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Old 02-28-2021, 08:49 AM   #201
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Only message I want to hear from him is retire
And maybe you should - from posting.

Gio’s lost a step at D. Were you ever good at posting?
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Old 02-28-2021, 09:34 AM   #202
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We're honestly not assuming that these lines work because it worked in an afternoon game against Ottawa are we?

I'm hopeful, and I agree with those that say you have to make the playoffs first, but that lifeless mess against Dallas in that playoff series.

See where it goes I guess.
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Old 02-28-2021, 10:29 AM   #203
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We're honestly not assuming that these lines work because it worked in an afternoon game against Ottawa are we?

I'm hopeful, and I agree with those that say you have to make the playoffs first, but that lifeless mess against Dallas in that playoff series.

See where it goes I guess.
I think these lines give us our best chance.

...to make the playoffs and then get smoked in the first round, because no amount of line juggling is going to overcome the poor system, weak centre position, and players that just generally can’t play hockey when things demand emotional engagement.
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Old 02-28-2021, 10:33 AM   #204
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We're honestly not assuming that these lines work because it worked in an afternoon game against Ottawa are we?

I'm hopeful, and I agree with those that say you have to make the playoffs first, but that lifeless mess against Dallas in that playoff series.

See where it goes I guess.
Well those lines worked in the two previous regular seasons and they worked against Winnipeg. Against Dallas they did not exist for most of the series because Tkachuk was out. The new lines never worked this season 5 on 5 and indeed this team would likely be below the Sens in the standings but for Markstrom and a very good power play in the first 12 games. Once those two things dried up the abysmal ability of these new lines was displayed for all to see. This team is still not an elite team with the old lines but it was a lottery contender with the new lines that were tried for 21 games this season.
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Old 02-28-2021, 10:58 AM   #205
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We're honestly not assuming that these lines work because it worked in an afternoon game against Ottawa are we?

I'm hopeful, and I agree with those that say you have to make the playoffs first, but that lifeless mess against Dallas in that playoff series.

See where it goes I guess.
The lifeless mess wasn't the lines. The lifeless mess was a result of Dallas adjusting to our breakout and trapping at the blueline, short circuiting Ward's systems, and then the team not making a single adjustment. Winning a series is all about adjusting and finding ways for your talent to be successful. Did Calgary change anything in their approach to their offensive game against Dallas? Did they adjust their defensive strategy when the Dallas defensemen were killing the Flames? A big no to either. Dallas adjusted to Calgary's strategy and neutralized the offensive and then took advantage in Calgary's end. The Flames never made an adjustment and got crushed as a result. It's like running between the tackles and getting shutdown series after series and not trying anything else. When 11 (12) guys are lined up in the line of scrimmage, do something different to force them off the line and maybe open that game back up. Ward kept running inside the tackles guards. That's why we got embarrassed. Not a single adjustment was made other than pugging in the line blender. The lines still ran right into the brick wall between the guards. How this idiot got an extension is a question that people will ponder for generations to come.
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Old 02-28-2021, 11:06 AM   #206
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Winning in the playoffs is also about having an extra gear, which this core has shown they do not have, via multiple coaches. It ain’t just the system.

With one minute remaining in a playoff game, down one goal, who do they look down the bench at and think “that guy is gonna go TAKE this victory for us”? We don’t have those guys.
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Old 02-28-2021, 11:27 AM   #207
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Only message I want to hear from him is retire
He can't tell you when to retire, that's up to you.
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Old 02-28-2021, 11:53 AM   #208
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The lifeless mess wasn't the lines. The lifeless mess was a result of Dallas adjusting to our breakout and trapping at the blueline, short circuiting Ward's systems, and then the team not making a single adjustment. Winning a series is all about adjusting and finding ways for your talent to be successful. Did Calgary change anything in their approach to their offensive game against Dallas? Did they adjust their defensive strategy when the Dallas defensemen were killing the Flames? A big no to either. Dallas adjusted to Calgary's strategy and neutralized the offensive and then took advantage in Calgary's end. The Flames never made an adjustment and got crushed as a result. It's like running between the tackles and getting shutdown series after series and not trying anything else. When 11 (12) guys are lined up in the line of scrimmage, do something different to force them off the line and maybe open that game back up. Ward kept running inside the tackles guards. That's why we got embarrassed. Not a single adjustment was made other than pugging in the line blender. The lines still ran right into the brick wall between the guards. How this idiot got an extension is a question that people will ponder for generations to come.
Have Rick Bowness and the Stars forgotten how to make “adjustments”?

Same winning % as the Flames and a worse record over the last 10 games.
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Old 02-28-2021, 11:58 AM   #209
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Have Rick Bowness and the Stars forgotten how to make “adjustments”?

