By far the biggest disappointment in the series was the lack of payoff for the White Walkers. I would watch a children of the forest/first men war series, just so they would have the opportunity to retcon why the Night King allowed himself to die, and ordered his most powerful generals to sit the last battle out.
There has been something that has been bothering me for some time about the last couple of seasons of GOT. Having read a lot of RR Martin before GOT, I kind of had an idea of his writing style, and how a lot of his surprises, and twists, are never really twists at all but rather a subversion of expectation.
A video was just released, from a youtuber that has been at it for a long time, that sums up my one suspicion about the storyline after the television series caught up to the books as source material. It's common knowledge that Martin told D&D who was going to be sitting the Iron Throne at the end of the book, and the broad strokes of how they get there. D&D then went about finishing the story as if it were a nice linear CSI episode.
In the spoiler, I will say what my issue was with the end of the series, and underneath that the video, if you wish to go into it with a bit more depth. Fair warning that personally I find merit in this theory.
Spoiler!
From the very first book, there is given some ancient background on the war between the Children of the Forest and the First Men. The Children, long lived, possessive and vengeful, disappear leaving victory to the humans. From there, the Children create the White Walkers, the Three Eyed (Blood) Raven.... and Bran. For them, the war never ended. For the Children, the Walkers, Raven or Bran are tools to destroy the First Men, and those that followed.
I hate to say it, but I think that after the Winds of Winter, there is another book. Luckily, I think that Winds of Winter has been done for a while, and the final book is what Martin is working on. Judging from some of the stories about adaptations of the Sand Kings, and things like that, he would take great enjoyment in letting the television series stew in its own juices for a while, whether he was ready to publish or not.
Winds of Winter ends where the series ends, and the followup deals with the end of the story. D&D never asked if there was anything beyond the Iron Throne.
Spoiler!
__________________
"We don't even know who our best player is yet. It could be any one of us at this point." - Peter LaFleur, player/coach, Average Joe's Gymnasium
From the very first book, there is given some ancient background on the war between the Children of the Forest and the First Men. The Children, long lived, possessive and vengeful, disappear leaving victory to the humans. From there, the Children create the White Walkers, the Three Eyed (Blood) Raven.... and Bran. For them, the war never ended. For the Children, the Walkers, Raven or Bran are tools to destroy the First Men, and those that followed.
I hate to say it, but I think that after the Winds of Winter, there is another book. Luckily, I think that Winds of Winter has been done for a while, and the final book is what Martin is working on. Judging from some of the stories about adaptations of the Sand Kings, and things like that, he would take great enjoyment in letting the television series stew in its own juices for a while, whether he was ready to publish or not.
Winds of Winter ends where the series ends, and the followup deals with the end of the story. D&D never asked if there was anything beyond the Iron Throne.
There's always been plans for a book after TWOW. A Dream of Spring. As for plot, who knows, beyond the vague hints GRRM gives.
While it's possible that TWOW is ready, I personally don't think so. I just can't see the publishing company holding off because that's a ton of money they could be getting.
GRRM has a stranglehold on his publishing contract. He's not concerned about money, so much as legacy. He didn't leave the show on good terms after season four (three?) and from that point didn't really care if they couldn't keep up with the quality of his writing.
Spoiler!
I guess my point is that the television series didn't even get into what will be the last book. It ends after Winds of Winter. He does give vague hints on this series, but he's not been shy about his love of fables, and a lot of his stories read like Grimm (or the like). The television series sure didn't end like a fable.
Anyway, if the books do come out before everyone in the series is too old to play the parts, they could go onto a Season Nine, with GRRM's involvement and put a pretty satisfying bow on the whole thing! I'd love a final season that plays like a horror movie.
__________________
"We don't even know who our best player is yet. It could be any one of us at this point." - Peter LaFleur, player/coach, Average Joe's Gymnasium
I don't think it would be that interesting, the Dragons are gone, the Targaryn's are gone. The good villains are gone, there's a unemotional dufus on the throne who can see the future.
Where would they go with it?
East? There is a huge continent there barely explored, and possibly more?
We may get one more book from him but the likelihood is really low.
It's more likely he'll pass away and his pages and notes will be given to a ghostwriter to finish the story. They're not going to leave that money on the table.
I think he's lost interest in the series. Not uncommon with obscenely large projects like this. The planning stage was fun. Now that he has to execute, he's already burnt out.
I think he's lost interest in the series. Not uncommon with obscenely large projects like this. The planning stage was fun. Now that he has to execute, he's already burnt out.
Fantasy writer loves world building, can't really complete a narrative. Tale as old as time.
Fantasy writer loves world building, can't really complete a narrative. Tale as old as time.
I should write a 3, no 6, no 9 book series on the trials and tribulations of a fantasy writer and his attempt at world building. Just think of the world within a world building that is possible!
Last edited by Cecil Terwilliger; 12-03-2020 at 11:49 AM.
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I should write a 3 no 6, no 9 book series on the trials and tribulations of a fantasy writer and his attempt at world building. Just think of the world within a world building that is possible!
We may get one more book from him but the likelihood is really low.
It's more likely he'll pass away and his pages and notes will be given to a ghostwriter to finish the story. They're not going to leave that money on the table.
Enter Brandon Sanderson, he finished up The Wheel of Time after Robert Jordan passed and he actually puts books out in a timely fashion.
Enter Brandon Sanderson, he finished up The Wheel of Time after Robert Jordan passed and he actually puts books out in a timely fashion.
Brandon Sanderson actually did a better job with that than Jordan would have done. Writing a credible battle sequence is really hard to do, let alone for hundreds of pages. He also decided that the story couldn't be compressed into ending after 12, and made it a baker's dozen in order to tell the story properly. It's the best thing that could have happened to the Wheel of Time, because honestly that story was becoming a giant 80 tentacle squid monster.
They have cast the television series already, and I have to admit that I'm a little worried about their compression of the story on film. It will either be brilliant, or a Shanarra/Sword of Truth sized mess.
(I actually liked the Sword of Truth tv series. Horrible Xena-like scripts, but perfect casting.)
__________________
"We don't even know who our best player is yet. It could be any one of us at this point." - Peter LaFleur, player/coach, Average Joe's Gymnasium
I had started The Wheel of Time back in 2000, and stalled out around book 5. Need to get back and read it all. I am enjoying Sanderson's Stormlight Archive.
So one thing that’s really really bothered me. And I believe a video above touched on it a bit but it was way too long for me to watch it all. Bran becoming king is the biggest and laziest travesty in the entire series. Multiple times through the series after becoming the Raven he tells people he is no longer Bran and it’s a name he once knew. He becomes cold and distant to his relatives and then all of a sudden now he’s Bran again? What makes it even worse is:
Spoiler!
In the books the Raven is Brynden Rivers a man of magic and deception who has sought to control the kingdom for centuries. If this maintains true in the TV series as well then likely what has really happened is an ancient man has just swindled an entire country into allowing him to finally gain control in his long quest for control
