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Old 10-20-2017, 10:29 AM   #21
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Whelp, glad we didn't get that suite/penthouse in Castello.
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Old 10-20-2017, 11:01 AM   #22
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I would hope this a mandatory, "strings attached" corollary to anyone using these facilities, no? I get that it's a hard addiction to break but you're not doing anyone any favors by letting them shoot up dope in perpetuity.
As I understand it, it's a very large part of the process. Even in countries where they've straight up legalized some of the harder drugs, one of the biggest goals is to have someone there to talk to that isn't a dealer.
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Old 10-20-2017, 11:06 AM   #23
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Whelp, glad we didn't get that suite/penthouse in Castello.
Ha I live super close to the Chumir.. oh well it makes sense and I doubt the area will be any worse off than it already is
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Old 10-20-2017, 11:21 AM   #24
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I would hope this a mandatory, "strings attached" corollary to anyone using these facilities, no? I get that it's a hard addiction to break but you're not doing anyone any favors by letting them shoot up dope in perpetuity.
You can't just make it a mandatory strings attached thing or addicts just will go elsewhere. You can offer it, but trying to push treatment on someone usually doesn't go well.
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Old 10-20-2017, 02:36 PM   #25
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You can't just make it a mandatory strings attached thing or addicts just will go elsewhere. You can offer it, but trying to push treatment on someone usually doesn't go well.
My hope (and expectation) is that anybody running these understands that there is a right and a wrong way to approach treatment. "Pushing" treatment is a much worse tactic than simply making it available. Addicts already get judged at every turn and are made to feel sub-human, so anything preachy will – as you noted – go over poorly. I think for a lot of addicts they want a place that can watch them for 20 minutes to make sure the drugs they've just used weren't more harmful than intended.
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Old 12-07-2018, 12:16 PM   #26
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Interesting comments about what's going on around the permanent injection site at Chumir. Some posters apparently don't notice anything.

Google Search image results in a best guess of . . . "Calgary".



The downside of living near a safe injection site

https://www.reddit.com/r/Calgary/com...njection_site/

- This looks like my place!

Seriously though, this is the reality. Every morning landlords take tongs and look for needles. It really sucks and am looking to move out of this area.

- Thank you for posting this. I used to live near the Chumir, and after they opened the safe injection clinic, things went downhill fast. Used to routinely find needles around my place. It's actually the main reason I moved.

- I work in the Chumir and i know to keep my head down when leaving the building and walking through the main floor.

Have to keep in mind that the Chumir only takes care of Chumir property. After the peeps are done what they need to do, once they exit the building, it's not the Chumir's responsibility any more. That poor Church right across from the injection site has it bad. Along with the other buildings all around because they go and who knows what they do in those area.

And totally sad about memorial park. So beautiful but never ever touch that water in the fountain and don't every trek through the grass. It's so abused and the things i see happening im like... O_o ... whyyyyyyyy

- i live on 15th ave near there and there are needles in my parking spot every day. i'm torn on this issue cause i live down here and i understand that preventing overdoses is important, but i've had 2 friends be mugged in the past 6 months in this neighborhood, I just don't feel really safe. People are going to do drugs either way, and the prevention of needless deaths is important, but we need more police presence down here to deal with the side effects.

- I live 2 blocks from it. I walk past it every day. I use the library and walk through memorial park playing ingress weekly. I walk to Vic park lrt often.

I don't recall ever seeing a needle on the ground.
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Old 12-07-2018, 01:48 PM   #27
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- Many people from the area have complained - The condo board of the apartment building I live in has complained a few times, but to no avail as there's no much the Chumir can do about it. Users get the needles but the Chumir can't stop them from leaving. Most of them do the drugs within a 2-3 block radius.

The issue is probably having it there in the first place. The Beltline was finally on a roll after years of being a gritty neighborhood, and now it's reverting back.


I live right next to the Chumir and it's really disappointing. I understand and appreciate both the social, health, and economic benefits of safe injection sites, but cleanup and prevention of these issues isn't being tackled by anybody.
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Old 12-07-2018, 02:48 PM   #28
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I lived right by the Chumir from about 2013 to late 2017 and didn't see any issues with needles around at the time. Disappointing if that's what's happening now.

