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Old 10-17-2017, 11:48 AM   #21
Flash Walken
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You begin with a drill, a fish tape, and an increased tolerance for cutting holes in your drywall.
Once you realize you'll be making drywall repairs anyway, it gets kinda fun.

Oooo! an excuse to get new baseboards!
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Old 10-17-2017, 11:59 AM   #22
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https://blog.cryptographyengineering...gh-the-kracks/
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Old 10-18-2017, 09:00 AM   #23
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You begin with a drill, a fish tape, and an increased tolerance for cutting holes in your drywall.
Lots of holes. Lots of dead ends. Cold air returns and a bore-scope are your new best friend. In a fully finished basement and and upstairs, it was a slog but, I also got to the know my house a bit better.

I redid my house in CAT6 wiring, 1 in each bedroom (4); 6 for our home office; 6 for our entertainment area; 2 for upstairs living room; and 2 for master bedroom.

It was a little overkill, but if you're going to start opening up walls and stuff, might as well make the most of the mess.
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Old 10-18-2017, 09:02 AM   #24
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Once you realize you'll be making drywall repairs anyway, it gets kinda fun.

Oooo! an excuse to get new baseboards!
I almost installed crown-molding when the going got kind of tough.
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Old 10-18-2017, 09:52 AM   #25
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So I have been reading some updates from experts and it looks like wireless routers in general are not vulnerable to this UNLESS you are using your router as a repeater, wireless bridge, or as a client in another wifi network.

From what I understand the vulnerability is on the client side of WPA2 and if you are using your average for home use wifi router as just an acesss point, your router will not be vulnerable. You will still need to patch all your devices that connect to the router.

But if the router is in repeater, bridge, or client mode, then the router it self is a client and could be vulnerable.

Hopefully if I am wrong, someone will correct me.

Last edited by sureLoss; 10-18-2017 at 09:57 AM.
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Old 10-18-2017, 10:29 AM   #26
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That sounds about right from what I understand of the nature of the attack. The attack forces the client to reload a key, which has a side effect of resetting a counter that is used as part of the initialization of the encryption stream. Since the counter is reset to zero, how the encrypted stream is constructed can be predicted so the information can be decrypted.

Because the attack focuses on the behaviour of the implementation of the protocol on the client, routers themselves aren't vulnerable per se.

That said, I think a router could be patched to alter the behaviour if he conditions leading up to an attack are detected and behave differently so that a client that has been attacked isn't allowed to setup a successful encrypted stream.
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Old 10-18-2017, 11:10 AM   #27
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Lots of holes. Lots of dead ends. Cold air returns and a bore-scope are your new best friend. In a fully finished basement and and upstairs, it was a slog but, I also got to the know my house a bit better.

I redid my house in CAT6 wiring, 1 in each bedroom (4); 6 for our home office; 6 for our entertainment area; 2 for upstairs living room; and 2 for master bedroom.

It was a little overkill, but if you're going to start opening up walls and stuff, might as well make the most of the mess.
OT, how much does a full set up to run cables like that cost?

I'm leaning towards thinking it's worth it to ask a pro to "install/replace" the wiring of a single ethernet cable and replace two panels from telephone/coax to ethernet/coax in my basement. The ethernet cable that needs to be replaced/installed shares a panel with a coax line I know that works because BluSky TV worked through it.
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Old 10-18-2017, 12:56 PM   #28
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OT, how much does a full set up to run cables like that cost?

I'm leaning towards thinking it's worth it to ask a pro to "install/replace" the wiring of a single ethernet cable and replace two panels from telephone/coax to ethernet/coax in my basement. The ethernet cable that needs to be replaced/installed shares a panel with a coax line I know that works because BluSky TV worked through it.
So, my material costs were $300 CDN for 1000' of CAT6, a 24-port patch panel, and all of the wall plates and keystone plates, patch cords, etc. to the switch, etc.

I borrowed a few tools like fish tape, but I had to buy a bore-scope, because it was getting really frustrating not knowing if there was a route or not to where I wanted the wires to go. Strong magnets were good for dragging strings through walls or ceilings. Tent poles are also came in very handy. Even magnets attached to tent poles. Oh god, I love magnets.

