Alberta Politics Thread v2

[Slava]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

It’s a pretty big stretch to suggest that all minimum wage earners work full time

Well the point is you can't have it both ways. You can't claim that the wages are increased by $3000 a year for employees and then on the other hand suggest that they don't all work 40 hours a week, therefore it's not costing the employers $3000.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Slava

Well the point is you can't have it both ways. You can't claim that the wages are increased by $3000 a year for employees and then on the other hand suggest that they don't all work 40 hours a week, therefore it's not costing the employers $3000.

Who suggested both of those things?

[Slava]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Who suggested both of those things?

Well you did, but seriously I'm not interested in debating the semantics of this.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Slava

Well you did, but seriously I'm not interested in debating the semantics of this.

I suggested that minimum wage earners who don’t work full time will be earning an additional $3k annually? I guess I’ll have to take your word for it Slava

My post that you quoted was merely commenting on the misleading manner in which the article Dion posted was claiming that many employers are now seeing nearly $3000 in additional costs per employee. But if you want to twist that into something else you’re more than welcome to try and do so.

[White Out 403]

https://globalnews.ca/news/4508487/a...tests-changes/

Alberta government taking back driver’s licence road testing from private industry

And of course Kenney is whining about it, despite us being the once province with such a dumb system to begin with.

[DJones]

My problem with the minimum wage is who the hell is going to pay someone $15/hour to train them? They might be useless and you wasted #### loads of money. I hardly got paid my first week roofing, first job bookkeeping I wasn't even close to minimum wage haha.

I used to get a summer student to help me out each summer but at ~$18/hour cost to the employer that's gone.

God, I'm glad I'm not at the bottom of the rung anymore. A lack of young people being trained will actually help my job prospects as well.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by DJones

My problem with the minimum wage is who the hell is going to pay someone $15/hour to train them? They might be useless and you wasted #### loads of money. I hardly got paid my first week roofing, first job bookkeeping I wasn't even close to minimum wage haha.

I used to get a summer student to help me out each summer but at ~$18/hour cost to the employer that's gone.

God, I'm glad I'm not at the bottom of the rung anymore. A lack of young people being trained will actually help my job prospects as well.

Yes, your FYGM attitude is clearly visible.

[transplant99]

LOL...good stuff.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

Yes, your FYGM attitude is clearly visible.

They are limiting how I got my foot in the door. If I could do it all over again, I would find a 60 year old tradesman and offer to work for free if he taught and vouched for me after a few months.

I don't know how else you are supposed to get your foot in the door. Hope to god they pick your inexperienced resume out of a pile? Hope your family or friends gift you a job?

#### that, I paid to go to school for 4 years and it gave me iffy job prospects. Why's it so terrible to work for cheap and get a marketable skill? My kids are going to be working under the table at this rate.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by DJones

They are limiting how I got my foot in the door. If I could do it all over again, I would find a 60 year old tradesman and offer to work for free if he taught and vouched for me after a few months.

I don't know how else you are supposed to get your foot in the door. Hope to god they pick your inexperienced resume out of a pile? Hope your family or friends gift you a job?

#### that, I paid to go to school for 4 years and it gave me iffy job prospects. Why's it so terrible to work for cheap and get a marketable skill? My kids are going to be working under the table at this rate.

The industry will have to adjust. If the best they can do is hire people on for wages that mean people have to work 40 hours a week and eat Kraft Dinner in a 1 bedroom dive then how good a job is it really?

[DiracSpike]

But the specific issue we're pointing to, and a major problem with the coarse adjustment of the minimum wage increase is that teenagers aren't eating KD in a one bedroom dive. They're banking all their money and living at home. The most important thing to do for a young person is to get experience working, and with this rise we've seen employers come out and say they're less willing to hire young people. Then you start getting young people piling up on the unemployment line and unable to move up the rungs because they can't get started, all because a policy that was supposed to help them ended up doing the opposite by artificially increasing the cost of their unskilled labor. There's nothing wrong with working for $10/hour as a 17 year old living at home. Dont like making minimum wage? Good, you shouldn't, use that as a motivation to move up the ladder and show future employers who make more of an investment in you that you're worthy of that investment by your past job history.

[White Out 403]

Maybe they're living at home because minimum wage hasn't keep up with inflation and buying power is in the toilet? All these negative incentives really accomplish one thing: widen the wealth gap.

[DiracSpike]

I'm glad you brought up inflation and buying power because those are both negatively impacted by this minimum wage rise as well. Artificially raising the cost of labor across the Province will cause costs and thus prices to go up as well, especially in places where people don't need to be particularly skilled, like restaurants and grocery stores. The NDP have been pretty bad for inflation and buying power, instituting the carbon tax, higher business taxes, and minimum wage increases have caused essentials of life like electricity food and gasoline to all rise.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by DiracSpike

I'm glad you brought up inflation and buying power because those are both negatively impacted by this minimum wage rise as well. Artificially raising the cost of labor across the Province will cause costs and thus prices to go up as well, especially in places where people don't need to be particularly skilled, like restaurants and grocery stores. The NDP have been pretty bad for inflation and buying power, instituting the carbon tax, higher business taxes, and minimum wage increases have caused essentials of life like electricity food and gasoline to all rise.

Yes I'm fully aware of the talking points, but, how do you tackle the gap in wealth? Or maybe it doesn't matter?

[DiracSpike]

What? I thought we were talking about minimum wage and how it particularly effects young people.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

Yes I'm fully aware of the talking points, but, how do you tackle the gap in wealth? Or maybe it doesn't matter?

You train people to have marketable skills. That's how you get out of the minimum wage cycle.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by DJones

You train people to have marketable skills. That's how you get out of the minimum wage cycle.

Cool. How do you do that? Who pays it for? I'm all ears, legit. If your answer is "let the market pay people what they're worth" I'm going to need you to try harder.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

Cool. How do you do that? Who pays it for? I'm all ears, legit. If your answer is "let the market pay people what they're worth" I'm going to need you to try harder.

You let the person pay for it with their labor.

Theres a #### ton of tradesman with broken bodies that would love to have a cheap young person to hold their tools.

In 6 months they'd no longer be unskilled and have a foundation to command more than minimum wage

[longsuffering]

Originally Posted by DiracSpike

But the specific issue we're pointing to, and a major problem with the coarse adjustment of the minimum wage increase is that teenagers aren't eating KD in a one bedroom dive. They're banking all their money and living at home. The most important thing to do for a young person is to get experience working, and with this rise we've seen employers come out and say they're less willing to hire young people. Then you start getting young people piling up on the unemployment line and unable to move up the rungs because they can't get started, all because a policy that was supposed to help them ended up doing the opposite by artificially increasing the cost of their unskilled labor. There's nothing wrong with working for $10/hour as a 17 year old living at home. Dont like making minimum wage? Good, you shouldn't, use that as a motivation to move up the ladder and show future employers who make more of an investment in you that you're worthy of that investment by your past job history.

Let's be honest with ourselves.

The moment a 2 tiered minimum wage system is implemented, many employers would replace adult workers with lower paid students.

How does that help the working poor?

Sent from my MIX using Tapatalk

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by DJones

You let the person pay for it with their labor.

Theres a #### ton of tradesman with broken bodies that would love to have a cheap young person to hold their tools.

In 6 months they'd no longer be unskilled and have a foundation to command more than minimum wage

Why do you suppose that will work now when it hasn't for decades?