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Old 12-03-2020, 01:17 PM   #41
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going to be at home with my wife and kid. no visiting anyone else, and nobody coming to our house.
both our aged mothers will be home alone in their apartments.

with the exception of Santa. We told our kid that Christmas magic makes him Covid immune.
That makes me sick. Is there no way around this? COVID testing, isolation beforehand, etc? I couldn't imagine putting my mother through that.
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Old 12-03-2020, 02:14 PM   #42
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Whelp, Quebec just cancelled Christmas. Can't imagine how hard that must have been for Legault. I thought they had struck a good balance with their "Christmas deal" but I guess the virus won out.

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"When we look at the situation, we are forced to realize that it is not realistic to think that we are going to succeed in reducing the progression of the virus in a satisfactory way by Christmas," he said at a news conference Thursday, striking a sombre tone.

"I know we would all like to see our family, but it is not a good idea. The virus is very dangerous. We need to stay home and get some rest and we have to take care of one another."
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montr...ault-1.5826939


Edit: Wow, Manitoba Premier Palliser just told people to stay home for Christmas too. Basically in tears saying "I'm the guy who's stealing Christmas to keep you safe."

https://twitter.com/user/status/1334588619294728202

Last edited by Flames0910; 12-03-2020 at 02:18 PM.
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Old 12-03-2020, 04:18 PM   #43
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Yeah. Momma really doesn't want to connect. Like really doesn't. Best connection is about 12 total hours (assuming no delay). Can't connect through Canada and still qualify for pilot program. Also about $300/person more. Better coming back.
I dunno. Need to decide soon
Weather big factor too
There must be a better connection than that through Denver? United still has a pair of non stops a day to YYC.

No easy answer but the fly and drive sounds brutal.
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Old 12-03-2020, 04:20 PM   #44
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That makes me sick. Is there no way around this? COVID testing, isolation beforehand, etc? I couldn't imagine putting my mother through that.
Everything has risk and right now my mother and I don't think the risk is worth it.
it sucks, but most people are in the same boat.

Thanksgiving was worse. that's the holiday my mom loves family together more than anything.
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Old 12-03-2020, 04:23 PM   #45
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Whelp, Quebec just cancelled Christmas. Can't imagine how hard that must have been for Legault. I thought they had struck a good balance with their "Christmas deal" but I guess the virus won out.



https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montr...ault-1.5826939


Edit: Wow, Manitoba Premier Palliser just told people to stay home for Christmas too. Basically in tears saying "I'm the guy who's stealing Christmas to keep you safe."

https://twitter.com/user/status/1334588619294728202
made me well up, too. that's the speech people need to hear and watch.

and we have Kenney. frack
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Old 12-03-2020, 10:41 PM   #46
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made me well up, too. that's the speech people need to hear and watch.

and we have Kenney. frack
Yup. It was hard to watch. Clearly hard to do but needed to be done.

Also, the silver lining... early indicators in Manitoba are that they may just be starting to turn the curve (after three weeks of strict measures).
https://twitter.com/user/status/1334645939642851329
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Old 12-04-2020, 01:28 AM   #47
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That makes me sick. Is there no way around this? COVID testing, isolation beforehand, etc? I couldn't imagine putting my mother through that.
It sucks for that person's mother or anyone else alone on Christmas but come on, big picture here.

How many people will never be alive for another Christmas because of those finding a "way around this"?
That should be making you sick.
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Old 12-04-2020, 03:44 AM   #48
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Moved to the EU in the fall with my fiancé so this will be our first Christmas together and first away from our families. Don't have to worry about turning down invitations or anything like that as it will just be the 2 of us.

Usually I have a big massive family gathering with the entire extended family. But given the size of my family and how huggy we are, that would easily turn into a super spreader event. Thankfully my family cancelled that gathering and instead is going to do a gift exchange and drop gifts/food at each other's door instead.

