63 Canadians killed after civilian airliner shot down.

[OMG!WTF!]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

No, it was heading to Kyiv but there is a flight from Kyiv to Toronto that has been reported as being one of the most affordable ways to get from Iran to Canada. Could be why so many Canadians were on this flight.

Yeah that's what I meant. It was ending in Toronto which would explain the Canadians on board.

[Rando]

Originally Posted by OMG!WTF!

Yeah that's what I meant. It was ending in Toronto which would explain the Canadians on board.

Just to be specific here, this plane was in no way shape or form going to Toronto.

[BlackArcher101]

Amazes me there are still major carriers flying over Iran airspace, Emirates with 777 and A380's. If there's known ground-to-air missiles in the area, and a questionable crash just happened, I would be rerouting.

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Really hope Iran gives an honest account of what happened. It seems very likely they accidentally brought the plane down.

This will be interesting. They have apparently already told Boeing they will not be sharing data with them and forget about the NTSB being able to provide any assistance, they won't be welcome either. Not sure if Iran has the technical expertise to do a proper investigation on their own. They would need the assistance of another country so my hope is a European nation is on good enough terms with them to be able to do this. Maybe Germany or France?

[Bigtime]

I'd hope if Germany or France can work with them then Airbus may be able to help out as well in the investigation.

[CaptainCrunch]

I doubt they'll want any outside help, or share their data beyond, technical difficulties. The last thing they need right now is an investigation coming out with "Sorry dudes, that private over there accidentally pulled the trigger"


On the outside if there is anything untowards, they'll point to Anti-Iranian US backed terrorists.


I doubt they'll ever let the real story come out unless its pretty much a technical difficulty, and they'll stonewall this at any turn.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

I'd hope if Germany or France can work with them then Airbus may be able to help out as well in the investigation.

Why Airbus? It was a Boeing plane.

[Fuzz]

Does Ukrainian Airlines not maintain ownership of the black boxes? What right does Iran have to them?

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

Why Airbus? It was a Boeing plane.

If for some reason Iran cooperated with a EU country and Airbus (as a European company) was allowed to investigate I'm sure Boeing would be good with that. In a situation like this the help would no doubt be appreciated, while they are rivals accidents are a different matter and I'd like to think decency would prevail.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Does Ukrainian Airlines not maintain ownership of the black boxes? What right does Iran have to them?

Probably the right of possession being nine tenths of the law.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

If for some reason Iran cooperated with a EU country and Airbus (as a European company) was allowed to investigate I'm sure Boeing would be good with that. In a situation like this the help would no doubt be appreciated, while they are rivals accidents are a different matter and I'd like to think decency would prevail.

I very much doubt that Boeing would let a direct competitor lead the investigation at all.

[Fuzz]

Ah, this article explains it:

Can Iran legally refuse to hand over the black box?


In a word, yes.
ICAO’s set of safety initiatives asserts that the investigation into an air crash will be held where it happened, referred to as “the state of occurrence.”
When the plane crashed in Tehran, Iran became the state of occurrence.
In accordance with ICAO rules, Iran is required to produce a preliminary report stating the basic facts within 30 days.

https://globalnews.ca/news/6382084/i...x-plane-crash/

[wooohooo]

This is incredibly sad. I had the privilege of Dr. Mousavi teach me in engineering. He was a super nice guy, and will be incredibly missed.

[GirlySports]

Even with my biases, I can't see why Iran would purposely shootdown a plane full of overseas Iranians. Thata really bad PR.

[nik-]

Has anyone suggested purposely?

[Red_Baron]

The media has reported that there was no distress call, I have a hard time believing that there would not be a distress call unless the pilots were incapacitated. This was most likely a shoot-down event or an on-board explosion.

[_Q_]

Originally Posted by wooohooo

This is incredibly sad. I had the privilege of Dr. Mousavi teach me in engineering. He was a super nice guy, and will be incredibly missed.

Wait, was Dr. Moussavi on this flight? I don't see his name on the published list, but possibly some younger relatives.

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by Red_Baron

The media has reported that there was no distress call, I have a hard time believing that there would not be a distress call unless the pilots were incapacitated. This was most likely a shoot-down event or an on-board explosion.

Maybe it's different in a two crew operation but I was taught:

Aviate
Navigate
Communicate

For your priorities when operating an aircraft.

[fulham]

I don't think anyone is claiming this was intentional, but I bet an Iranian military member made a huge mistake.

If it was anything other than that, Iran would love to be blaming the American military right now.


I would also question why anyone was flying during a well publicized military attack(if im correct and they flew out during the attack on US bases in Iraq)

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Maybe it's different in a two crew operation but I was taught:

Aviate
Navigate
Communicate

For your priorities when operating an aircraft.

this is correct and was covered in an article I read this morning that would explain why the pilots weren't communicating.


The Ukrainian Ambassador confirms that the pilots had massive experience and hours, the plane had a perfect maintenance record and had recently been inspected and passed.