In europe you see mini's and ford focus's towing single axle caravans, I was overtaken by a BMW Z3 towing a trailer loaded with a full set of living room furniture last time I was back there.
Yous' guys worry to much.
Don't they call it "caravaning" in europe?
vehicles are rated lower than their actual tow specs but they have laws and ratings for a reason i guess.
You're overweight, therefore out of spec, therefore unsafe. You WILL get a ticket (possibly even impounded, although unlikely!). All it takes is a cop to say "Hmmmm, I'm not sure that looks right" and you're in trouble. We watched two people get (deservedly and royally) f'd last year in Northern BC....it DOES happen.
By towing overweight you:
a) Give the police a reason to hassle/fine you.
b) Increase your accident risk.
c) Present insurance with a solid reason to decline a claim.
Get the Pathfinder first. There are ALWAYS good trailers at good prices, I promise!
To get a ticket, you would have to be over the registered vehicle weight, not the manufacturer's rating. (Is there a difference for non-commercial cars?)
There are very valid reasons for vehicles tow ratings based on the engineering of the vehicle itself. Exceeding that is unwise, and quite possible dangerous. Exceeding it on dry trailer weight alone is foolhardy and most definitely dangerous.
Yeah well guess what, a heavier trailer will almost certainly have a heavier tongue weight. A weight distribution hitch - without any doubt - will help. I didn't say it will make this a good idea, I just said it will help. Particularly when towing with a minivan as they have crappy shocks in the back and are front wheel drive. The distribution hitch will lift up the back end and even out the weight in the vehicle, putting more weight on the front wheels which is very important when towing with a FWD vehicle.
MacDaddy - trust me on this. Don't listen to old-fart. If you get this trailer and tow it with your minivan, get a weight distribution hitch.
Thanks for all the advice, Im leaning on buying the trailer. It's a really good deal. I'm planning on replacing the Van the day it stops working (cost more than $1000 to fix) and am ready to go with a V8 Pathfinder.
I will only be using the trailer for a couple of weekend trips next summer as we have a big trip to PEI planned so 1 weekend to Montana, 1 weekend to Mount Kidd and 1 weekend to Drumheller (all campgrounds have power, water and onsite dumping) so I think I could push the limits a bit for the next year (hopefully)
anyone hear any horror stories about Pathfinders I should hear about?
Truck is not an option as were replacing the Van with another family vehicle my wife will want to drive.
This is such a bad idea I don't know where to begin. You are going to be way over your both your GCVWR (gross combined vehicle weight rating) as well as your published towing capacity (which in Alberta should be taken at around 80%, given our altitude). I'd be surprised if your transmission lasts to Drumheller, and you would be a accident looking for a place to happen.
AFC, European trailers (caravans) are engineered totally different; they'll only have a hitch weight of a couple of hundred pounds at most, and they generally do not have water / waste tanks either.
MacDaddy - trust me on this. Don't listen to old-fart. If you get this trailer and tow it with your minivan, get a weight distribution hitch.
This.
I can't comment on whether you'd be ok towing the trailer (it sounds like you'd be a significantly over the rating, so probably not recommended), but you would be an order of magnitude safer using a weight distribution hitch, over not using one. Whether it makes you completely safe, that's debatable, but there is nothing remotely safe about pulling a trailer and not being able to steer.
I can understand buying it (assuming it's close by) and trailering it home slowly, to park it until you own a truck/van that's rated to carry it (see the 80% rule mentioned many times in this thread)....
But to state that you're going to tow it on vacation is irresponsible and reckless. I hope that when you crash and kill your family, that hopefully you don't take out another innocent family thanks to your irresponsible behaviour.
There is no way a 3,900 lb "dry" trailer wouldn't use a WD hitch on anything other than a 1 ton truck. Tongue weight is probably around 600+ lbs. You need a class 4 (2") receiver to do a WD hitch (without WD, a class 4 is only good to 500lbs), and I don't think a unibody van like the Montana can even support a WD setup - I'm pretty sure you need a frame for that.
I think the OP is better off looking for a good sized tent trailer with his current setup.