Big thing is just planning where you want to terminate everything eventually. I was kind of lucky because I had a long bulkhead in the basement that ran all the way across the house perpendicular to all of the joists.
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Old 10-18-2017, 02:47 PM   #29
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That said, I think a router could be patched to alter the behaviour if he conditions leading up to an attack are detected and behave differently so that a client that has been attacked isn't allowed to setup a successful encrypted stream.
That is a good point. My point is that for people who are worried about their home networks, the router is not an issue unpatched (unless used in the aforementioned modes) and you don't have to wait for a firmware update before you can trust your own network again. The minimum is that anything connecting to your router wirelessly needs to be patched.
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Old 10-18-2017, 03:20 PM   #30
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So, my material costs were $300 CDN for 1000' of CAT6, a 24-port patch panel, and all of the wall plates and keystone plates, patch cords, etc. to the switch, etc.

I borrowed a few tools like fish tape, but I had to buy a bore-scope, because it was getting really frustrating not knowing if there was a route or not to where I wanted the wires to go. Strong magnets were good for dragging strings through walls or ceilings. Tent poles are also came in very handy. Even magnets attached to tent poles. Oh god, I love magnets.

Big thing is just planning where you want to terminate everything eventually. I was kind of lucky because I had a long bulkhead in the basement that ran all the way across the house perpendicular to all of the joists.
Thanks for the info.

I guess I'll have to start looking for someone who is willing to do such a job if I can't find friends who have experience with this. I am pretty sure it's just pulling a single Cat cable, terminating the ends and optionally replacing two plates if needed.
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Old 10-18-2017, 03:24 PM   #31
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If it's a new place you may be lucky and the phone cable is actually cat6 cable, using only 2 of the wires for phone. You can pull the plate off and see. Then you would just need to put a cat6 jack on.
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Old 10-18-2017, 04:11 PM   #32
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If it's a new place you may be lucky and the phone cable is actually cat6 cable, using only 2 of the wires for phone. You can pull the plate off and see. Then you would just need to put a cat6 jack on.
It's a new build so I'm 99.9% that's actually the case, so yeah. It shouldn't be a big issue to go from the telephone/coax plate to ethernet/coax plate as Cat6 is already installed. Do I need to turn off any power before accessing those plates? I was thinking no, but I thought I'd double check.

Even if it was an older telephone cable, I think I can just tape the new one to one end and yank it to the other side, right? I just don't have the tools to pull a new cable to the location behind my TV if there's none there. For sure though, there isn't an ethernet cable for that plate that ends in the utility room.

The problem I'm facing is the cost to do myself has a start up cost that probably doesn't make sense.

Crimper + termination (plates or heads)
Tester for the cable
Cat 6 cable (Looks to be around 30-40 ft ish required, 50-60ft probably safest due to error etc.)
2x ethernet/coax plates
Tools to pull cable/look behind wall/ceiling
Ladder
etc. and it seems like it would cost $300-400+ to acquire those items as most of them I won't be able to borrow (after asking around).

I borrowed a crimper, but I literally have nothing else. That's also how I noticed the jacks in the wall were telephone and not ethernet when I attempted to test my newly crimped cables.

The only one I really want is Ethernet jack behind the TV. I'm using a power line adapter currently, but it would be nice to have a switch there to run a cable to the TV, PS4 and extra (ie: Laptop) simultaneously and perhaps get a file server into the mix. I don't really use the other 2 plates, but if I did this, it would be nice to get it done right and know the plates work.


Back on topic though, is there a way to test to see if you're vulnerable? ie: Something less difficult that attempting to KRACK your own access points to determine vulnerability?

Last edited by DoubleF; 10-18-2017 at 04:13 PM.
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Old 10-18-2017, 10:26 PM   #33
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It's a new build so I'm 99.9% that's actually the case, so yeah. It shouldn't be a big issue to go from the telephone/coax plate to ethernet/coax plate as Cat6 is already installed. Do I need to turn off any power before accessing those plates? I was thinking no, but I thought I'd double check.

