posted by Azure

Man you are being obtuse.

So far you've given two options for what the police should have done. Not drive into the crowd, which I'd imagine is their tasking order and not something they have a choice about, or get out and start shooting people.

And now you're saying 'lets not talk about those people presenting a threat. Instead what about all the other peoples!!!' without realizing that the people (could have just been 2) that are breaking windows and jumping on the car are the ones creating the threat, and the ones prompting the police to act.

Nobody is saying they should have just driven over people, but I'd really like you to tell us all, especially cause you just like to call the police 'sh&t disturbers', that outside of getting out of the vehicle and shooting people, what you think the cops should have done to de-escalate the situation.

Seriously, I want to know.

You have presented zero solutions to the problem. You can't even admit that the protesters were creating an issue. So really, I'd like to know how you'd handle it from that armchair position you are coming from.

Originally Posted by Azure

It doesn't matter if you say the cops shouldn't have put themselves into that position.

They were there, it happened, what should they have done?

Originally Posted by Azure

No, Oling is saying they should have gotten out and started shooting people.

The situation was obviously deteriorating very quickly. You sure can see it build and explode. So, we'd all like to know how the cops should have responded where you and pal would have deemed it acceptable.

So far we've heard that shooting people is acceptable, but running over them isn't. Any other options that would be acceptable?

Just trying to sort things out and expose the obvious bias that is going on here. Some people simply won't ever admit that cops are put into impossible situations where their only option is a bad one.

What about the protesters? Did they have better options? Maybe could have handled things differently? Oh right, they were 'peaceful' and not a 'threat.'

I get how this works.

Triple post score!