I now live walking distance to the DTES in Vancouver and pictures like that are part of every day life. This is just my own anecdotal experience but from what I've seen safe injection sites don't keep needles and drug use off the streets. I suppose its possible it could be worse without them. Seems to me a lot of users simply get their gear from the sites and wander around and leave their debris on the streets anyways.
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Old 12-07-2018, 02:49 PM   #29
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Set up a needle recycling program like they do with bottles and watch how many you won't see lying around anymore.
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Old 12-07-2018, 03:06 PM   #30
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I lived right by the Chumir from about 2013 to late 2017 and didn't see any issues with needles around at the time. Disappointing if that's what's happening now.
You left "just in time" I guess. They opened up January 2018.

Looks like Edmonton is seeing some of the same. National Post reporter went off recently about it up there as well:

https://twitter.com/user/status/1067510335693701120
https://twitter.com/user/status/1067511675329212416
https://twitter.com/user/status/1067511839389437952
https://twitter.com/user/status/1067515288839569408
https://twitter.com/user/status/1067599963847188481


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Set up a needle recycling program like they do with bottles and watch how many you won't see lying around anymore.
I get the idea but I think it ends up a being a Cobra Effect. Free needle hand outs to drug users (unlimited?), give drug users a source of money to convert for more drugs, more needles out there in general, etc.

Last edited by chemgear; 12-07-2018 at 03:11 PM.
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Old 12-07-2018, 03:17 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame View Post
Set up a needle recycling program like they do with bottles and watch how many you won't see lying around anymore.
Based on the types of people and the lengths they'll go to to pick up a can or bottle for 5cents, I don't think monetarily encouraging them to pick up needles is a good idea.
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Old 12-07-2018, 03:26 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chemgear View Post
Interesting comments about what's going on around the permanent injection site at Chumir. Some posters apparently don't notice anything.

Google Search image results in a best guess of . . . "Calgary".



The downside of living near a safe injection site

https://www.reddit.com/r/Calgary/com...njection_site/

- This looks like my place!

Seriously though, this is the reality. Every morning landlords take tongs and look for needles. It really sucks and am looking to move out of this area.

- Thank you for posting this. I used to live near the Chumir, and after they opened the safe injection clinic, things went downhill fast. Used to routinely find needles around my place. It's actually the main reason I moved.

- I work in the Chumir and i know to keep my head down when leaving the building and walking through the main floor.

Have to keep in mind that the Chumir only takes care of Chumir property. After the peeps are done what they need to do, once they exit the building, it's not the Chumir's responsibility any more. That poor Church right across from the injection site has it bad. Along with the other buildings all around because they go and who knows what they do in those area.

And totally sad about memorial park. So beautiful but never ever touch that water in the fountain and don't every trek through the grass. It's so abused and the things i see happening im like... O_o ... whyyyyyyyy

- i live on 15th ave near there and there are needles in my parking spot every day. i'm torn on this issue cause i live down here and i understand that preventing overdoses is important, but i've had 2 friends be mugged in the past 6 months in this neighborhood, I just don't feel really safe. People are going to do drugs either way, and the prevention of needless deaths is important, but we need more police presence down here to deal with the side effects.

- I live 2 blocks from it. I walk past it every day. I use the library and walk through memorial park playing ingress weekly. I walk to Vic park lrt often.

I don't recall ever seeing a needle on the ground.
See...this is my problem with the lunacy of safe injection sites.

What is safe about this? How is this safe for children??? Chumir is next to two parks, a church, a library. Walking your dog becomes an adventure. I lived near Chumir a few years ago, and can only assume just how bad it has gotten based on the photos, considering the area was mostly clean before and quiet. You had vagrants here and there, but nothing dramatic.

Why does socialist governments want to constantly destroy communities like this? What is the point of a safe injection site when people just take the needles and go get high in a corner elsewhere? The lunacy of allowing this crap is insane, what is healthy and safe about this???
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Old 12-07-2018, 03:26 PM   #33
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Based on the types of people and the lengths they'll go to to pick up a can or bottle for 5cents, I don't think monetarily encouraging them to pick up needles is a good idea.
Getting people to pick up their own mess should be the ultimate goal. And like any group of people, they need incentive to do it.

