[Trade] Vegas trades Schmidt to Vancouver for a 2022 3rd

[Galakanokis]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I'll just clarify that I never said it wasn't a good move for Vancouver, only that I don't see the comparison between Tanev and Schmidt as favorable, nor do i think the flames made the wrong "choice" (if this could even qualify as a choice, which I also disagree with.)

I wasn't calling you out just a general statement. This is a good deal for the canucks.

Obviously a lot of moving parts on the Tanev deal and the Vegas-Vancouver deal. I doubt that a deal with Vegas was ever on the table for the Flames but even if it was it definitely seemed liked the Flames got their guy in Tanev, they didn't wait around to see what happened with Vegas and their cap.

I like Tanev and I actually think he fits better on this roster than Schmidt does. We needed a defensive dman that will play the dirty minutes including the PK and that is not Schmidt.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

3 out and 1 in. Even though you upgraded Tanev, you lost elsewhere. So the comparison is the positive difference between Schmidt and Tanev, less the other losses.

Vancouver is still down in my opinion. And they definitely didn't go from defensive punching bag to possession powerhouse.

2 in, they 'replaced' Markstrom as well with Holtby

[Infinit47]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

2 in, they 'replaced' Markstrom as well with Holtby

I guess we should include Toffoli as well. So 4 out, 2 in. Loading 2 top 4 D, one top 6 forward and your MVP goalie is pretty significant.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

I guess we should include Toffoli as well. So 4 out, 2 in. Loading 2 top 4 D, one top 6 forward and your MVP goalie is pretty significant.

True, mind you in Benning's slight defense this whole thing is due to Covid and so utterly unforseeable really, not that I would argue his free agent mess pre covid was a good thing but in a normal year he would have had way more of a cap to play with

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

True, mind you in Benning's slight defense this whole thing is due to Covid and so utterly unforseeable really, not that I would argue his free agent mess pre covid was a good thing but in a normal year he would have had way more of a cap to play with

but then so would Vegas and maybe then they don't gift him a save his ass trade

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

I guess we should include Toffoli as well. So 4 out, 2 in. Loading 2 top 4 D, one top 6 forward and your MVP goalie is pretty significant.

Sorry, two top four D? Are you trying to make a case for Troy Stecher being top 4? Oh sweet summer child.....

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

but then so would Vegas and maybe then they don't gift him a save his ass trade

And you guys don't get your goalie or Tanev.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Sorry, two top four D? Are you trying to make a case for Troy Stecher being top 4? Oh sweet summer child.....




And you guys don't get your goalie or Tanev.

Of course we do - they were dying to get out of that cesspool and come to Calgary. What - you think it was just about money?

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Sorry, two top four D? Are you trying to make a case for Troy Stecher being top 4? Oh sweet summer child.....

I'd rather play Stecher in the top 4 than Tyler Myers...

Anyway, I don't really think the Canucks are a playoff team next year regardless. They certainly weren't going to be a cup contender, no matter what they did. So maybe they're better off taking a step back and giving some of their younger players a shot, and try to be better the year after or the year after that. It's not even clear if there's going to be an AHL season, so they can't count on anyone developing there.

[Infinit47]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Sorry, two top four D? Are you trying to make a case for Troy Stecher being top 4? Oh sweet summer child.....




And you guys don't get your goalie or Tanev.

Yup, that was a mistake. You lost a top 4 dman, your #5 dman, a top 6 forward and your MVP goalie. You replaced them with a goalie who was terrible in the last year and a top 2/3 dman who's only ever played on very strong teams and was caught using PED's.

Can't see how that is anything other than a loss. Of course the three playoff game heater is the real Demko, not the 27 regular season games of .905 hockey. Its fine, everything is fine.

Am I doing this right?

But, as you said, Benning is not done. Luckily he has cap space and a plethora of value contracts (Beagle, Rousell, Sutter, Baertapopolous or whatever) that he can move out.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

Can't see how that is anything other than a loss. Of course the three playoff game heater is the real Demko, not the 27 regular season games of .905 hockey. Its fine, everything is fine.

Great, you can't see it anything as a loss. Thank Christ we don't base decisions off of what you can or cannot see or we'd have locked down a 30+ year old recently injury prone goalie to a contact that is probably too long at a value that will probably end up too much vs the 25 year old goalie we've been building too since he was drafted. This decision is based on how good he has been at every step of development with the expectation that he will be a full-fledged top level NHL goalie within the next two years. About the only people who expect this development to suddenly stall are people who post here. His issues are the exact same as Markstrom's were at an older age, but the assumption here is that Markstrom could figure it out at 28 and Demko won't be able to at 25. I know you're used to your young goalies flaming out, but Vancouver has always fared better on that front, going back to Schneider.

And don't take this as me not thinking Markstrom is a phenomenal goalie, but for team needs and team growth, it was time to move on. He's a much better fit for the Flames at this time than he is for the Canucks.

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

I'd rather play Stecher in the top 4 than Tyler Myers...

