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Old 06-29-2020, 09:40 PM   #41
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The big mistake trading Iginla was not doing it any later than the 2012 draft. No idea how Feaster thought he was icing a competitive team that season.
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Old 06-29-2020, 09:54 PM   #42
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I’m aware of all of that. It doesn’t change my mind that those deals were brutal. Also I never even mentioned Feaster. I agree that he was doing a good job to start the rebuild and to be honest I don’t think he deserved to be fired.
I was replying to a bunch of people but only quoted you, sorry shouldn't have singled you out.
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Old 06-29-2020, 09:56 PM   #43
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The problem with the Bouwmeester deal is that he had a year left on his deal that the flames didn’t get compensated for. The flames could have waited until next years deadline and still gotten a 1st and a B and C prospect. Moving him at the draft when you would hope he is more willing to explore different city options wouldn’t have cost you anything on the return.
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Old 06-29-2020, 10:07 PM   #44
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If we would have gotten the same return later what would be the point in keeping him for another year though?

He was playing bad and getting worse, not earning his cap hit, clearly not happy. The fan base wanted him gone, some even wanted him bought out. I suppose if he rebounded we could have gotten more but at the rate he was going his value might have dropped also. Even if you don't like the trade it clearly wasn't close to the worst decision the team has made.
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Old 06-29-2020, 10:37 PM   #45
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I think the biggest mistakes were head coaching hiring decisions.

I think Hartley deserved one more season, and if he were fired, they should’ve only done it for an obvious upgrade.

Instead, they bring in Gulutzen. What a disaster.

Then they bring in Peters who got severely out coached in the playoffs and has to get fired for previous racist conduct.

Then they have Ward step in and don’t pounce on Laviolette or Gallant.

I think these mistakes have impacted the development of Bennett, Gaudreau and Monahan. Let’s be real, Bennett played his best hockey as a rookie call up and in his rookie season. Gaudreau and Monahan used to seem to care a lot more. Let’s be real.
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Old 06-29-2020, 10:42 PM   #46
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If we would have gotten the same return later what would be the point in keeping him for another year though?

He was playing bad and getting worse, not earning his cap hit, clearly not happy. The fan base wanted him gone, some even wanted him bought out. I suppose if he rebounded we could have gotten more but at the rate he was going his value might have dropped also. Even if you don't like the trade it clearly wasn't close to the worst decision the team has made.
Bouwmeester never played “bad” here. People just expected more offence.
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Old 06-29-2020, 10:45 PM   #47
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Bouwmeester never played “bad” here. People just expected more offence.
Exactly. He was a better D than Regehr, who also lacked offence.
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Old 06-29-2020, 11:08 PM   #48
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I thought Bouwmeester was playing much better under Hartley than he had for Brent Sutter. He looked like he was allowed to actually jump into the play on occasion. Trading a player like Bouwmeester is a move that a team should make at the draft unless they get a pretty good overpay when more teams can look to add a player like him. He is the type of player a team picking in the teen's would trade for, and possibly add a future second round pick on the condition of re-signing.
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Old 06-29-2020, 11:13 PM   #49
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Other than Kiprusoff, Daryl Sutter was way worse than Feaster.
Other then 09/10 off season and season. I’d say he was an above average GM the rest of his tenure. His drafting wasn’t great, however he orchestrated a few good trades. Also made some decent signings.
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Old 06-29-2020, 11:34 PM   #50
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The terrible drafting can't be disputed. His player checklist was better suited to a former era of the game.

Coaching was always his forte.
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Old 06-30-2020, 12:08 AM   #51
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Other then 09/10 off season and season. I’d say he was an above average GM the rest of his tenure. His drafting wasn’t great, however he orchestrated a few good trades. Also made some decent signings.
His drafting was awful which is half his job, or managing those draft picks. What he sold the only solid pick in Phaneuf was for garbage. Continue to bring in old washed up Amonte/Nolan/McCarty.

He had one decent year where he hit hard with Cammalleri and we had one of the best top 6s we’d ever seen but went out and got bouwmeester and never even offered cam another contract.

Kiprusoff top of the league/vezina talk every year
Top 3 Power RW goal scorer iginla
Regehr twice wantedby team canada.
Phaneuf 20 goal scoring runner up rookie of the year next to Crosby and Ovechkin as a defenceman.

But couldn’t build a team around that.

What a turd of missmanaging picks and free agents.

I place Sutter just ahead of Holland in his GM skills.

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Old 06-30-2020, 12:21 AM   #52
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Were Cammalleri, Tanguay and Jokinen all on that 09 team going into playoffs?

