American Politics 3.0 - Back to Brunch

[curves2000]

Pretty damming and embarrassing report about documents and classified material that was held at Biden's homes while VP and as a private citizen. A lot of unsecured locations for some military and American information being totally causally out in the open. This was played up by the Biden team as a simple mistake, similar to leaving your keys at home when you were expected to be somewhere else. The report by the US Department of Justice says he "willfully" kept these documents.

The report goes onto talk about why charges were not filed etc. I don't think this is a good look for Biden and his team.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/biden-...port-1.7109403

I do think the trial about documents seized from Trump's Mara Lago estate better have some absolute bombshell level proof of incredible negligence in regards to his documents. I fully understand that there are difference between Biden and Trump's case, enough so that attorney/client privilege has been pierced in this case. That's usually a big concern.

If this case and trail ends up being a blah sandwich, a lot of non biased people may see this as just another attempt to stop him with really no concrete significance between what the other side may have done, like Clinton and Biden

[ResAlien]

The report came back said no charges and your take away is “bad look for Biden”. I mean if that was what you were thinking to start it makes sense. They already knew some of that was happening but to try and spin it as a big deal reeks of partisanship.

The bigger issue I expected someone to bring up was that in the report it mentions Biden and memory problems about stuff in the past. That’s what the right wing is going to latch on to and try to attack about

[photon]

Biden returned the documents when they were found. Trump didn't (well he returned some and hasn't been charged for the ones he returned). Plus Trump actively tried to hide them or destroy evidence of that.

The National Archives didn't know about the ones Biden had while they definitely knew about the ones Trump had, which kind of suggests the severity (I haven't seen any indication as to what level the documents Biden had were).

At BEST Republicans that criticize or disqualify Biden over this must also do the same for Trump.

Does it look great? Probably not. Does it really matter? No.

[Wormius]

Why does the article use “willfully” in quotation marks? Does it have some legalese context?

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by Wormius

Why does the article use “willfully” in quotation marks? Does it have some legalese context?

I am not sure but all the news articles are point to that as well, this isn't as partisan as some people think. MSNBC is using the same language

https://www.msnbc.com/top-stories/la...ort-rcna125679

The US Department of Justice defines it as " The term "willfully" means no more than that the forbidden act was done deliberately and with knowledge, and does not require proof of evil intent

https://www.justice.gov/archives/jm/...-and-willfully

This is why I think the US Justice Departments probe into Trump's documents better be a lot more damming, to a different degree.

If what we get are lawyers and evidence showing a different shade of blue and arguing semantics , then it's not a good look at all.

Personally I think we may be looking at bombshell allegations and evidence against Trump or a nothing burger in the grand scheme of things. This may just end up looking bad.

If people remember the Robert Muller investigation, it concluded there wasn't sufficient evidence about Russia collusion but for a long time, there was enough noise about it that your average American thought this was a done deal and Trump was guilty.

Full disclosure: Not a Trump fan but can sometimes see where his side get's worked up over what they deem as unfair treatment.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

The report came back said no charges and your take away is “bad look for Biden”. I mean if that was what you were thinking to start it makes sense. They already knew some of that was happening but to try and spin it as a big deal reeks of partisanship.

The bigger issue I expected someone to bring up was that in the report it mentions Biden and memory problems about stuff in the past. That’s what the right wing is going to latch on to and try to attack about

lol, the right wing.

Biden is a senile and has no clue what is going on most of the time. Its quite obvious, and there is nothing right wing about it.

The fact that people do not see this as a major issue going into an election cycle where frickin' Trump is leading most polls is unbelievable. Head stuck in the sand, ass hanging out type moment. Just a total denial of what is coming.

I don't want Trump to be President again.

Joe I have no clue what is going on Biden is not the way that happens.

[ResAlien]

Photon already laid it out simply. Trump lied and tried to hide docs, Biden self reported and provided them when asked. I didn’t think this was so hard to comprehend

[Azure]

I mean, if it keeps kicking you in the face, maybe you should pay attention.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1755690066674876462

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by Azure

lol, the right wing.