For what it's worth, Hughes' numbers were much better when paired with Myers vs when paired with Tanev. By a lot.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Great, you can't see it anything as a loss. Thank Christ we don't base decisions off of what you can or cannot see or we'd have locked down a 30+ year old recently injury prone goalie to a contact that is probably too long at a value that will probably end up too much vs the 25 year old goalie we've been building too since he was drafted. This decision is based on how good he has been at every step of development with the expectation that he will be a full-fledged top level NHL goalie within the next two years. About the only people who expect this development to suddenly stall are people who post here. His issues are the exact same as Markstrom's were at an older age, but the assumption here is that Markstrom could figure it out at 28 and Demko won't be able to at 25. I know you're used to your young goalies flaming out, but Vancouver has always fared better on that front, going back to Schneider.

And don't take this as me not thinking Markstrom is a phenomenal goalie, but for team needs and team growth, it was time to move on. He's a much better fit for the Flames at this time than he is for the Canucks.








For what it's worth, Hughes' numbers were much better when paired with Myers vs when paired with Tanev. By a lot.

Tanev was put in much tougher situations...defensive stars, tougher matchups, so those are certainly grain of salt numbers.

I doubt Myers and Hughes were tapped on the shoulder for a late defensive faceoff against the other teams top line with a one goal lead. Tanev played the "hardest" minutes on the D so its more likely that if you are out there with him its a tougher matchup/situation.

[AC]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

For what it's worth, Hughes' numbers were much better when paired with Myers vs when paired with Tanev. By a lot.

Interestingly in the 3 series against Minnesota, St Louis, and Vegas the D combinations involving Hughes were overall:

Hughes/Tanev +4
Hughes/Stetcher even
Hughes/Myers -2
Hughes/Edler -2

And Tanev's combinations:
Tanev/Hughes +4
Tanev/Fantenberg even
Tanev/Edler -2

[d_phaneuf]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

Yup, that was a mistake. You lost a top 4 dman, your #5 dman, a top 6 forward and your MVP goalie. You replaced them with a goalie who was terrible in the last year and a top 2/3 dman who's only ever played on very strong teams and was caught using PED's.

Can't see how that is anything other than a loss. Of course the three playoff game heater is the real Demko, not the 27 regular season games of .905 hockey. Its fine, everything is fine.

Am I doing this right?

But, as you said, Benning is not done. Luckily he has cap space and a plethora of value contracts (Beagle, Rousell, Sutter, Baertapopolous or whatever) that he can move out.

A 2/3 d man who was Vegas' clear number 1

https://twitter.com/user/status/1316021564379295745

[d_phaneuf]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

Yup, that was a mistake. You lost a top 4 dman, your #5 dman, a top 6 forward and your MVP goalie. You replaced them with a goalie who was terrible in the last year and a top 2/3 dman who's only ever played on very strong teams and was caught using PED's.

Can't see how that is anything other than a loss. Of course the three playoff game heater is the real Demko, not the 27 regular season games of .905 hockey. Its fine, everything is fine.

Am I doing this right?

But, as you said, Benning is not done. Luckily he has cap space and a plethora of value contracts (Beagle, Rousell, Sutter, Baertapopolous or whatever) that he can move out.

Lost a 4, gained a 2, the fancy stats athletic guy has him projected as a top pair guy for 3 more years, top 4 the 3 after that, and as I posted above, vegas beat writers say he was their 1 in terms of deployment

Lost a 5 d man.... off season isnt over, and again, theres been talk of rafferty replacing stetcher since early last season

Markstrom is a loss for sure, if they wanted to sign him, they could have, he wanted to stay, all it would have taken is the NMC. So they chose Demko and Holtby instead, with input from Clarke.

Also again, its 10 weeks from the season starting

There's another buyout window, there can be trades

[Barca]

TIL Stecher is a top 4 defenceman and better than Myers, Schmidt is a #3 defenceman and overpaid.

you learn a lot on CP

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by d_phaneuf

Lost a 4, gained a 2, the fancy stats athletic guy has him projected as a top pair guy for 3 more years, top 4 the 3 after that, and as I posted above, vegas beat writers say he was their 1 in terms of deployment

Lost a 5 d man.... off season isnt over, and again, theres been talk of rafferty replacing stetcher since early last season

Markstrom is a loss for sure, if they wanted to sign him, they could have, he wanted to stay, all it would have taken is the NMC. So they chose Demko and Holtby instead, with input from Clarke.

Also again, its 10 weeks from the season starting

There's another buyout window, there can be trades

Lost a PPG forward...team already wasn't good enough and its a massive stretch to say they have improved

3 big losses
1 big add

Math

Did you Canuck fans expect to come here and have us tell you guy how great the team is because they made one decent move after a disaster of a UFA period? Can't believe I have to wait 3 or 4 months to see Holtby get absolutely lit up

"He has been terrible for three years but playing behind the Canucks will fix him"

[Blaster86]

Elliotte Freidman says the the deal between Vegas and Vancouver was done Saturday night.

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by d_phaneuf

A 2/3 d man who was Vegas' clear number 1

https://twitter.com/user/status/1316021564379295745

Well when TSN Radio Vegas puts that out instead of TSN Vancouver maybe we can start believing.

In the meantime dilute the koolaid.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Well when TSN Radio Vegas puts that out instead of TSN Vancouver maybe we can start believing.

In the meantime dilute the koolaid.

You realize the guy who talked about it was one of the every day beat writers for the Knights, right?

Are you guys just being obtuse to try and get that schadenfreude feeling?

[Flamenspiel]

Well, the big issue is wether or not Big Nate can kick the PED habit and who will be his new supplier in Vancouver....