In a big way I hate it, but Amazon is truly great

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by AFireInside

But people aren't spending more time with people they know and like, that just isn't true.

I mean get out and support companies that actually employ people in your community. Your statement illustrates exactly what I'm talking about. We're becoming more and more selfish and less empathetic.

I get it, we're all above those pathetic workers that are treated terribly, they didn't try hard enough to get a better position in life like the rest of us so they deserve what they get. You don't require a local retail job to get by so you don't care. As these giant corporations take more and more control over every aspect of our lives it will at some point have a negative effect on you. Keep supporting companies that treat workers like trash, and provide no benefits while making tremendous profits though.

But hey we all need to save $3 dollars on a USB cord right?

These companies have their place but everyone acting like life is soooo difficult makes me laugh. I'm definitely not perfect but I do try and make an effort to support actual businesses /workers in my actual community.

People need to adapt. You sound like one of those guys getting mad at his neighbours for buying a model T because it will put the blacksmith out of work.

[Matata]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The corporate oligopoly we're seeing emerge before our eyes is an example of hundreds of millions of people all doing what works best for them, without malice, leading to consequences that will be very bad for most of us collectively.

There was a time when American legislators broke up companies when they got as big as Amazon or Google/Alphabet. When they recognized that colossal companies that could absorb or smash all competitors were bad for free markets and bad for democracy. No longer. America wants their corporate titans to remain huge so they can stand up against China's titans. And, of course, American legislators have rolled over on corporate taxation - Republicans have been relentlessly cutting the budget of the IRS for years, resulting in 10s of billions of corporate taxes going uncollected.

There's going to be a reckoning down the line. If we're fortunate, the masses of citizens with no meaningful work will be pacified with cheap entertainment and drugs. But if those low-skilled workers with no future get more uppity, well, just look to what's going on in France right now and imagine it being a more or less permanent state of affairs across the developed world. And that's not to mention what society's losers can do to elections when roused by a demagogue.

I see massive corporations vs. humanity as the core struggle within our society right now. We can wax political all day about how these titans can be brought to heal through legislation, but that's probably an impossible task at this point, their talons are in way too deep now.

The real power we have is voting with our dollar and attention, all we collectively have to do is pump the brakes on our materialism and make an effort to spend our money ethically, but that's where people seem quickest to roll over.

[nfotiu]

Originally Posted by AFireInside

But people aren't spending more time with people they know and like, that just isn't true.

I mean get out and support companies that actually employ people in your community. Your statement illustrates exactly what I'm talking about. We're becoming more and more selfish and less empathetic.

I get it, we're all above those pathetic workers that are treated terribly, they didn't try hard enough to get a better position in life like the rest of us so they deserve what they get. You don't require a local retail job to get by so you don't care. As these giant corporations take more and more control over every aspect of our lives it will at some point have a negative effect on you. Keep supporting companies that treat workers like trash, and provide no benefits while making tremendous profits though.

But hey we all need to save $3 dollars on a USB cord right?

These companies have their place but everyone acting like life is soooo difficult makes me laugh. I'm definitely not perfect but I do try and make an effort to support actual businesses /workers in my actual community.

We're evolving past the point where a store selling USB cords and taking their cut is providing something useful to society. I'm not seeing the downside of that.

Craft breweries, restaurants, bakeries are all flourishing where I live. Maybe if people are ordering their staples online they are actually spending more time enjoying themselves with their family at a craft brewery whose whole supply chain is mostly local, and less time running around to Target and Home Depot on the weekend.

[zamler]

I'd love to know what % of products on Amazon are made in China.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by nfotiu

We're evolving past the point where a store selling USB cords and taking their cut is providing something useful to society. I'm not seeing the downside of that.

Craft breweries, restaurants, bakeries are all flourishing where I live. Maybe if people are ordering their staples online they are actually spending more time enjoying themselves with their family at a craft brewery whose whole supply chain is mostly local, and less time running around to Target and Home Depot on the weekend.