Biden is a senile and has no clue what is going on most of the time. Its quite obvious, and there is nothing right wing about it.

The fact that people do not see this as a major issue going into an election cycle where frickin' Trump is leading most polls is unbelievable. Head stuck in the sand, ass hanging out type moment. Just a total denial of what is coming.

I don't want Trump to be President again.

Joe I have no clue what is going on Biden is not the way that happens.

This probably doesn't end well for Biden and the Democrats one way or another. Either Biden loses and becomes a historical pariah and the Democrats look awful or he wins, father time finally takes over and he spends significant time looking worse mentally, physically, hospitalized or more.

The level of risk he, his legacy and the Democrats are taking in this regard is just jaw dropping but also fascinating

[Azure]

Problem is that literally in the last few posts you see the problem.

Pointing out an obvious issue makes you 'right wing.'

When in fact I don't want orange dumb man to be President.

[ResAlien]

Originally Posted by Azure

Problem is that literally in the last few posts you see the problem.

Pointing out an obvious issue makes you 'right wing.'

When in fact I don't want orange dumb man to be President.

I would recommend you work on your reading comprehension. Nowhere did I say pointing it out made anyone right wing, I clearly said I expect the right wing to use that as a talking point.

Would you expect his own party to do so? Try and submarine the sitting president and nominee? Don’t be silly. So quick to try and attack or defend that some have lost the ability to think and read at the same time. Sad.

[Azure]

lol, okay then. Is it a right wing talking point that POTUS has had some pretty massive memory issues since 2017? You must be living in fantasy land.

I personally could care less how 'sad' you think it is. There is far too much at stake to be worried about 'feelings.'

[Mathgod]

The fact that you moan on and on about Biden's supposed "major cognitive issues" but spend none of your time talking about Trump's full blown assault on democracy and obvious fascist tendencies... speaks volumes. While I'm not accusing you of having an agenda, the way you come across makes it a bit difficult to think you don't have one.

"Major cognitive issues"... I call BS. When you're the POTUS, you have an immense number of things on your mind at all times. It's natural for some facts, figures, times, dates, etc from long ago to slip out of memory, when you're constantly putting all your mental focus and energy on things that are confronting the nation right now. I can speak from personal experience (I'm in my 30s), similar things happen to me from time to time when I have a lot going on and my mental faculties are occupied by things happening in the present, and stress levels are higher than usual. Relatively low-importance factoids fade away so that important information and pressing concerns can take priority.

That and, Biden has a speech impedement he has had his whole life, and that often gets confused for cognitive decline when he locks up or has trouble getting the next word out.

IMO, all this screaming and hand-wringing about Biden "having dementia", etc is quite frankly a smear campaign by the right wing. It was BS in 2020 and it's BS now. While it's true that a president being in his 80s is not ideal, Biden keeps himself in reasonable shape, eats properly, and can handle 4 more years just fine. Trump meanwhile is pushing 80 himself, doesn't excercise, and always loves himself a bucket of KFC.

[Monahammer]

Lol how is this even a topic when his likely competitor is so objectively more senile? He couldn't even remember who his current running opponent was a week ago and blamed Haley for being Pelosi. Just today, trump not only publicly called J6 an Insurrection (essentially admitting to treason publicly) but then proceeded to blame the event on Pelosi as if he wasn't president at the time.

The mental incompetence is not remotely comparable. And again, let the record speak. Biden's America is the strongest economy on earth and leading an absolute torrid revival of westernized security alignment. Trumps America was a second from civil war and he's still trying to make it happen.

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

The fact that you moan on and on about Biden's supposed "major cognitive issues" but spend none of your time talking about Trump's full blown assault on democracy and obvious fascist tendencies... speaks volumes. While I'm not accusing you of having an agenda, the way you come across makes it a bit difficult to think you don't have one.

