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Old 11-15-2019, 10:00 AM   #41
Royle9
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Is this Kanetix thing legit?

Just ran my information through it and they've got a deal that's over $1000 cheaper than I'm paying now? This feels like a to good to be true scenario... but I'd be ecstatic if legit!
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Old 11-15-2019, 10:19 AM   #42
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Is this Kanetix thing legit?

Just ran my information through it and they've got a deal that's over $1000 cheaper than I'm paying now? This feels like a to good to be true scenario... but I'd be ecstatic if legit!
That sounds a lot like they're a registered insurer which will meet your legal requirements to have insurance, but if you ever actually need the insurance you're paying for you're going to have a bad time.
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Old 11-15-2019, 10:19 AM   #43
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How does this rate increase factor in against the discounts for having the optional tracking thing for a rate discount that many insurance companies were looking into a few years ago? I don't think most insurance companies have rolled out the tracking thing yet.
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Old 11-15-2019, 10:21 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by Locke View Post
That sounds a lot like they're a registered insurer which will meet your legal requirements to have insurance, but if you ever actually need the insurance you're paying for you're going to have a bad time.
Yea my thoughts exactly, right now I'm with Aviva however and they're the ones blasting the 15% increase... I need to look elsewhere.
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Old 11-15-2019, 10:40 AM   #45
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Yea my thoughts exactly, right now I'm with Aviva however and they're the ones blasting the 15% increase... I need to look elsewhere.
You should be shopping every year at renewal time. Every year.
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Old 11-15-2019, 10:52 AM   #46
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A little to add as I recently was developing some training programs for the insurance industry.
There are a lot of things that will dictate your rate. Mileage as some have asked does make a difference and they are supposed to ask. The more miles you drive the higher a risk you are according to stats. Occasional driver and even your occupation has a bearing on your rates on most companies.

Some occupations get better rates as they are considered more careful drivers and their stats show that.

Having kids in your house will also affect premiums for most as well and having teenagers driving or not should be identified. Their fear is a teenager may take your vehicle for a spin even though not licensed.

Only a few companies use the Telematics device which is a software that monitors your driving. Tracks speeds, how you brake, times of day you drive etc. The ones that have it give 10 - 15% discounts is what most get but really great drivers and not many at that level can get as much as 25%.
Distracted driving is now the biggest cause of most accidents and that is controllable and hurting the industry badly.

Tickets hurt your rates of course as well as accidents. Companies have different time periods that keep your accident free years on their books. Some are 6 or 7 years and mine for example is using the industry15 year rating to fully wipe out accident free years.

Probably a bunch of other things I dealt with as well but those are a few I recall specifically creating materials for.
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Old 11-15-2019, 11:12 AM   #47
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Maybe you meant how many miles the vehicle has on it. That they dont ask! How many miles you drive a year they ask always.
Yes, vehicle mileage. You may be asked how much per year you drive your car and some insurers may charge a lower price if you drive less per year but a claim being declined because you exceeded your stated annual mileage aint gonna happen. This isn't a lease.
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Old 11-15-2019, 11:51 AM   #48
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I wonder what insurance fraud costs us.
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Old 11-15-2019, 11:53 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by Royle9 View Post
Is this Kanetix thing legit?

Just ran my information through it and they've got a deal that's over $1000 cheaper than I'm paying now? This feels like a to good to be true scenario... but I'd be ecstatic if legit!
Itís legit.
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Old 11-15-2019, 11:59 AM   #50
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Yeah, I wonder what insurance fraud costs us.
Across the country it's at around 1 Billion. Shockingly high.
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Old 11-15-2019, 12:02 PM   #51
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Across the country it's at around 1 Billion. Shockingly high.
Iím wondering what that means on our premiums, maybe 10% or more or less?
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Old 11-15-2019, 12:14 PM   #52
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That's a good question, I don't really know but would wager it's quite a bit. Fraudulent claims cost everyone a lot of money. Premiums for auto insurance in particular would drop a drop a lot if they could even put a good dent in fraudulent claims.

One piece of advice I would give to everyone that would listen to help combat this is a dash cam. I'm genuinely surprised this isn't being built into vehicles these days. With all the bells and whistles they can add, why not a dash cam? Put it right into the rear view mirror.

Regardless, they are relatively cheap and more a less easily installed. Can absolutely save your bacon in the event of a claim. If it comes down to a he said, she said, dash cam footage is king.
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Old 11-15-2019, 12:27 PM   #53
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I wonder what insurance fraud costs us.
I know one company for sure who went from an SIU dept of 3 across the country to 25 this year, apparently in Ontario especially they are the new Russia for fraudulent injury claims i'm talking about pack up the family and fill the car and have someone hit them on purpose, Alberta is big for theft fraud and injuries.

Injuries are weird in Alberta at least in that you can get assessed by the person treating you like chiro/physio, so why would they turn away 10-21 Insurance paid treatments plus accessories up to $160. Then after that on the other side the settlement for injuries. In some cases lawyers work very closely with clinics and you can imagine how that works out.

