Thoughts on the New Forwards?

[Monahammer]

I wonder if Hanifin could land us Brock Boeser. That would be a nice weapon to add on the RW.

[SuperMatt18]

Simon has shown some flashes but outside of that I don't think the others have looked very good. The problem is with these forwards we have now have too many forwards that I would call "low upside".

Guys that might not really hurt you, but also aren't going to suddenly surprise and give you something more. And now our bottom 6 is made up of too many of these guys now.

Nordstrom: A guy that can PK but so far in two games he's a liability at 5v5.

Leivo: He's just kind of there. Doesn't seem to hurt you at all, but also doesn't really generate anything offensively.

Lucic - he is what he is at this point. I think he's better than the 4 games have shown, and can help defensively but his offensive game is finished. Hopefully these first 4 games are just him getting his legs back.

Ryan - This one is borderline to me but I worry that his age and the lack of a training camp is catching up to him. Doesn't look like the guy that was able to almost carry the 4th line hon his own over his first two seasons here.

And really based on how he's played so far to start the season you can throw Bennett into that group as well. Personally I'd love to see Phillips or Gawdin get a look here to see if they can provide a spark in the bottom 6.

If Dube is back healthy this week I'd like to see.

Tkachuk - Lindholm - Dube
Gaudreau - Monahan - Simon
Bennett - Backlund - Mangiapane
Lucic - Ryan - Phillips
Leivo

Waive Nordstrom and send him to the taxi squad for the time being.

[sa226]

I think the "guys that might not really hurt you. Is exactly what the reasonable doctor ordered. The core forwards, plus Mangiapane, Dube and Bennett will carry the mail. Guys like Simon and Leivo were brought in to play up and down the lineup and not hurt you. They were brought in to be able to move Linholm to centre and Backlund to 3C.

to have 2 legitimate scoring lines where one doesn't also have to be the shutdown line is a huge change for this team. To also have a 3rd line of Backlund with Bennett and Mangiapane is also huge.

Thats hat those guys bring IMO

[1qqaaz]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I wonder if Hanifin could land us Brock Boeser. That would be a nice weapon to add on the RW.

I think Boeser is the least overrated player on the Canucks.
The Flames might have to add. But maybe the Canucks would be desperate for defense.

[shadowlord]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

I think Boeser is the least overrated player on the Canucks.
The Flames might have to add. But maybe the Canucks would be desperate for defense.

Boeser has an injury history. He's played 3 full seasons in the league, and in each of them has missed significant time due to injury. When healthy, he's a sniper, but picking him up would entail taking a risk.

[Poe969]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I wonder if Hanifin could land us Brock Boeser. That would be a nice weapon to add on the RW.

Boeser is one of their best players, there is NO WAY a team would be stupid enough to let one of their best players go...especially to a division rival. I mean how stupid would a team look to see one of their best players now playing against them.....

You mean there's not 2 Markstroms?!?!?!?!

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Simon has shown some flashes but outside of that I don't think the others have looked very good. The problem is with these forwards we have now have too many forwards that I would call "low upside".

Guys that might not really hurt you, but also aren't going to suddenly surprise and give you something more. And now our bottom 6 is made up of too many of these guys now.

Nordstrom: A guy that can PK but so far in two games he's a liability at 5v5.

Leivo: He's just kind of there. Doesn't seem to hurt you at all, but also doesn't really generate anything offensively.

Lucic - he is what he is at this point. I think he's better than the 4 games have shown, and can help defensively but his offensive game is finished. Hopefully these first 4 games are just him getting his legs back.

Ryan - This one is borderline to me but I worry that his age and the lack of a training camp is catching up to him. Doesn't look like the guy that was able to almost carry the 4th line hon his own over his first two seasons here.

And really based on how he's played so far to start the season you can throw Bennett into that group as well. Personally I'd love to see Phillips or Gawdin get a look here to see if they can provide a spark in the bottom 6.

If Dube is back healthy this week I'd like to see.

Tkachuk - Lindholm - Dube
Gaudreau - Monahan - Simon
Bennett - Backlund - Mangiapane
Lucic - Ryan - Phillips
Leivo

Waive Nordstrom and send him to the taxi squad for the time being.

Its early but imo Bennett is getting ice with good players like backlund and Mangiapane and has been bad. If you want to maximize your upside keep the cheap depth and trade Bennett soon. Gains cap space for deadline and eliminates an tough rfa signing this off season. I'd wait until dube comes back and give the 3rd line more time but Bennett is just not getting it done again. Why pay him around 3 mil next deal maybe more for what he brings

Simon and leivo are close enough to Bennett at 700k

Id take a 2nd at this point.