Even if it was an older telephone cable, I think I can just tape the new one to one end and yank it to the other side, right? I just don't have the tools to pull a new cable to the location behind my TV if there's none there. For sure though, there isn't an ethernet cable for that plate that ends in the utility room.

The problem I'm facing is the cost to do myself has a start up cost that probably doesn't make sense.

Crimper + termination (plates or heads)
Tester for the cable
Cat 6 cable (Looks to be around 30-40 ft ish required, 50-60ft probably safest due to error etc.)
2x ethernet/coax plates
Tools to pull cable/look behind wall/ceiling
Ladder
etc. and it seems like it would cost $300-400+ to acquire those items as most of them I won't be able to borrow (after asking around).

I borrowed a crimper, but I literally have nothing else. That's also how I noticed the jacks in the wall were telephone and not ethernet when I attempted to test my newly crimped cables.

The only one I really want is Ethernet jack behind the TV. I'm using a power line adapter currently, but it would be nice to have a switch there to run a cable to the TV, PS4 and extra (ie: Laptop) simultaneously and perhaps get a file server into the mix. I don't really use the other 2 plates, but if I did this, it would be nice to get it done right and know the plates work.


Back on topic though, is there a way to test to see if you're vulnerable? ie: Something less difficult that attempting to KRACK your own access points to determine vulnerability?
Cables are usually stapled to the studs (although I don't know what they do in condos if they are metal studs) so you wouldn't be able to just tape the new cable onto the old one and pull it through. Anyway, if you pull the wall-plate off you should see the type of cable used on the side of the sheath.

How big is your place? You could just move the cable modem to the location where you have the most connections to make.
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Old 10-19-2017, 06:00 AM   #34
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If you are only making a few connections you can do it without a crimper. The wall plates don't require one, anyway. I've made plenty of cables without using a crimper because I am cheap. Like Wormius said, pull a wall plate and see what cable was used for your phone line.
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Old 10-19-2017, 11:28 AM   #35
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Cables are usually stapled to the studs (although I don't know what they do in condos if they are metal studs) so you wouldn't be able to just tape the new cable onto the old one and pull it through. Anyway, if you pull the wall-plate off you should see the type of cable used on the side of the sheath.

How big is your place? You could just move the cable modem to the location where you have the most connections to make.
Well... it might not have been. I had a miscommunication with the contractor. Of the 2 erroneous ports, one was the one supposed to be behind the TV. I didn't realize this until the plates were on and I was missing a coax/ethernet behind the TV I requested they mount. IIRC, he asked someone to drop a cable down to hook up the coax and I believe the cables go through a bulkhead in the ceiling. I might be an odd case where a lazy corner cutting job and screw up might benefit me. But I'll have to grab a 10 ft ladder to check.

Basement around 650 Sq ft. Two upstairs floors around 650 each as well. Problem is I can't move modem from utility closet because I would then lose ethernet connection upstairs for my repeater modem and main floor. Cable modem in utility closet and a router repeater on 2nd floor. Plans to install a repeater behind TV in basement (wifi going through 2 drywalls and one wall is tile so wifi speed kinda sucks sometimes in basement). Planning another repeater on the main floor once I find suitable cost effective routers to use. Leaning towards Ubiquiti, but no budget on it yet.

I can't move the cable modem to behind the TV unless I fix the ethernet. Otherwise, the Cat6 pulled throughout the upper floors will be useless.


Different path, I plan on installing the updated DD-WRT on my router to patch the KRACK vulnerability on my AC1750 router. Good idea? Better alternative?
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Old 10-23-2017, 09:44 PM   #36
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There is a custom firmware for Asus called "Merlin" that I use. It is based on the Asus firmware, but is updated more frequently and has quite a few improvements. A nice, easy option in between the stock firmware and the nerdier DD-WRT.
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Old 10-28-2017, 02:29 PM   #37
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Is there a reason anyone would buy anything besides a Ubiquiti AC Pro? We purchased one recently and for the money and what it does it is insanely good.

Not a DHCP server though which is a bit annoying.
We looked into Ubiquiti for our wifi. Really liked the products but went with Open Mesh instead because of the onboard DHCP server.
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