Big Brother 21 - Premieres June 25

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by Calgary14

it sounds like Jackson is getting special treatment from producers, but why? I don't see what makes him so special compared to everyone else. Maybe it's because he's the only one willing to push the limits whereas others actually follow the rules. They don't even talk about have nots anymore so it would make sense if something happened.

Rooting for Nicole at this point but I highly doubt she even makes it to final 2. Between Jackson and Holly I guess I would have to pick Jackson because he's played a better game overall compared to Holly. Then again..... Holly could play up the angle she purposely hid behind bigger targets (Jackson) to further her game and that may get her some votes. Guessing Cliff and Jack will not vote for Jackson regardless of who he goes against

Its still a TV show that has to keep viewers interested.

I think without Jackson ratings would have nosedived bad.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Lol Jess and Sis. During the round table.

[mile]

The best player won. I thought Jackson lost after he tried to justify his behavior by calling himself intense. Luckily for him he didn't have to deal with a bitter jury which has been the trend in Big Brother. I wonder if Holly would've cut Jackson if she won HoH.



Julie questioning the non-jury members was so awkward.


I'm glad Nicole won AFP.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Michie might be a jerk but he dominated this season. I’m glad there was no bitter jury (except Jess).

Really would have like to see Nicole’s chances. Glad she got the $25k.

I’m not aware of any racist comments in the house and I thought it was inappropriate to put them on the spot without knowing what it was about. Thankfully Michie answered it well and appeared to be truthful but he looked crushed in the final moments. Really scummy of CBS and Julie to pull that crap. Way to ruin the guys celebration. Well Julie, at least he doesn’t flaunt the fact he married a rapist at every opportunity.

I can’t believe Bella pretended to be heartbroken. She dumped Nick on Instagram and spent the entire summer trashing everyone in the house in a desperate bid to extend her 15 minutes.

[savardandjokinen]

Michie dominated the game. Physically, socially and strategically. Fully deserving of the win. I also don't believe he was particularly racist? Jack definitely was, but I didn't think Michie was, although don't know too much about the live feeds.

Kudos to Nicole for winning AFP. Thought it was going to be Cliff.

[flamesrule14]

Was that the most awkward ending ever? Jackson didn’t even look happy to win. And agreed pretty brutal to have all this stuff coming out without any context for them and us the viewers. I don’t follow the live feeds so all this Jackson stuff was news to me. Anyways best player won. Didn’t always like him, but he was a deserving winner.

[Erick Estrada]

Right player won. There's just not much of a case for Holly being more deserving. Jackson did all the heavy lifting and while they did work as a team with Holly did her part in the 2nd half, Jackson was front and center from the very beginning and navigated difficult waters doing whatever it took to make it to the next week. Glad people like Cliff voted for the best game rather than out of spite as that was kind of ruining the outcomes of the last few seasons as you don't have to like the winner but it should be the best player that gets rewarded with the $500k.

As has been said it kind of ruined the ending to put players on the spot like that with accusations as you could tell Jackson had no recollection of what he was being accused of. I would think producers would know that you don't want your finale to be a bummer.

[Calgary14]

Super awkward finale, I can’t remember any other winner being disappointed to win. The Bella/Nick thing was awkward too. Jack and Jackson seem like they are buddies again

[mrkajz44]

Thought I'd wade in here and see people thoughts on last night because my initial reaction that calling Michie a racist due to his first nominations seemed way out of line. However, twitter was going crazy last night about how he totally deserved it and was a horrible person on the live feeds, and this went beyond the "vocal minority". No one seemed happy for his win and enjoyed how embarrassed he was when he came out.

Seems like my view is the same as most here - the edited version of the show didn't paint him that bad (just a typical "alpha male" type guy in my view), but was he really as horrible on the live feeds as everyone was saying? I feel like this has really tainted the season.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

No. There is absolutely nothing on the feeds to suggest he is racist. At all. A condescending jerk and a bully maybe.

There’s a reason they showed clips of Jack (and could have showed a lot more) when they confronted him when he was evicted and showed nothing of Michie.

Twitter is a wasteland of idiots and BB especially has major issues with mob mentality attacking houseguests. I frequently see outright lies spread like wildfire on reddit with the help of Twitter. Feed summary twitter accounts often have an agenda and that’s to generate controversy. I think a lot of people watch just for the joy of destroying HGs and trying to ruin their lives outside of the house with little concern for context or gameplay. Makes them feel better about their own sad lives.

The two easiest ways to do that are to paint the women as vain airheads who will do anything for fame and the men as misogynist pigs who enjoy bullying minorities. Since there is a certain element of narcissistic houseguests who tend to get on these types of shows, pushing those narratives is usually pretty easy.

We’ve even seen current and former HGs join in on the fun. Derrick, Andy, Bella and others have all taken to twitter to trash the HGs to varying degrees.