I'm happy most of my family is taking it seriously but I have one uncle who appeared to be the outlier, making a bunch of cringe postings on his Instagram (that never garner any response from the family) and sent out the family gathering invitation in the first place. However he seems to have accepted that he is the lone wolf and turned the corner in agreeing to partake in the drop-off exchange instead.
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Old 12-04-2020, 04:06 AM   #49
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Well, your brother can actually fly home. He could fly to Calgary and still do the rapid testing as well. The border is open to air traffic.
Thanks! I did mention that to him but he revealed tonight that the spine operation he had last summer hasn't gone as well as they expected. He has a lot of nerve pain still and needs to see a specialist who can help him manage the pain. So he won't be coming home
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Old 12-04-2020, 07:20 AM   #50
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Skype. Zoom WhatsApp - have a party line type connection that everyone in. Extended family can connect on and off with family here and overseas.

Not taking the chance with 80 yr old parents who could be compromised if any of us are asymptomatic.
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Old 12-04-2020, 09:20 AM   #51
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That makes me sick. Is there no way around this? COVID testing, isolation beforehand, etc? I couldn't imagine putting my mother through that.
The 'way around it' without compromising anyone is really hard to do. Requires opportunity and vigilance most are unable or unwilling to do.
If you have opportunity to stock up and lock up your private, single family dwelling a week to 10 days ahead of Christmas and are committed to not leaving for any public interaction, you can safely spend Christmas with anyone.
For almost everyone this simply is not possible.
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Old 12-04-2020, 09:29 AM   #52
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It sucks for that person's mother or anyone else alone on Christmas but come on, big picture here.

How many people will never be alive for another Christmas because of those finding a "way around this"?
That should be making you sick.
It still makes me incredibly sad. There's a lot of stories of heart wrenching sacrifice and "the greater good" doesn't diminish the heartbreak of this season for some.


My father remarried about 25 years ago. His wife's 26 year old grandson just died in a MVA on his way to work. They were very close to this kid and they lost his brother to a heart problem about 12 years ago. It has completely destroyed my Dad and his wife to see her daughter now lost both her children before she even turns 50.

On top of that, my Dad's health is not great and he's slowng down very fast. He is in his 70's, has multiple heart issues and just recently recovered from colon and prostate cancer. My kids are 4 and 8 and mean the entire world to him, and their time together means the world to me. I can honestly say I don't think there are very many christmases left. I live in BC and he lives in Alberta so the rules are pretty clear here.



I get the need for sacrifice. But I don't think everyone is grasping the truly heartbreaking choices people are being asked to make. It's not just forgoing some eggnog with family members. It's real profound loneliness at a time when many desperately need their family.
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Old 12-04-2020, 09:31 AM   #53
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My parents, brother and I all live in Calgary (in separate homes. My wife has been working from home since the spring, my course switched to virtual learning on Nov 16, my nephew switched to online learning recently and my brother isn't working right now, so my parents are thinking of a small gathering with just the 6 of us on Christmas Eve. Their place is large enough that the three different households can socially distance in the same room.

Nothing is confirmed yet, it is just a consideration.
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Old 12-04-2020, 10:21 AM   #54
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My parents, brother and I all live in Calgary (in separate homes. My wife has been working from home since the spring, my course switched to virtual learning on Nov 16, my nephew switched to online learning recently and my brother isn't working right now, so my parents are thinking of a small gathering with just the 6 of us on Christmas Eve. Their place is large enough that the three different households can socially distance in the same room.

Nothing is confirmed yet, it is just a consideration.
But this is exactly what they don’t want you to right now.
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Looks like you'll need one long before I will. May I suggest deflection king?
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Old 12-04-2020, 10:25 AM   #55
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My parents, brother and I all live in Calgary (in separate homes. My wife has been working from home since the spring, my course switched to virtual learning on Nov 16, my nephew switched to online learning recently and my brother isn't working right now, so my parents are thinking of a small gathering with just the 6 of us on Christmas Eve. Their place is large enough that the three different households can socially distance in the same room.

Nothing is confirmed yet, it is just a consideration.
Can you lock it right down a week or more ahead.
No last minute stop for cranberries
No final stocking stuffers
No trip just for milk and eggs
No underestimating the amount of whisky required for a week in house, and an emergency trip to the liquor store.