That was a loaded forward group, pretty sweet powerplay setup with Cam and Iggy on the points. They actually did match the blackhawks up front but were too decimated by injuries on the blue line to make a series of it.
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Old 06-30-2020, 12:32 AM   #53
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He made some nice tweaks before our playoff run in 04. That offseason he also acquired Langkow for Saprykin and Gauthier. Followed up by acquiring Huselius for Montador. Two huge wins. Turning Leopold and a 2nd for Tanguay was another solid move. He had to make some patchwork signings, because at that time the cap was low and coming off the 04 playoff run, expectations were as high as ever. Fact is he brought in our franchise goaltender for pennies. At least he was smart enough to sign those filler guys like Amonte and Nolan to short term low money deals.
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Old 06-30-2020, 12:35 AM   #54
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Were Cammalleri, Tanguay and Jokinen all on that 09 team going into playoffs?

That was a loaded forward group, pretty sweet powerplay setup with Cam and Iggy on the points. They actually did match the blackhawks up front but were too decimated by injuries on the blue line to make a series of it.
No, tanguay was flipped for cammy that off season
Cammy Jokinen Iginla
Bertuzzi Langkow Bourque
Glencross Conroy Moss
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Old 06-30-2020, 12:39 AM   #55
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He made some nice tweaks before our playoff run in 04. That offseason he also acquired Langkow for Saprykin and Gauthier. Followed up by acquiring Huselius for Montador. Two huge wins. Turning Leopold and a 2nd for Tanguay was another solid move. He had to make some patchwork signings, because at that time the cap was low and coming off the 04 playoff run, expectations were as high as ever. Fact is he brought in our franchise goaltender for pennies. At least he was smart enough to sign those filler guys like Amonte and Nolan to short term low money deals.
And it's not like Amonte and Nolan were useless in their short stints.
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Old 06-30-2020, 01:20 AM   #56
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No, tanguay was flipped for cammy that off season
Cammy Jokinen Iginla
Bertuzzi Langkow Bourque
Glencross Conroy Moss
I think at least half the forwards listed here were either out completely or playing injured during the playoffs against the hawks.

Plus a bunch of dmen too.

The walking wounded that year as they limped into the playoffs and blew a huge lead in the division.

Looking back, that 08/09 team was really the last legit chance they had at doing anything with the Iggy core group.
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Old 06-30-2020, 01:25 AM   #57
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I think at least half the forwards listed here were either out completely or playing injured during the playoffs against the hawks.

Plus a bunch of dmen too.

The walking wounded that year as they limped into the playoffs and blew a huge lead in the division.

Looking back, that 08/09 team was really the last legit chance they had at doing anything with the Iggy core group.
I remember at one point in that season thinking we had a very legit shot at winning the cup. Then the injuries struck
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Old 06-30-2020, 08:23 AM   #58
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Exactly. He was a better D than Regehr, who also lacked offence.
That's a joke - I actually expected JBo to be a better D in his own zone with his height but all he did was play like he Gaudreau where he didn't want to get hit or lay a hit cuz it's gonna really hurt! He was supposed to be a really good skater, but Crosby turned him inside out like a pair of dirty shorts in a washing machine! Regehr IS a way better D-man and I don't care if he lacked offence at all since he did a pretty fine job in his own end! JBo and Butler pairing was the most pathetic D-man pairing in Flames history besides having Zyuzin and Warrener playing together.
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Old 06-30-2020, 09:20 AM   #59
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Hmmmm I started to do a little reading. I'm only looking at points here, not contract situations or cap considerations that forced the trade.

Drouin for Sergachev
- seems like Montreal is going to lose this one. A little early to tell, but it sure looks like Sergachev is trending into an elite #1 Dman while Drouin is still struggling to live up to expectations

Weber for Subban
- I originally thought Montreal got fleeced on this one, but Weber is still hanging in there while Subban falls off the face of a cliff

Michael Latta/Martin Erat for Filip Forsberg
- The 2 guys Washington got aren't even in the NHL while Forsberg is putting up .75 PPG

Kessel for Picks (2010 1st round pick (#2-Tyler Seguin), 2010 2nd round pick (#32-Jared Knight), 2011 1st round pick (#9-Dougie Hamilton)
- Not a straight up trade, but Boston did exceptionally well here.

Then Boston goes and trades Seguin, Rich Peverley and Ryan Button for Loui Eriksson, Joe Morrow, Reilly Smith and Matt Fraser.
- Seguin puts up almost a PPG as an all star, Peverly was a 0.5 PPG player (until his cardiac episode and retirement), Reilly Smith is a 0.5PPG player and the rest are out of the league.

Man, talk about a rabbit hole! You could go through this site all day and still only get 3 or 4 teams done. Every time I looked at a "bad" trade there was another one further down that got worse.

http://www.nhltradetracker.com/user/team_list
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