"Major cognitive issues"... I call BS. When you're the POTUS, you have an immense number of things on your mind at all times. It's natural for some facts, figures, times, dates, etc from long ago to slip out of memory, when you're constantly putting all your mental focus and energy on things that are confronting the nation right now. I can speak from personal experience (I'm in my 30s), similar things happen to me from time to time when I have a lot going on and my mental faculties are occupied by things happening in the present, and stress levels are higher than usual. Relatively low-importance factoids fade away so that important information and pressing concerns can take priority.

That and, Biden has a speech impedement he has had his whole life, and that often gets confused for cognitive decline when he locks up or has trouble getting the next word out.

IMO, all this screaming and hand-wringing about Biden "having dementia", etc is quite frankly a smear campaign by the right wing. It was BS in 2020 and it's BS now. While it's true that a president being in his 80s is not ideal, Biden keeps himself in reasonable shape, eats properly, and can handle 4 more years just fine. Trump meanwhile is pushing 80 himself, doesn't excercise, and always loves himself a bucket of KFC.

You do know that both things can still be true, correct? Trump can be dangerous, a threat to democracy and all that negative stuff. Biden can be very forgetful, a little too old for the Presidency and having cognitive issues.

The American perception and reality is that Biden is too old to run for office, so is Trump, but Trump doesn't show his age as much as Biden. Nobody is quietly saying that Trump is too tired for specific events and travel, where as Biden is routinely protected due to his age with regards to press conferences, travel and more. I don't hold it against the guy, it's a tough gig for anybody, but over 80 is a concern and it shows in the data and polling.

https://www.theguardian.com/books/20...ast-politician

Meanwhile over at CNN we have a scathing headline and report about Biden's documents "Takeaways from scathing report of Biden's handling of classified documents. The special counsel didn’t charge Biden with a crime, but did paint a picture of a forgetful president who failed to protect highly sensitive info"


My concern is what WHY do Democrats want to risk everything on a leader who has a very high probability of major health concerns with 5 years left on a potential term? The likelihood that a younger and healthier leader in their 50's spending significant time in hospital is low. The likelihood of a leader in his 80's is much higher.

Frankly I think the US and it's politics is a SICK country with how old their entire system is. Everything from Supreme Court judges sticking around until death, to leaders, Presidents, VP's, Senior Leadership, potential candidates for years just being old. It's a systemic issue in the US with how old people in power are there and have been for a while.

Justin Trudeau is the oldest of Canada's leaders and he's only 52 and been in office for nearly 9 years. We don't have an entire system of 75+ year old's governing the country.

I am NOT one who does age discrimination at all, I really value older people, workers, experience and more. I truly believe they bring a wealth of knowledge, experience and more organizations should have older workers . The US just has had a problem where for years, the top people just can't relate to the people they represent and have been in office for decades. Move along so another group of leaders can try and move America forward.

[Monahammer]

It is a guarantee, statistically that Joe Biden beats Trump in an election. Any talk about replacing him is just a weak attempt at sliding orangesoda back into office. Shame on any who fall for this blatant Russian ploy.

[timun]

Originally Posted by curves2000

The American perception and reality is that Biden is too old to run for office, so is Trump, but Trump doesn't show his age as much as Biden.

"Trump doesn't show his age as much" is Republican propaganda, nothing more.

"How come the Democrats don't run a candidate who isn't senile?" says the opposition that has coalesced around a senile fascist.

[Ozy_Flame]

Biden over Trump. All day, every day. 24/7. Twice on Sundays.

As a reminder of the orange buffoonery, he calls Jan 6 an insurrection.

https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...on-1234964730/

I'll take forgetful Biden over treasonous traitor, no debate.

[Ped]

Biden may have cognitive issues, but Trump's are far worse imo, and there seems to be very few talking about it.

[Izzle]

So obvious who the Russian koolaid drinkers in this thread are.