If everyone commits to not going out in public, not even once, and you can trust them lol, then you can do this with zero risk to everyone. Very few three household families could do this.
Stay safe
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Old 12-04-2020, 10:34 AM   #56
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I get the need for sacrifice. But I don't think everyone is grasping the truly heartbreaking choices people are being asked to make. It's not just forgoing some eggnog with family members. It's real profound loneliness at a time when many desperately need their family.
I get that things are different for different people and situations. But in an age where we have facetime, zoom, teams, cell phones we are more connected than ever - we've been able to keep in touch with people more easily and more often. Sure, it's not a traditional hug or touch or high five but it's not like what this would have been like two decades ago. With a backdrop of a global pandemic and the real risk of family getting sick or killed directly from a gathering for the holidays.

People aren't being locked up in cages and in the dark here and unable to contact, video conference or talk with family.

And jokingly, a lot of people are probably happy to try to avoid some members of their family anyhow.
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Old 12-04-2020, 10:42 AM   #57
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Why can’t people just postpone Christmas? It’s just a day on a calendar, move the day to celebrate it down the road when cases aren’t as high. I’m not even talking about a vaccine, just when things aren’t as bad and restrictions are lifted again.
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Old 12-04-2020, 11:14 AM   #58
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And that's exactly the issue. Everyone is thinking they can have a relatively small and safe family gathering for Christmas without really thinking about the potential for covid, and then once you have these mini super spreader events it impacts the whole community.

I think a family gathering would only be safe if everyone, and I mean everyone, isolates for 10 days prior. And by that I mean - no grabbing something at the corner store, no shopping at the mall, no Canada Post visits, no Tims runs, no going into a bank - for 10 consecutive days.

It sounds unreasonable and it is, but that's the level of isolation required to make a social gathering truly safe. I'm guessing 99% of people are unwilling to do that (including myself) so social gatherings won't (shouldn't) happen.
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Old 12-04-2020, 11:23 AM   #59
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It sucks for that person's mother or anyone else alone on Christmas but come on, big picture here.

How many people will never be alive for another Christmas because of those finding a "way around this"?
That should be making you sick.
Or how about the thousands of people who can't spend every Christmas with family because they work in an industry that doesn't stop for stat holidays? Or live in a different city and can't afford to travel? Or can't take time off work?

I can think of dozens of reasons. I frequently spend xmas alone because I can't get the time off work to travel and see my family.

I'm benefiting from COVID in that I've been with family since July and won't have to travel to see them this year. I am counting my blessings.

That being said, sometimes xmas alone isn't so bad. It is also completely arbitrary. Go spend a week with family in July, what's the difference? Isn't it really just that hallmark doesn't promote July 25th as family time?

Or I guess for many people it is "everyone should sacrifice except me because of my special circumstances". Yeah welcome to life. Ever had a mom who was a nurse and a dad who was a cop? This is christmas EVERY. SINGLE. YEAR. But that's cool, congregate because you think that one family member absolutely needs to see you or it will ruin their life because one Xmas out of 50 was spent without you.

Technology has made it easier than ever to connect with family despite being far away and yet people are getting more selfish than ever demanding they all spend the holidays together at the risk of killing those very same family members, not to mention the family members of neighbours and fellow citizens people are putting at risk (who are making the sacrifice others are too selfish to make).

Last edited by Cecil Terwilliger; 12-04-2020 at 11:35 AM.
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Old 12-04-2020, 11:35 AM   #60
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My parents, brother and I all live in Calgary (in separate homes. My wife has been working from home since the spring, my course switched to virtual learning on Nov 16, my nephew switched to online learning recently and my brother isn't working right now, so my parents are thinking of a small gathering with just the 6 of us on Christmas Eve. Their place is large enough that the three different households can socially distance in the same room.

Nothing is confirmed yet, it is just a consideration.
I think the thing to consider, is that even if this is allowed and you're technically following the rules, it's not without risk.

Look at this article from a few months back, the very first example is the situation you describe, where six people gather indoors for four hours. If just one of you is infected, modelling shows that the other five would likely get COVID-19 from your holiday gathering, even with social distancing. The numbers drop to four people getting sick with masks but the better fix is ventilation and less time (or not going at all).

https://english.elpais.com/society/2...h-the-air.html

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