Same winning % as the Flames and a worse record over the last 10 games.
Wild stab in the dark but I suspect their 10 day layoff due to Covid and then coming back and playing two of the top teams in the league that did not have a layoff had an adverse effect on them.
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Old 02-28-2021, 12:00 PM   #210
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Wild stab in the dark but I suspect their 10 day layoff due to Covid and then coming back and playing two of the top teams in the league that did not have a layoff had an adverse effect on them.
No mercy for Flames playing 6 in 9 nights with extensive travel?
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Old 02-28-2021, 12:07 PM   #211
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No mercy for Flames playing 6 in 9 nights with extensive travel?
Oh that had an adverse impact no doubt. Keeping those atrocious lines for 21 games had an impact. I suspect both the schedule and hopefully going back to the old lines on a permanent basis will conspire together to allow the Flames to go on a bit of a run in the month of March. I personally do not blame Ward for this idiocy of trying Lindholm as the 2nd line center and Backlund as the third line center for 40% of the season, that struck me as a whole organization approach and one that they seemed completely resistant to changing course from. Fortunately the results were so horrifically bad and I suspect over the next 5-6 games that the results 5 on 5 of the old lines will be so demonstrably better that that experiment will not be tried again with this current compilation of players.

If I had a criticism of Ward outside the fact that I do not think he is as strong of a Head Coach as most other NHL Head Coaches it would be an organizational group think approach to issues. But that is more reflective of management not wanting to have a HC who is an independent power center and is something that happens in many workplaces. I suspect a Laviolette or a Trotz may have given up on those lines a lot earlier. But that is just speculation on my part.

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Old 02-28-2021, 12:21 PM   #212
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We're honestly not assuming that these lines work because it worked in an afternoon game against Ottawa are we?

I'm hopeful, and I agree with those that say you have to make the playoffs first, but that lifeless mess against Dallas in that playoff series.

See where it goes I guess.
This is what I’ve been saying. I know Ottawa’s been playing better but their D still gives lots of time and space which is what that top line always thrived on. They looked good, but I want to see them against a tight D.
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Old 02-28-2021, 01:03 PM   #213
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Have Rick Bowness and the Stars forgotten how to make “adjustments”?

Same winning % as the Flames and a worse record over the last 10 games.
That's a dumb statement and you know it. Very different situations. Every other team in the league having a head start on them has contributed to their woes, would you not agree? They are playing catchup on every team right now.
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Old 02-28-2021, 01:06 PM   #214
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That's a dumb statement and you know it. Very different situations. Every other team in the league having a head start on them has contributed to their woes, would you not agree? They are playing catchup on every team right now.
They started the season 4-1-1.
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Old 02-28-2021, 01:13 PM   #215
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We're honestly not assuming that these lines work because it worked in an afternoon game against Ottawa are we?

I'm hopeful, and I agree with those that say you have to make the playoffs first, but that lifeless mess against Dallas in that playoff series.

See where it goes I guess.
We didn't have those lines against Dallas though, loosing Tkachuk hurt a lot.
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Old 02-28-2021, 01:19 PM   #216
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The lifeless mess wasn't the lines. The lifeless mess was a result of Dallas adjusting to our breakout and trapping at the blueline, short circuiting Ward's systems, and then the team not making a single adjustment. Winning a series is all about adjusting and finding ways for your talent to be successful. Did Calgary change anything in their approach to their offensive game against Dallas? Did they adjust their defensive strategy when the Dallas defensemen were killing the Flames? A big no to either. Dallas adjusted to Calgary's strategy and neutralized the offensive and then took advantage in Calgary's end. The Flames never made an adjustment and got crushed as a result. It's like running between the tackles and getting shutdown series after series and not trying anything else. When 11 (12) guys are lined up in the line of scrimmage, do something different to force them off the line and maybe open that game back up. Ward kept running inside the tackles guards. That's why we got embarrassed. Not a single adjustment was made other than pugging in the line blender. The lines still ran right into the brick wall between the guards. How this idiot got an extension is a question that people will ponder for generations to come.
I'm not advocating for any changes currently because it's working and they need wins and points in the standings. I think they are playing good and have a style of play they feel comfortable with, the players like, the coaches like and they should stick to it. I think they are all smart and know what works. Keep doing it! Keep building on this game - so many good things and just buy in 100% to what the coaches want.

I'm for whatever works and has the team feeling good. I'm behind them no matter what.


Aside from other points people brought up about Tkachuk being hurt for DAL there were some things that I noticed that series (But really this is just for high stakes, high pressure games):

DAL had 2 guys on Gaudreau (and sometimes it looked like 4 guys collapsing on him). DAL was trying to take away Gaudreau being the engine to CGY offense.