[SnipeShow]

Bennett does bring some energy and some dangerous opportunities and also seems to be on the PK last I remember. He actually shows a little speed and some offensive instinct as well so I would like to see him stick with Backlund for a bit as they both look like they're shaking off the rust a still offensively but still look dangerous at times. I wouldn't get rid of Bennett, he may be who we need to expose in expansion anyway so might as well have him serve that purpose and then maybe they won't take Tanev or Gio instead. I'm sure some might say get a pick while you can but then you still need expansion eligible forwards signed and available come the draft.

Sent from my GM1917 using Tapatalk

[GreenLantern2814]

They’re fine.

No term, minimal dollars.

Exactly what they should be.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

Its early but imo Bennett is getting ice with good players like backlund and Mangiapane and has been bad. If you want to maximize your upside keep the cheap depth and trade Bennett soon. Gains cap space for deadline and eliminates an tough rfa signing this off season. I'd wait until dube comes back and give the 3rd line more time but Bennett is just not getting it done again. Why pay him around 3 mil next deal maybe more for what he brings

Simon and leivo are close enough to Bennett at 700k

Id take a 2nd at this point.

He's been okay with Backlund and really his struggles have come away from Backlund this year when playing with some combo of Lucic/Ryan/Nordstrom

In his 33 minutes with Backlund he's 57% Corsi For, 56.5% Scoring Chances For, and 30% High Danger For (The high Danger is weird and likely was from one flurry in front of the net or something)

Away from Backlund though it's been bad:

In 12 minutes on that "4th line" he's 24% Corsi, 28% scoring chances, and 33% high danger.

- but everyone who has played with Lucic/Nordstrom/Ryan has had those issues this year.

When the lineup is healthy I think Bennett-Backlund and whoever of Dube/Mangiapane isn't on the Lindholm line will be able to make up an effective third line.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

He's been okay with Backlund and really his struggles have come away from Backlund this year when playing with some combo of Lucic/Ryan/Nordstrom

In his 33 minutes with Backlund he's 57% Corsi For, 56.5% Scoring Chances For, and 30% High Danger For (The high Danger is weird and likely was from one flurry in front of the net or something)

Away from Backlund though it's been bad:

In 12 minutes on that "4th line" he's 24% Corsi, 28% scoring chances, and 33% high danger.

- but everyone who has played with Lucic/Nordstrom/Ryan has had those issues this year.

When the lineup is healthy I think Bennett-Backlund and whoever of Dube/Mangiapane isn't on the Lindholm line will be able to make up an effective third line.

I agree and I did mention id give the 3rd line more time to see how it goes. But I do wonder if this is more a backlund thing than a Bennett thing. Backlund always elevates his linemates posession numbers. I wouldn't be surprised if Bennett was out that backlund Mangiapane and someone like leivo could play just as well.

Of the bottom forwards not including backlund and Mangiapane as I look at them as in our top group. Bennett Ryan and lucic are by far the highest paid but Bennett is the only 1 that has trade value. Imo if you want to improve the top 6 removing him from the bottom 6 and using the cap space later could be creating more upside than cutting Nordstrom to bring up a guy like Phillips.

Trading Bennett also could give Phillips a chance with backlund if he plays well. Keeping Bennett has him playing with the same guys that are playing 75 percent of their shifts in their own end. Might not be what you want for Phillips

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I wonder if Hanifin could land us Brock Boeser. That would be a nice weapon to add on the RW.

If the disaster train keeps rolling over there, who knows. That might be in the realm of possibility.

But that's also like trading a leg for an arm.

[Inglewood Jack]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

If the disaster train keeps rolling over there, who knows. That might be in the realm of possibility.

But that's also like trading a leg for an arm.

[Geeoff]

Simon seems like the only for sure NHLer of the group but obviously sample size is low.


Will be interesting when the AHL gets going. Maybe someone from the farm can steal a spot

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

He's been okay with Backlund and really his struggles have come away from Backlund this year when playing with some combo of Lucic/Ryan/Nordstrom

In his 33 minutes with Backlund he's 57% Corsi For, 56.5% Scoring Chances For, and 30% High Danger For (The high Danger is weird and likely was from one flurry in front of the net or something)

Away from Backlund though it's been bad:

In 12 minutes on that "4th line" he's 24% Corsi, 28% scoring chances, and 33% high danger.

- but everyone who has played with Lucic/Nordstrom/Ryan has had those issues this year.

When the lineup is healthy I think Bennett-Backlund and whoever of Dube/Mangiapane isn't on the Lindholm line will be able to make up an effective third line.