Money, gift cards, social assistance, clothing/food/shelter - whatever it is, give them something. Otherwise the same stuff is just going to keep happening.
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Old 12-07-2018, 03:28 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by killer_carlson View Post
4 safe drug use sites announced for Edmonton as approved by Health Canada. News report says Calgary announcement to occur with 30 days.

As someone who until recently lived downtown and witnessed needles in streets, parking areas, backyards and near playgrounds, Mark me down as a supporter. If this keeps more needles off the streets, backyards, playgrounds then it is a success.

http://edmontonjournal.com/news/loca...sumption-sites
It's doing the complete opposite.
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Old 12-07-2018, 03:46 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame View Post
Getting people to pick up their own mess should be the ultimate goal. And like any group of people, they need incentive to do it.

Money, gift cards, social assistance, clothing/food/shelter - whatever it is, give them something. Otherwise the same stuff is just going to keep happening.
These people are in no state to manage their own mess unfortunately, with or without incentive. Even when getting cans they are essentially dumping the entire contents of garbage bins out onto the streets, in front of business, in parks. They would have no better success dealing with their own needles. Frankly they even use the streets as their personal toilets.

Huge problem with no easy solution, but I don't think safe injection sites really have it figured out like some people think they do. Especially if they are just handing needles out for addicts to take away with them, because those end up littered everywhere for the normal people to have to step over when they are walking to work, walking dogs, going for coffee, etc.
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"I was like Christ, lying on my back, with my arms outstretched, crucified"
-- Frank Musil - Early January 1994
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Old 12-07-2018, 03:54 PM   #36
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I think it is also very hard for people and businesses in the area to speak up. If they do so, they get screamed down about saving lives and the "greater good". But it's not a surprise that the things seem to be like this.

And that's not to say that injection sites are not saving lives. For all we decry NIMBYism, people not in those areas (and the rest of the city) should see that nearby people are taking the hard loss and associated side effects.

Last edited by chemgear; 12-07-2018 at 03:56 PM.
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Old 12-07-2018, 04:05 PM   #37
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https://twitter.com/user/status/1067851597340860417

This kind of response bugs me. Of course you feel bad for these people, but why does that mean people should be content with this kind of activity in these communities?

Last edited by Ashasx; 12-07-2018 at 04:09 PM.
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Old 12-07-2018, 04:11 PM   #38
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Yeah, that's straight bull####.
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Old 12-07-2018, 04:29 PM   #39
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These people are in no state to manage their own mess unfortunately, with or without incentive. Even when getting cans they are essentially dumping the entire contents of garbage bins out onto the streets, in front of business, in parks. They would have no better success dealing with their own needles. Frankly they even use the streets as their personal toilets.
I don't really understand what is being said here. You are saying they always dump garbage out when collecting cans? That's just not true, unless they are doing some serious dumpster diving. Most can and bottle pickers don't make a mess like that, especially if they are just picking through regular garbage cans or recycling bins.

If there is incentive, they will do it. The bottle/can recycling is more than evident of that.
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Old 12-07-2018, 04:39 PM   #40
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I don't really understand what is being said here. You are saying they always dump garbage out when collecting cans? That's just not true, unless they are doing some serious dumpster diving. Most can and bottle pickers don't make a mess like that, especially if they are just picking through regular garbage cans or recycling bins.

If there is incentive, they will do it. The bottle/can recycling is more than evident of that.

That is exactly what I'm saying. Although I'm speaking more about my observations here in Vancouver. You'll often see piles of trash from garbage bins thrown around all over the place. I'm assuming they are looking for cans when doing it. That being said the drug problem in Vancouver is next level. And granted, I don't think the standard homeless person is doing it. But when the addicts are doing it they literally throw trash all over the place.
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A few weeks after crashing head-first into the boards (denting his helmet and being unable to move for a little while) following a hit from behind by Bob Errey, the Calgary Flames player explains:

"I was like Christ, lying on my back, with my arms outstretched, crucified"
-- Frank Musil - Early January 1994

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