So yeah its funny how the common sentiment is that Insurance is evil and are against the people when in reality yeah they make money they are a business but its people screwing themselves adding to this. It would be interesting to see someone job shadow or even hear some of the claims.

People complain about rates and I'm sure some are pretty high but lets factor what you get for that. Lets say you pay $2500/year as an example one accident for a single person could cost on average 50k-100k after vehicle damages or payout, adjusters time, appraisers time, rentals, non fault medical treatments for all parties, injury settlements for all not at fault parties including wage loss, future costs, lawyer fees.

The days of paying for each others damages are over, consider insurance for what it should be "Peace of Mind"
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Old 11-15-2019, 12:35 PM   #54
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So yeah its funny how the common sentiment is that Insurance is evil and are against the people when in reality yeah they make money they are a business but its people screwing themselves adding to this. It would be interesting to see someone job shadow or even hear some of the claims.
This.....1000x this. This is why I chuckle when people say insurance companies are shady or dishonest when the reality is quite the opposite.

Insurers aren't perfect but parts of their client base are far from it too.
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Old 11-15-2019, 12:51 PM   #55
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Total BS. Insurance is one of the biggest scams we as humans have to deal with.

Go on?
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Old 11-15-2019, 01:03 PM   #56
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there's only 3 instances where you should get insurance:

1. you are forced to
2. you can't afford the consequences of not having insurance (house burning down, long term disability, etc)
3. if you are riskier than the average person in whatever field you are looking at insurance for, like if you're expecting a baby or something or enjoy street racing on the weekends

in most other cases you're far better off just banking the money you would be paying for something you will never use and pay for it out of pocket in the extremely unlikely chance that you actually require it. i only have liability on my vehicle because if it gets totaled...i will be able to buy a new one in cash and still come out ahead

its not entirely a scam, but its almost entirely unnecessary for most people(aside from the 3 cases above)

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Old 11-15-2019, 01:08 PM   #57
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there's only 3 instances where you should get insurance:

1. you are forced to
2. you can't afford the consequences of not having insurance (house burning down, long term disability, etc)
3. if you are riskier than the average person in whatever field you are looking at insurance for, like if you're expecting a baby or something or enjoy street racing on the weekends

in most other cases you're far better off just banking the money you would be paying for something you will never use and pay for it out of pocket in the extremely unlikely chance that you actually require it. i only have liability on my vehicle because if it gets totaled...i will be able to buy a new one in cash and still come out ahead

its not entirely a scam, but its almost entirely unnecessary for most people
That is a very level headed way to look at it.

Liability on your vehicle is required, so take it out.

Building insurance on your home is required if you have a mortgage, so take it out. But you don't have to buy contents coverage or ALE coverage.
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Old 11-15-2019, 01:08 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by stone hands View Post
there's only 3 instances where you should get insurance:

1. you are forced to
2. you can't afford the consequences of not having insurance (house burning down, long term disability, etc)
3. if you are riskier than the average person in whatever field you are looking at insurance for, like if you're expecting a baby or something or enjoy street racing on the weekends

in most other cases you're far better off just banking the money you would be paying for something you will never use and pay for it out of pocket in the extremely unlikely chance that you actually require it. i only have liability on my vehicle because if it gets totaled...i will be able to buy a new one in cash and still come out ahead

its not entirely a scam, but its almost entirely unnecessary for most people
There are other reasons as well, and if we're not limiting this to auto insurance, there are all kinds of tax/estate planning reasons to use insurance policies. The truth is that you can self-insure (as you've chose with not buying collision/comprehensive coverage on your vehicle), but insurance is just a mechanism to transfer that risk to another party.

And to be clear, the statement that "you're far better off banking the money" is questionable at best. There are plenty of times when you aren't far better off at all, specifically if a loss happens.
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Old 11-15-2019, 01:44 PM   #59
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I was never suggesting that claims would be denied right now over a few thousand km discrepancy right now, but if premium calculations were changed to more heavily weigh kms driven, you can bet the industry would do more to monitor and investigate.
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Old 11-15-2019, 03:05 PM   #60
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Go on?
Well, perhaps scam is too strong of a word. Itís illegal to not have some form of auto insurance and most people arenít willing to risk not having home insurance and yet you hear of peopleís claims being denied for technicalities or because an ĎAct of godí caused the damage in question and we donít cover that etc. Some of these companies are in the 100s of millions of dollars or billions of dollars of profit range and theyíre denying claims? IMO, if the damage is determined to be caused by anything other than your own negligence and/or criminal act (ie. willfully setting fire to your own property) you should be covered, period. I make sure to fully peruse the fine print on any insurance coverage I get because if you donít, you can really get screwed if something catastrophic happens and you failed to read page 7, paragraph 9, sub-para iii, which states blah blah blah etc.

In my particular case, I feel like Iíve never received any value for my money (other than peace of mind) due to the fact that Iíve been paying for home insurance for a looooong time and auto insurance for even longer (decades) and have never submitted a single claim. My rates keep going up though. Awesome clients like me who just keep paying year after year and never submit a claim should be getting better discounts
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