High-Profile Sexual Abuse Epidemic

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Yeah that’s not true. Your sources suck. Just google it. Matchbox 20 is playing amphitheatres, not selling out arenas.

And look at the cities they’re playing. Matchbox 20 is playing cities I’ve never even heard of. It looks like their the tour schedule for a state fair.

All of those bigger shows were him playing with Rob Zombie. Technically it was a "co-headlining tour" but Zombie was top of the bill in all of the shows I looked at. When Manson tours just on his own he's playing 3K person venues normally.

Seriously they’re playing Bristol VA, Jiffy Lube Live at noon on a Wednesday. Does that sound like a band who is selling out arenas? Lol

And your Manson link says it is his 15th tour with 124 stops worldwide. Interestingly he’s also playing the same amphitheater in Bristol as Matchbox 20.

Sadly it isn’t noon on a Wednesday.

Of course these bands are playing secondary markets/venues; they're wash ups that basically no one outside a few people between the ages of 35-50 cares about. But Matchbox 20 is at least playing 10K+ person venues.

And I don't know where you're getting 12pm from. Clearly the show at the Jiffy Lube Live starts at 7:30pm:

https://concerts.livenation.com/matc...00582895411F11

Only $400 for an orchestra seat; that's a steal.

Though to be fair, the Wallflowers are opening, which probably draws in a few fans. So maybe Matchbox 20's star power isn't quite enough to fill Bristol, Virgina's Jiffy Lube Live on its own.

[aaronck]

For what it's worth, Matchbox 20 headlined Rogers Place in Edmonton a couple years ago, and almost sold it out- I think they are probably more popular than MM, but both are bigger than Creed

[nfotiu]

Originally Posted by opendoor

All of those bigger shows were him playing with Rob Zombie. Technically it was a "co-headlining tour" but Zombie was top of the bill in all of the shows I looked at. When Manson tours just on his own he's playing 3K person venues normally.



Of course these bands are playing secondary markets/venues; they're wash ups that basically no one outside a few people between the ages of 35-50 cares about. But Matchbox 20 is at least playing 10K+ person venues.

And I don't know where you're getting 12pm from. Clearly the show at the Jiffy Lube Live starts at 7:30pm:

https://concerts.livenation.com/matc...00582895411F11

Only $400 for an orchestra seat; that's a steal.

Though to be fair, the Wallflowers are opening, which probably draws in a few fans. So maybe Matchbox 20's star power isn't quite enough to fill Bristol, Virgina's Jiffy Lube Live on its own.

The Amphitheaters around here are way better venues for a concert than arenas are IMO. They might not get the pop artists with the huge AV requirements, but they get a lot of A list current bands.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by opendoor

I think you need to separate Manson's notoriety out from his popularity. He was definitely infamous, due to his public image, his fans, and also due to people trying to blame Columbine on him. So people (over a certain age at least) definitely know who he is. But he was never all that popular outside of a certain demographic of angsty teenage boys. His band's most popular album sold 1.9M copies in the US. And while people bristle at the Creed comparison, even if they had less cultural cachet they were far more popular than Manson was in terms of record sales and playing live, having two albums with 6M+ sold in the US and another that sold over 11M in the US.

I think people forget how awful mainstream rock was in the late '90s and early '00s when you had junk like Creed, Matchbox 20, et al selling 10M+ records.

First of all, just because Creed was also super popular doesn't make MM unpopular. That's not how that works.

Second, I love how in this discussion once again the rest of the world world doesn't exist, even though the difference between a star and a superstar is pretty much whether ypu can successfully go global. Manson totally did that. Creed also did that. None of your edgelord too-cool-for-that teenagey 90's angst changes that.

... Also yeah, there was a lot of crap popular rock in the nineties. There's always crap popular music, and rock was big in the nineties.

As some who lived through it, Manson was just very easily among the more interesting artists of that era, with an extremely recognizable sound and some really catchy traditionally good rock tunes to go with it. Personally for me he was always too cheesy and pop to really get excited about (Americans are amazingly easy to offend compared to Finns) but still someone totally worth following. At it's best, his work is totally up there with the best in genre. It's a big reason why he's also commercially on the same tier as Zombie or Cooper.

Manson also was a really extreme contrast to most artists of his time. In the post-Nirvana era where he rose to popularity, mainstream rock was all about "authenticity" and everyman looks, t-shirts and jeans, where as Manson was all about theatrics, artifice, makeup and crossdressing.

As for Mansons personality and talent, multiple accounts describe him as a really smart and funny guy on his good days, who's interesting to work with because he's got a good ear/eye for ideas worth developing. But he's also an addict with serious health problems and self-esteem issues, a control freak, a misogynist and a horrible abusive a-hole.

Like people can be, complicated. You don't become a globally famous rockstar if no one wants to work with you ever and you have no talent, because how would that even happen? Why would talented people make a millionaire out of someone who everyone just hates and who contributes nothing himself? There's tons of nice people to make stars of.