There is no way a 3,900 lb "dry" trailer wouldn't use a WD hitch on anything other than a 1 ton truck. Tongue weight is probably around 600+ lbs. You need a class 4 (2") receiver to do a WD hitch (without WD, a class 4 is only good to 500lbs), and I don't think a unibody van like the Montana can even support a WD setup - I'm pretty sure you need a frame for that.
I think the OP is better off looking for a good sized tent trailer with his current setup.
Why do you think your vehicle needs to have a frame for a WD hitch? I've never heard of that and I've been towing my tent trailer with my minivan and a WD hitch for four years.
A WD hitch distributes the weight to all trailer and towing vehicle axles, increases braking and steering capability, and reduces sway from crosswinds.
Why you and old-fart keep telling us it doesn't make a bad situation better is baffling.
Why do you think your vehicle needs to have a frame for a WD hitch? I've never heard of that and I've been towing my tent trailer with my minivan and a WD hitch for four years.
A WD hitch distributes the weight to all trailer and towing vehicle axles, increases braking and steering capability, and reduces sway from crosswinds.
Why you and old-fart keep telling us it doesn't make a bad situation better is baffling.
I understand completely what a weight distribution hitch does, and does not do. It would make a bad situation better, it would not make THIS bad situation acceptable from a safety perspective.
Let me clarify....
Don't do this MacDaddy - it is a bad idea. A weight distribution hitch will redistribute the tounge weight absolutely which when towing a trailer that is more than 50% of your own vehicle weight is crucile. It will level out the entire configuration, reduce sway and make braking and steering safer.
IT WILL NOT, HOWEVER, INCREASE THE TOWING CAPCITY OF YOUR VEHICLE.
In this case, the towing capacity of MacDaddy's vehicle is 3,500lbs. The trailer in question has a dry weight of 3,900lbs. Add in people, camping stuff, food, booze, whatever and he is probably looking at another 1,000lbs or so, let's be generous and just say 600lbs bringing his total towing requirement up to 4,500lbs. A weight distribution hitch will absolutely not magically make his mini-van which is rated to tow 3,500 lbs suddenly a capable, safe vehicle to tow 4,500lbs. It can't happen. A weight distrubition hitch DOES NOT improve the frame, the transmission, the engine, the brakes, etc. It redistributes the tongue weight. That's it.
In my original post I said a weight distrubition hitch won't help this situation - the situation is that MacDaddy is asking about towing something that has a dry weight over 10% higher than the maximum towing capacity of his vehicle. I stand by that statement as it won't... it can't magically make the towing capacity of his vehicle any higher.
If you have a towing capacity of 3500lbs, you should not be looking at pulling more than probably in the area of 3000lbs total maybe 3200lbs if you want to push it, meaning dry weight of probably in the 2200 to 2400lbs depending on how much you plan on packing. And then, yes, you should seriously consider a weight distribution hitch depending on the tounge weight of the trailer in question.
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Why do you think your vehicle needs to have a frame for a WD hitch? I've never heard of that and I've been towing my tent trailer with my minivan and a WD hitch for four years.
A WD hitch distributes the weight to all trailer and towing vehicle axles, increases braking and steering capability, and reduces sway from crosswinds.
Why you and old-fart keep telling us it doesn't make a bad situation better is baffling.
I stand corrected on using a WD hitch on a unibody vehicle then. I was under the impression that you needed a full frame for that.
Old-Fart is bang on with the rest in the above post though. We tow a 3,300 lb "dry" Airstream, and it's 4,200 lb when loaded. On a 1/2 ton truck chassis with a 5.7L V8 and 8,500 lb rated capacity, it is a comfortable tow but you definitely know it's there, especially up a long hill. I'd hate to try with a minivan...
I understand completely what a weight distribution hitch does, and does not do. It would make a bad situation better, it would not make THIS bad situation acceptable from a safety perspective.
Let me clarify....
Don't do this MacDaddy - it is a bad idea. A weight distribution hitch will redistribute the tounge weight absolutely which when towing a trailer that is more than 50% of your own vehicle weight is crucile. It will level out the entire configuration, reduce sway and make braking and steering safer.
IT WILL NOT, HOWEVER, INCREASE THE TOWING CAPCITY OF YOUR VEHICLE.