I would see Gaudreau get the puck in his end. Playoff time (in past series too) this was key. Where was Johnny getting the puck? I heard Conroy on the radio prior to this season's start essentially break this down: saying Johnny would get 2 guys on him BUT Conroy thought Johnny should go even deeper into his end to get the puck (I'm guessing so he could wind up more going into the attack).

To me, again I know nothing, the fact an opponent is putting 2 guys on you is something to exploit - use the space that is open when 2 guys are on 1 guy. Make Johnny a decoy until the puck is in the offensive zone perhaps?

Is it Monahan then carries the puck? (Yes but also have d that can lug it) and have Johnny up ice for more quick strike option but also just keeping the opponent occupied with him and creating even more space for the puck to come up underneath Gaudreau. Mix it up - use all of that: Johnny go deeper and wind up, Monny lug it, D carry it (Hanifin etc). Yes play connected and puck support but if they are trying to take away something - use that to your advantage. Can you use Lindholm (on the purple gatorade line as the RW or slipping into the middle but still on that line) more to carry it. Monahan continues to look good in that 3 on 3 game down low, the centre in the pocket. These are the questions.

How were CGY other lines successful in getting out and into offensive zone? If you have to dump it, I don't see putting it in Gaudreau's corner and asking him to take a hit to make a play is wise. I don't know how to solve that but use the other two 200+lbs guys on that line to get in there and have Gaudreau in space (and be the one dumping not retrieving), not up against the boards expecting him to absorb punishment. Heck use the LD to forecheck if it goes into that corner and have a fwd cover until the forecheck has traction and the LD can back out. But I like Gaudreau near the opponent net, in space because he can turn those touches into instant great chances - he is relentless at that.

In your football analogy: if a team is doubling your WR then another receiver is getting 1 on 1. For nostalgic Stamps fans: If Allen Pitts or someother dynamic American WR was being doubled it was always the Canadian slot who would come up big in playoff games.

DAL was also going with 3 guys along the center line as CGY tried to stretch pass (indirect passes off the wall too) and DAL was just picking it off. So if the pressure is 5 guys from the centre line in - how does CGY beat that pressure and make plays to get out with possession or into the offensive zone?

Not comparing talent on teams but more of a game plan type example:

When Johnny was on Team North America - how was he used? Was he going deep to get the puck and wind up and bring it up? I saw a very electric Gaudreau in that tourney, getting sprung on breakaways, being the distributor on PP, making amazing passes like the one he did for Vali last game.

Against COL I recall reading how they didn't deal with speed down the middle as best as they could. I think these types of things are what they were trying to explore with Lindholm in the middle - and he's good there.

Lindholm and Backlund are excellent 2 way pivots because they play within the structure so well and they both skate (speed, agility etc) very well. Both are also very good offensively. But they aren't the pure offense guys who back people off. In football (soccer) terms they have a more holding midfielder approach than attacking midfielder. Don't get me wrong they are really good offensively and are very high end but I think people (though not me) think you have to have those break the ankle types like they grow on trees.

But chemistry, confidence and consistency in the entire mix of 12 matter. I'm for the team rallying around that. When those are there you get passes that connect, you get guys knowing where team mates want the puck and they kind of put it there early so a guy skates on to it (like a QB throws before the WR has made his break) the anticipation is there and needed with how good all the coaching is in the league.

Rittich, Markstrom the goalies have given me confidence from the outset because of their consistency. Build around that. Grow from that.

PP looked good last game! But the entire team game looked good last game. That should be the standard Flames hockey.

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Old 02-28-2021, 01:20 PM   #217
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Wild stab in the dark but I suspect their 10 day layoff due to Covid and then coming back and playing two of the top teams in the league that did not have a layoff had an adverse effect on them.
Flames got off to a decent start, then had a forced week off and then had to play the Toronto and Montreal, which was really going well at the time.

Dallas played well after their break, 4-0, but lost series to Chicago and Carolina (twice). Busted a 6 game losing streak last week and then lost two in a row.
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Old 02-28-2021, 01:28 PM   #218
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This is what I’ve been saying. I know Ottawa’s been playing better but their D still gives lots of time and space which is what that top line always thrived on. They looked good, but I want to see them against a tight D.
So third round of the playoffs?
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Old 02-28-2021, 01:30 PM   #219
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We didn't have those lines against Dallas though, loosing Tkachuk hurt a lot.
nobody ever mentions this...Calgary was missing their top scorer. No credit for the Jets series because they were missing players but Calgary losing their top scorer from the season is basically a footnote.

Imagine any other team losings their leading scorer in the playoffs and its front page news
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Old 02-28-2021, 01:30 PM   #220
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So third round of the playoffs?
March 11. Tighter than Ottawa’s anyway.
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