NHL projects salary cap to rise from $81.5mil to $84 mil-$88.2 mil

[SuperMatt18]

Put me in the camp that is happy that we didn't sign a 27 year old Mark Stone to a 8 year $10M contract, and that would rather not sign Taylor Hall or Gaudreau to 7/8 year contracts at $10M+ per season.

Except for the truly generational forwards (Kane,Ovy, Crosby, Malkin) age curves don't tend to treat forwards well, especially at 5v5 scoring.

There are 5 forwards aged 30 or over that are PPG this year.
-Marchand
-Kane
-Malkin
-Ovechkin
- Crosby

The top 5 scoring forwards over 35 are:

Eric Staal: 0.71 PPG
Parise: 0.67 PPG
Brown: 0.49 PPG
Pavelski: 0.46 PPG

For these guys that are really good players, but not generational, and around 27-30 years old that are getting 8 year contracts the likelihood is you are getting 3-4 good years (until about age 32/33), and then 3-4 years where they are really over paid and the deal is not good.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

It's no Gaudreau to Hall
It's Gaudreau to Hall+whatever Johnny can be traded for.

You're leaving out a massive piece of the equation. A gigantic long term contract with high likelihood of becoming an anchor.

The issue should be whether the pieces you want the Flames to acquire are worth two years of Gaudreau at a good value contract. What are those pieces?

For me, Taylor Hall at seven years, $10 million per is a no. Whether Gaudreau is on my team or not.

And I also think whether you actually watch the player much does count. I have watched less than 60 minutes of Taylor Hall play hockey in the last two years so that should be considered when evaluating my opinion. I'm no expert on the guy. But to your point, of course you shouldn't assume someone who disagrees with you doesn't watch the guy.

[SuperMatt18]

On top of my previous note.

Here are contracts signed between Jan 1 2014 and Jan 1 2018 (players are 2-6 years into their contracts) for players that were 26 or older at the time, for 6+ years and $7M+

Carey Price: 29 - 8 x $10.5M (6 years remaining)
M.E. Vlasic: 30 - 8 x $7M (6 years remaining)
Brent Burns: 31 - 8 x $8M (5 years remaining)
Jamie Benn: 26 - 8 x $9.5M (5 years remaining)
Steven Stamkos: 26 - 8 x $8.5M (4 years remaining)
Anze Kopitar: 28 - 8 x $10M (4 years remaining)
Bobby Ryan: 27 - 7 x $7.25M (2 years remaining)
John Toews: 26 - 8 x $10.5M (3 years remaining)
Dion Phaneuf: 28 - 7 x $7.0M (Bought out)

Outside of Stamkos who signed for a huge discount at the time, and maybe Toews/Kopitar, which of those players are you super excited about having on your roster long term for $10M+ right now?

If the player is 26 like Toews & Stamkos were then I think you look at an 8 year term, but if they are 28 years or older, just stay away. 30 years old? Don't even think about it.

[bax]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Put me in the camp that is happy that we didn't sign a 27 year old Mark Stone to a 8 year $10M contract, and that would rather not sign Taylor Hall or Gaudreau to 7/8 year contracts at $10M+ per season.

Except for the truly generational forwards (Kane,Ovy, Crosby, Malkin) age curves don't tend to treat forwards well, especially at 5v5 scoring.

There are 5 forwards aged 30 or over that are PPG this year.
-Marchand
-Kane
-Malkin
-Ovechkin
- Crosby

The top 5 scoring forwards over 35 are:

Eric Staal: 0.71 PPG
Parise: 0.67 PPG
Brown: 0.49 PPG
Pavelski: 0.46 PPG

For these guys that are really good players, but not generational, and around 27-30 years old that are getting 8 year contracts the likelihood is you are getting 3-4 good years (until about age 32/33), and then 3-4 years where they are really over paid and the deal is not good.

I’m not arguing against that, but at some point you have to say let’s be great now and worry about the last half of the contract in 4 years.

It’s basically unprecedented that a high end UFA has serious interest in signing in Calgary. Take advantage when you can.

Who knows how high the cap will be then? Have to go all in at some point

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by bax

I’m not arguing against that, but at some point you have to say let’s be great now and worry about the last half of the contract in 4 years.

It’s basically unprecedented that a high end UFA has serious interest in signing in Calgary. Take advantage when you can.

Who knows how high the cap will be then? Have to go all in at some point

This.

Its time to either take a crap or get off the toilet.

This core needs to be improved/added to in order to have a legit shot at winning a cup.

I'd rather sign a 22 year old right shot #1C than sign Hall, but I don't see one of those available anywhere, so why not sign the high end offensive winger if he's willing to come to Calgary?

[MacDaddy77]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

This.

Its time to either take a crap or get off the toilet.

This core needs to be improved/added to in order to have a legit shot at winning a cup.