[Oling_Roachinen]

The only thing I saw from Jackson that I think could have been or may have been misconstrued as 'actual' racist was the comment about David running a train on all the girls. But I think David was right that it may not have been explicit but implicit bias. Despite teaming up with the most aggressive, arrogant, terrible person in the house with Jack, Jackson continually saw David as this horrible person - even when he was out of the game. Similar to Kemi. Calling them toxic or villains or whatever, we can't know why he had such issues with these minorities, maybe had nothing to do with their race, maybe he is just a bully and his victims happen to be black, or maybe he doesn't even realize it if it was race related, so I think it was unfair to call him out like they did.

A bit of a company you keep too though, Jackson didn't seem to care when Jack is walking around as a gorilla to imitate David or calling him Swaggy, so how much hate should he receive by proxy?

I think with the misogynistic, demeaning attitude towards women it was a lot more clear cut at least. Jackson can tell the jury he never insulted a woman's appearance but there's video of him mocking Jessica's appearance, the way he treated Kat and everything else. He has some growing up to do, and I think if they actually confronted him with this it would have been fair, he could have realized his mistakes and grown but now he's just going to think he's a part of a witch hunt.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Michie might be a jerk but he dominated this season. I’m glad there was no bitter jury (except Jess).

I think bitter jury issue is overblown actually.

Nick hating on Christie because she blew up his game, to save herself, is pure bitterness. He's mad he got outplayed and it was game related.

But people not liking Jackson because he was an ####### to them isn't their fault, it's his. Jury management is part of the game, a major part, and has been since Season 2 and especially exemplified in Season 3 that resulted in the new format.

People voting for Ian over Dan because Dan outplayed them (and because he won before) while Dan was never intentionally disrespectful and did what he did to stay in the game. That's a bitter jury. Paul not getting votes from people he treated like absolute horse####, that's not bitterness, that's common sense. You make my life miserable for no reason except you're an #######? Yeah, I'm not voting to give you $500,000. If you can't see that, you aren't deserving of the vote.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Worth mentioning there’s no shortage of footage of Kemi, David and Ovi doing things in the house to piss off other HGs, or acting rudely, being creepy etc.

When the big alliance picked on Nicole, no one blamed it on racism. They were equal opportunity bullies.

Also, is everyone forgetting this is a competition where painting your fellow houseguests in a negative light is the whole point? Being two faced is what the game encourages. It doesn’t excuse unnecessary bullying but it’d be silly to pretend that the game doesn’t encourage that type of behaviour.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

I think bitter jury issue is overblown actually.

Nick hating on Christie because she blew up his game, to save herself, is pure bitterness. He's mad he got outplayed and it was game related.

But people not liking Jackson because he was an ####### to them isn't their fault, it's his. Jury management is part of the game, a major part, and has been since Season 2 and especially exemplified in Season 3 that resulted in the new format.

People voting for Ian over Dan because Dan outplayed them (and because he won before) while Dan was never intentionally disrespectful and did what he did to stay in the game. That's a bitter jury. Paul not getting votes from people he treated like absolute horse####, that's not bitterness, that's common sense. You make my life miserable for no reason except you're an #######? Yeah, I'm not voting to give you $500,000. If you can't see that, you aren't deserving of the vote.

Right. Jess wasn’t bitter she’s just an idiot. She has explicitly stated multiple times she doesn’t care about gameplay and wanted to vote for a woman to win no matter who was in the final 2.

But who doesn’t like Jackson? He won 7-2. His being a jerk didn’t hurt his jury management and they weren’t bitter. Not sure what you’re getting at.

[Weitz]

Edit: Wrong thread

[#-3]

I thought the whole early evictee segment was a bad look on the show. They basically just sat there gaslighting all of the contestants.

I think Holly made a pretty good case for her game, but wasn't very eloquent with her answers, I can see why it was a split vote. The jury voted fairly.

Sis came of as far far to bitter, she sided against them before they went after her. Thats the game, you have to be careful who you declare war on.

[Machiavelli]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

Worth mentioning there’s no shortage of footage of Kemi, David and Ovi doing things in the house to piss off other HGs, or acting rudely, being creepy etc.

You have any of this footage? Kemi and David literally did nothing. Ovi didn't do anything malicious. There were a few HGs that were uncomfortable with him because he was quite touchy, but they didn't say boo when others did the same to them.

I always find it so interesting see how comments differ between people who actually watch live feeds vs. who only watched the (highly highly edited) shows. I would assume it's mostly the latter here.

Some of the comments made in the house were incredibly vile. The live show was tough because of the lack of context; the show edited Jackson and others to look like saints, and even highly favored Jackson in the house. There was just such a large disconnect. Bringing up the issues at finale wasn't the problem. The problem was the inaccurate edit.

[mrkajz44]

Yeah - honestly I don't really know what to think. I'm still hearing a lot of comments about how horrible Michie was, but CP here is telling me it wasn't that bad. I thought he looked fine on the edited shows, but without seeing the live feeds I guess I'll never really know as I can only receive second hand accounts (some of which are surely biased).

Oh well - maybe next year I'll just stick with the edited shows and revel in my great ignorance