In this case, the towing capacity of MacDaddy's vehicle is 3,500lbs. The trailer in question has a dry weight of 3,900lbs. Add in people, camping stuff, food, booze, whatever and he is probably looking at another 1,000lbs or so, let's be generous and just say 600lbs bringing his total towing requirement up to 4,500lbs. A weight distribution hitch will absolutely not magically make his mini-van which is rated to tow 3,500 lbs suddenly a capable, safe vehicle to tow 4,500lbs. It can't happen. A weight distrubition hitch DOES NOT improve the frame, the transmission, the engine, the brakes, etc. It redistributes the tongue weight. That's it.
In my original post I said a weight distrubition hitch won't help this situation - the situation is that MacDaddy is asking about towing something that has a dry weight over 10% higher than the maximum towing capacity of his vehicle. I stand by that statement as it won't... it can't magically make the towing capacity of his vehicle any higher.
If you have a towing capacity of 3500lbs, you should not be looking at pulling more than probably in the area of 3000lbs total maybe 3200lbs if you want to push it, meaning dry weight of probably in the 2200 to 2400lbs depending on how much you plan on packing. And then, yes, you should seriously consider a weight distribution hitch depending on the tounge weight of the trailer in question.
Guy. Nobody is saying it will increase the towing capacity capacity of his vehicle. That would be ######ed. I'm saying it will make what he is already planning on doing (towing with this vehicle) a lot safer. It will.
Location: Close enough to make a beer run during a TV timeout
Exp:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sliver
I'm saying it will make what he is already planning on doing (towing with this vehicle) a lot safer. It will.
I think what the issue people have with your comment is the "a lot safer" part. I would be more inclined to call it "slightly less dangerous."
While both say similar things in a "glass half full/empty" kind of way; I don't think the word "safer" is a good one to use as it gives a bit of a false sense of security.
Has anyone brought up braking? The weight of this trailer might significantly lower your braking times and on steep hills (Mt. Kidd, Drumheller) you could find your trailer or your vehicle getting a little squirrely. I wouldn't do it man.
I think what the issue people have with your comment is the "a lot safer" part. I would be more inclined to call it "slightly less dangerous."
While both say similar things in a "glass half full/empty" kind of way; I don't think the word "safer" is a good one to use as it gives a bit of a false sense of security.
Maybe.
But he seems to be fixated on a WD hitch not increasing the towing capacity and nobody has said that it would.
I get what you're saying though Ken and maybe you're right, although what MacDaddy is proposing wouldn't scare me so I don't think it's particularly dangerous.
Anyway, I guess we can agree to disagree old-fart.
I currently have a 2002 Pontiac Montana 3.6 litre V6 mini Van with a tow package capable of towing a 3500lbs trailer.
I am looking a a travel trailer with a "dry weight" of 3900 lbs.
Is there anyway I can possibly pull this trailer with my van? I'm going to be replacing the Van in the next year or so but this deal on the TT is really good.
Can I use a weight displacement hitch to counter some of the weight on the hitch.
Also my family weighs a combined 400lbs (high est) and the GRVW of the Van is 5357lbs, how does this come into play on the amount of weight I can pull and amount of stuff I have loaded.
I'm eventually upgrading to a V8 Pathfinder with a tow rating of around 6000lbs so that would be enough i think.
Thanks in advance for your help
No chance, I have a similiar vehicale and I pull a tent trailer. To pull anything heavier you will cause problems with your transimisison.
I know folks who have pulled to much weight and totally burnt their transmission.
Like yourself, I am looking at selling my Van to get something better.
Has anyone brought up braking? The weight of this trailer might significantly lower your braking times and on steep hills (Mt. Kidd, Drumheller) you could find your trailer or your vehicle getting a little squirrely. I wouldn't do it man.
He said he has a towing package on his van so he should have a brake control unit which would activate the trailer brakes. A WD hitch will also help make braking a lot less dangerous (<--- updated wording for you, Ken ).
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He said he has a towing package on his van so he should have a brake control unit which would activate the trailer brakes. A WD hitch will also help make braking a lot less dangerous (<--- updated wording for you, Ken ).
I am not sure Braking is the issue, but the engine will over heat and the transmission will have serious issues if you pull that much weight with a mini van.
I believe the Pontiac Montana is spec'd for 2200 pounds or something like that (i.e. no more than a tent trailer).
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