Networking Question: Access Points

[I-Hate-Hulse]

So I've pretty much conceded that I won't be able to get great wifi signals in my house, despite lots of changes in location and hardware upgrades. As such I'm looking at setting up a wireless access point in the basement to address the hole in coverage down there.

I need a switch down there too so I figure I'd just get a router and set it into AP mode. I currently have a non 802.11ac Asus RT-N66 router. I wouldn't mind futureproofing and getting an ac router. My question is this:

If I buy a new ac router (RT-AC66) to use as my primary router in ac mode - how does this affect the non ac router running as an access point? Will the whole shebang just kick down to 802.11n only? Or will they both respectively pump out seperate 802.11n and ac signals?

[oilyfan]

I am assuming you will run a system as this:

Internet - ac router - hardwire - n router in access point mode

In this case the clients connected to the ac router will be connected at ac speeds while the n router will operate at n speeds. Should be no conflict, just make sure you name the networks differently.

[I-Hate-Hulse]

Bear with me - I'm a bit of a networking novice. Wouldn't the objective be to have one continious network instead of two separate ones? Otherwise won't devices be hopping networks all the time?

[Rathji]

Ideally, both networks should have the same SSID.

[oilyfan]

Yes, you can have the same SSID, I guess I was thinking about keeping the, separate to identify which network you are on. The only downfall I see of the one SSID would be that you would want the ac devices to be on the ac network as much as possible, in the case of a common SSID the device might switch to the stronger signal, which might be the slower n network.

[Rathji]

In the case of network hand-offs, typically the device will go to fairly extreme lengths not to switch to a new network, even if the other network is stronger signal.

In his case, if the 'primary' wireless network is the AC network, then it will probably be ok.

[TheGrimm]

Are all of your devices AC capable yet? If your house is anything like mine it takes a while to get the bulk of them moved over. That said, if you are the tinkering type, buying a wireless router that supports DD-WRT is a good idea. I was able to convert my L3-only wireless router into an AP using the software.

Rathji is on the money with his assessment, you will find in all likelihood that the clients are going to try to stick with their first connection, even if the signal strength is marginally better on the other AP. The decision is client based and you will have to modify each client (if possible) if you want it to jump between networks more frequently.

Read: http://www.intel.com/support/wireles.../CS-030101.htm

[sclitheroe]

Originally Posted by Rathji

In the case of network hand-offs, typically the device will go to fairly extreme lengths not to switch to a new network, even if the other network is stronger signal.

In his case, if the 'primary' wireless network is the AC network, then it will probably be ok.

This is an important point - with differing SSID's, I'd say the chance of any device in the house switching networks is probably close to nil - the act of switching SSID's (and thus networks, even though they'd be the same IP network under the covers) means that the device will need to drop any open network connections, pull a new DHCP lease, flush DNS caches, etc.

From the device's operating system's perspective, it's a horrible thing to have to do if it's not neccessary, and as long as the other SSID is visible and connected, it's unlikely to ever switch.

Bear in mind too that even with the same SSID, devices will make choices regarding AP and mode (g/n/ac) that you might not agree with - it's not uncommon for my devices to decide they like the upstairs AP even though I'm 40 feet away in clear air from the main floor AP, etc. Just let them be, it's not worth trying to force the gear to do what you think is right with regards to AP and mode. The goal should be 5 bars, let the gear figure out the rest.

[TheGrimm]

Also, you definitely want the two AP's on the exact same network, same SSID, same subnet etc. I don't mean that they are both configured with the same network addresses (192.168.10.x 255.255.255.0) etc, because they could both be configured to use the same network but not be IN the same network. You need to make sure at least one of them is running as a wireless AP (not wireless router) because if it is doing NATing it will be essentially keeping the two networks separate. BTW, so far as I am aware, a wireless client will NOT switch SSID's on the fly, if you want roaming to work the SSID must be the same.

When I was running dual AP I had it setup like this:

Wired Router (non-Wireless): Set up a VLAN called Home_Network (or something similar) and assigned it an IP range of 10.10.10.x 255.255.255.0 using .1 as my Default Gateway.

Wireless AP1 (Turned off routing/NATing capabilities): setup a management IP of 10.10.10.2 and make sure it is forwarding all DHCP requests for the network to 10.10.10.1

Wireless AP2 (Turned off routing/NATing capabilities): setup a management IP of 10.10.10.3 and make sure it is forwarding all DHCP requests for the network to 10.10.10.1

You can also have one of the wireless routers running as a router and NATing your internet connection and then have the second wireless router turned into an AP and using the first wireless router as the DHCP server and default gateway.

Hope this isn't as confusing as I am probably making it sound. Feel free to PM me and I can give you my phone number as well if you would like some assistance!