I'd rather sign a 22 year old right shot #1C than sign Hall, but I don't see one of those available anywhere, so why not sign the high end offensive winger if he's willing to come to Calgary?

Gaudreau is our trading chip to acquire player X bolded.

Hall is signed to replace some of what Gaudreau brings. This of course assumes that Flames have the conversation with Gaudreau and ask if the money is there is he interested in staying or is he leaving regardless

[Strange Brew]

So which 22 year old right shot #1 C are we acquiring?

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

So which 22 year old right shot #1 C are we acquiring?

I would say the correct answer to that is its not gonna happen.

If i could wave a magic wand it'd Barzal though.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I would say the correct answer to that is its not gonna happen.

If i could wave a magic wand it'd Barzal though.

That might not be as far fetched as you think. There has been rumblings Barzal and Trotz don't get along.

[Hockey-and_stuff]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

That might not be as far fetched as you think. There has been rumblings Barzal and Trotz don't get along.

Not sure how much input Trotz has on roster construction but I doubt Gaudreau is on his list of favourite players.

If you're moving Barzal because Trotz doesn't want him on the team you'd think he would get to pick the guy he replaces him with.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

That might not be as far fetched as you think. There has been rumblings Barzal and Trotz don't get along.

Well that'd be fantastic

Would you trade Gaudreau for Barzal?
Do you think the Isles would?

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

That might not be as far fetched as you think. There has been rumblings Barzal and Trotz don't get along.

Where? Show us a legitimate source.

Plenty of players don't get along with their coaches. These 'rumblings' mean next to nothing.

[AC]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Where? Show us a legitimate source.

Plenty of players don't get along with their coaches. These 'rumblings' mean next to nothing.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1066120765961981952

https://twitter.com/user/status/1205955730454589441

https://twitter.com/user/status/1219813262012731392

https://twitter.com/user/status/1219817169233620999

A while ago Bissonnette on SpititnChiclets mentioned he'd heard rumblings, then when the most recent quotes came out he mentioned he had received a lot of backlash from Isles fans for his initial report and reiterated he wasn't just speculating but he knew what he was talking about.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Where? Show us a legitimate source.

Plenty of players don't get along with their coaches. These 'rumblings' mean next to nothing.

I was merely speculating maybe he is not untouchable.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Well that'd be fantastic

Would you trade Gaudreau for Barzal?
Do you think the Isles would?

In a heartbeat. Not sure if the Isles would. We would have to add I think.

[Roof-Daddy]

I said this in another thread awhile ago when this was being discussed....if Barzal gets traded and Treliving doesn't bring him to the Flames I'll be soooooo pissed.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I said this in another thread awhile ago when this was being discussed....if Barzal gets traded and Treliving doesn't bring him to the Flames I'll be soooooo pissed.

Depends if Barzal would even want to play here.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by AC

https://twitter.com/user/status/1066120765961981952

https://twitter.com/user/status/1205955730454589441

https://twitter.com/user/status/1219813262012731392

https://twitter.com/user/status/1219817169233620999

A while ago Bissonnette on SpititnChiclets mentioned he'd heard rumblings, then when the most recent quotes came out he mentioned he had received a lot of backlash from Isles fans for his initial report and reiterated he wasn't just speculating but he knew what he was talking about.

Seems like business as usual.

Barzal isn't the first young player to receive some tough love from a coach, and he won't be the last. Sure, he might harbour some hard feelings and he might not be sure he wants to play for the Islanders long term, but coming out of entry level he has next to no leverage. When was the last time Lou Lamorillo came up short on a controlled asset?

I have a hard time believing he's in another jersey come next season. If he is, it is going to be at a heavy cost. ie: Seth Jones - Ryan Johanssen. If I'm Lou, I'm bypassing Gaudreau and targeting Tkachuck.

I don't see the Flames having the assets to pull this off.

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Seems like business as usual.



Barzal isn't the first young player to receive some tough love from a coach, and he won't be the last. Sure, he might harbour some hard feelings and he might not be sure he wants to play for the Islanders long term, but coming out of entry level he has next to no leverage. When was the last time Lou Lamorillo came up short on a controlled asset?



I have a hard time believing he's in another jersey come next season. If he is, it is going to be at a heavy cost. ie: Seth Jones - Ryan Johanssen. If I'm Lou, I'm bypassing Gaudreau and targeting Tkachuck.



I don't see the Flames having the assets to pull this off.

Oh man I wouldn't hesitate at trading valimaki dube and a 1st or 2. Barzal is awesome. You're probably right about the cost though.

Sent from my SM-G960W using Tapatalk

[GioforPM]

NYI has about $13-14M in space next year, about 8 spots to fill including Barzal and a backup goalie. It might become a difficult negotiation if Barzal is unhappy.