Yeah, I don't think those numbers with Backlund are a result of Bennett's contribution. Let's be honest here. Four games and three shots on goal with three other misses. Six hits for the season. One blocked shot. Three giveaways and two takeaways. Not great numbers. Outside of a third period, Bennett has been invisible for the most part, except when taking penalties.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Simon - unnoticeable for the most part, which is fine.



Leivo - has had some nice plays, and some terrible plays.


Nordstrom hasn't been very good, but he is fast and is good on the PK.


I think the Flames should just remain a bit patient with everyone. New teams and without the benefit of a camp is a reasonable excuse as to why none of them have looked 'good' (or in some cases, passable). Over the next 5 or 6 games, hopefully they will start fitting in better and doing more to help Calgary put up some wins.



I am also not terribly against slotting in Brett Ritchie, and I am actually neutral on bringing in Robinson. If the 4th line is being outshot and out-chanced, mixing and matching other players probably wouldn't be worse, ad they would at least be a bit more difficult to play against than Nordstrom.


Lucic has been mostly bad, but on the other hand, a legitimate argument can be made that Lucic has earned a longer rope, and I don't think that he will continue playing this poorly the rest of the season.


I, for one, am just happy that on most nights, the top 9 and all 6 defencemen have looked mostly good and have all helped Calgary thus far. There are a plethora of forwards that the Flames can substitute on the 4th line and continue mixing and matching until the 4th line not only stops hurting the Flames, but starts contributing. Not just Ritchie and Robinson, but guys like Gawdin, Pelletier, Zary, Phillips, etc., who might give that line a different look and perhaps pair well with Ryan.


For now, I don't have an issue in giving all the news guys some rope - including Nordstrom - and giving Lucic the benefit of the doubt in returning to form. That line makes sense on paper, and Nordstrom's PK ability will help alleviate some PK minutes off of Lindholm and Backlund. If he continues playing poorly and hurting the team, then there are a lot of other options to work through until that line starts treading some water at least.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

If the disaster train keeps rolling over there, who knows. That might be in the realm of possibility.

But that's also like trading a leg for an arm.

I don't disagree, but LD is organizationally one of the deepest positions we have, both taxi and prospect wise, and seems to be the easier of the d positions to acquire on the market, whether trade or free agency.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I don't disagree, but LD is organizationally one of the deepest positions we have, both taxi and prospect wise, and seems to be the easier of the d positions to acquire on the market, whether trade or free agency.

Gio
Hanifin
Valimaki
Nesterov
Mackey
Kylington

Lerby
Poolman

Kuznetzov
Poirier

Hard to argue.

I guess the hope would be that Valimaki and Mackey develop into top 4 dmen.

I think it’s pretty safe to assume Valimaki will..

Valimaki-Andersson
Mackey-Tanev
Gio-Nesterov
Kylington

Lerby-Kinnvall
Poolman-Yelesin

It helps that both Mackey and Lerby, by all accounts, looked solid in camp. Nesterov coming out of nowhere is a boost and it’s likely we can retain him.

Trading a LD for a RW seems like a logical choice if the expansion draft wasn’t looming.

[genetic_phreek]

Simon - I think he's as advertised. Good puck retrieval, good forechecking, good to play with 13 and 23. Johnny and Mony don't like to go to the puck, they like the puck coming to them and Simon gets after it.

Leivo/Nordstrom - Personally they don't make a lot of money so I don't expect much from either. With that being said, for the money I'd rather have a couple guys in our system play. The likes of Gawdin, Robinson, Phillips, Ruzicka.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by SeanCharles

Gio
Hanifin
Valimaki
Nesterov
Mackey
Kylington

Lerby
Poolman

Kuznetzov
Poirier

Hard to argue.

I guess the hope would be that Valimaki and Mackey develop into top 4 dmen.

I think it’s pretty safe to assume Valimaki will..

Valimaki-Andersson
Mackey-Tanev
Gio-Nesterov
Kylington

Lerby-Kinnvall
Poolman-Yelesin

It helps that both Mackey and Lerby, by all accounts, looked solid in camp. Nesterov coming out of nowhere is a boost and it’s likely we can retain him.

Trading a LD for a RW seems like a logical choice if the expansion draft wasn’t looming.

I also find so far that ward hasnt been afraid to put vslimski and nesterov out against top players. They seemed to be on the ice against Tavares line alot the other night. They both are on the pk 2nd unit. Rasmus getting a ton of pp time but right now hanifin is getting very little pp or pk time. Valimaki and nesterov are being trusted in key situations every bit as much as hanifin.

Hanifin does lead the team in plus minus but seeing how Vancouver d is playing this year this could be a chris tanev thing

Flame very easily could trade hanifin and not miss him that much