If you read the interviews, women fall for him because not just because he's famous, but because he can be super cool and nice before he turns into an abusive control freak.

[troutman]

The strangest thing I ever saw was women dancing to The Dope Show at the Purple Onion in Edmonton.

[btw, the youtube video has over 67 million views. MM was very popular]

[Nyah]

I absolutely loved MM when I was growing up and I still occasionally listen to his music, I still enjoy it. Really disappointing that he's turned out to be such an abusive #######.

[darockwilder]

Originally Posted by Coach

Took him higher?

Showed him everything, with arms wide open?

This is actually hilarious. Reminded me how much I don't like Creed.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by darockwilder

This is actually hilarious. Reminded me how much I don't like Creed.

The reality is that Creed made some harmless, catchy rock music and it's more Scott Stapp that people dislike.

[GordonBlue]

Dita comments

https://loudwire.com/marilyn-manson-...e-allegations/

Von Teese comments that the allegations made against Manson are not consistent with their relationship, though she does reveal that his infidelity and drug use led to their eventual split.

[Boreal]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Just when I thought this couldn’t get weirder. This is truly some of the most amazing performance art I’ve ever seen or you are a certified Marilyn Manson stalker.

Tell me about it. The weirdness is at another level.

You really enjoy talking about how an irrelevant sexual predator is actually NOT irrelevant, and was super relevant 25 years ago, against numerous people besides me.

But please go on...

[jayswin]

Maybe we should just delete the last few dozen posts. Everyone was wrong about everything.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Marilyn Manson’s level of stardom is the most controversial topic this thread has ever seen. It’s a sexual assault thread. That’s weird.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Your pants are weird.

[KTrain]

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

Your pants are weird.

Your girlfriend looks like Mom.

[undercoverbrother]

Meanwhile, 4 women (or is it more) have bravely come forward alleging abuse.

[undercoverbrother]

####ing Appalling

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfo...lish-1.5905801

A British Columbia man says he was sexually abused by a Roman Catholic school teacher in 1981, six years after the teacher's confession of abusing children at an orphanage on the other end of the country was covered up.

Darren Liptrot came forward on Monday and filed a proposed class-action lawsuit at a courthouse in Vancouver. It was a momentous step for a man who said he's agonized over childhood trauma for nearly 40 years.

"I struggle with addiction still," said Liptrot in an interview with CBC News on Monday. "I really struggle with authority. I struggle with family."

He's accusing Edward Patrick English, a teacher with the Christian Brothers of Ireland in Canada, of sexually abusing him when he was in grades 9 and 10 at Vancouver College.

And people still remain faithful to the Sky Daddy

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

####ing Appalling

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfo...lish-1.5905801

And people still remain faithful to the Sky Daddy

Fataing terrible and sadly unsurprising.

I hope watching QAnon sprout and grow so publicly in such a short period of time ends up being an eyeopener for people indoctrinated into organized religion. You know all QAnon's outlandish and ridiculous claims/beliefs? Yeah, that's you, too. That's how religious people look to areligious people. You wonder how people can believe QAnon nonsense? lol, that's you, too.

[getbak]

I'm not sure if this fits this thread because I believe it's more about abuse of power than sexual abuse specifically, but there have been rumours and speculation about Joss Whedon's treatment of actors over the years, most recently by Ray Fisher over treatment on the set of Justice League.


This morning, Charisma Carpenter, who played Cordelia on Buffy and Angel, came forward with her story about how she was treated by Whedon...

https://twitter.com/user/status/1359537746843365381

https://twitter.com/user/status/1359537752853807105

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by getbak

I'm not sure if this fits this thread because I believe it's more about abuse of power than sexual abuse specifically, but there have been rumours and speculation about Joss Whedon's treatment of actors over the years, most recently by Ray Fisher over treatment on the set of Justice League.


This morning, Charisma Carpenter, who played Cordelia on Buffy and Angel, came forward with her story about how she was treated by Whedon...

https://twitter.com/user/status/1359537746843365381

https://twitter.com/user/status/1359537752853807105

I'm not sure how to process this. It seems like he's an ####### to work for, and he picks some favorites and if it's not you, you are SOL. Sounds like he's a fairly typical boss with a grudge against an employee, and that this is a pattern for him. But I"m not seeing a sexual abuse/harassement side to this.

I think he needs to be called to account, but I'm not sure what about this is/will be done/could be done.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

I'm not sure how to process this. It seems like he's an ####### to work for, and he picks some favorites and if it's not you, you are SOL. Sounds like he's a fairly typical boss with a grudge against an employee, and that this is a pattern for him. But I"m not seeing a sexual abuse/harassement side to this.

I think he needs to be called to account, but I'm not sure what about this is/will be done/could be done.

Yeah, he sounds like a jerk. Unfortunately being a Jerk is not a crime.