This is a great post. Why do I need to purchase my cell phone case from a mall kiosk v. an online store? This way I get the exact case that I want and I don't have to drive anywhere.

Yesterday I was looking for a specific battery for my car key fob. Went to a couple of stores and they didn't have the model. I ordered it from amazon and it was at my house in 16 hours.

I usually buy my clothes local, beer local, flowers, baked goods, coffee. I love my community and my city and support local businesses when they provide a creative or innovative product or service. I'm not going to subsidize someone charging 2-300% markup on something that is ubiquitous.

[The Reverend]

I think the main issue between Amazon vs. Walmart is that Walmart was the first to actually create a monopsony.

Walmart basically told their suppliers that they will not sell their product unless they priced it as low as possible. Hence why Walmart can offer such low prices. I don't believe Amazon can do this as they are not the sole buyer of anything and have considerable competition, at least in the US.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by zamler

I'd love to know what % of products on Amazon are made in China.

The same % as in retail stores

[temple5]

I think people have to separate the word monopoly and the tax large corporations pay. These are to completely separate issues and have nothing to do with one another. Also one is easily fixable by politicians.

Omg the commies and Amazon is a monopoly BS wont you please think of the local book store where I can go and drink coffee for hours on end and eat my biscotti blah blah blah.

Google I agree with is essentially a monopoly for search but online monopolies are much more difficult to breakup because there is no geographical barrier to access. On the flipside they are almost impossible to remain because again there is no regional barrier for entry so anyone could overtake google if you came up with a better algorithm. Ok force google to sell Youtube, ok to who, Google subsidizes youtube so anyone purchasing it would also have to subsidize it.

The only possible comparison between Amazon and Standard oil is the the Amazon Basics line of products with their vertical integration and if I was Amazon I would eliminate that product line. It has to be low margin so why bother offering it.

What exactly is Amazon a monopoly in?

Do they have a more than 50% marketshare in anything, just because they are the largest seller of an item doesnt mean they are a monopoly? Its nothing new that large retailers have bargaining power with the vendors of the products they sell. Sure is Amazon in a wide and varying array of businesses sure, but just because they have taken that route vs focusing on the core business like most do doesnt make them a monopoly.

The government in this country is a monopoly service provider of education and healthcare with no alternative except for the extremely wealthy so you cannot say all monopolys are bad.

[calgarywinning]

What a lot of people don't realize about online stores and Amazon is they are not contributing to the tax base of the countries economy, the provincial economy and in most cases the local economy. A brick and mortar store has a tax burden it must fulfill.

Again, there are also a set of rules on things that are imported into Canada, which companies like Amazon bypass. They simply ignore the laws of importation and while our government will enforce it on all other forms of business, it will not enforce it on companies like Amazon and Apple, etc.

Now I know some of you are going to say they provide jobs. However, Amazon makes no secret they would prefer robots. The strife of workers and pay is also well documented

Of course the end benefit is the consumer who says, WOW, what a price, WOW what a deal. Meanwhile, local government plan to make up their budget by endlessly taxing local retailers by trying to increase their taxes to fill the tax void and fund all spending in the city. Doesn't it make sense to go after these large companies to fulfill a percentage of tax burden they get for accessing our marketplace and city?

You would think it would be the other way around, that local retailers and shops would have a tax advantage brought to you by taxing online retail sales, but the people like Bezos and the powers that be get to make the rules, and they are harvesting your local dollars to build spaceships and transfer their brains into the internet so they can live forever. The money is being sucked out of our economy.

[temple5]

Originally Posted by The Reverend

I think the main issue between Amazon vs. Walmart is that Walmart was the first to actually create a monopsony.

Walmart basically told their suppliers that they will not sell their product unless they priced it as low as possible. Hence why Walmart can offer such low prices. I don't believe Amazon can do this as they are not the sole buyer of anything and have considerable competition, at least in the US.

? I assume the above is a misprint and you mean monopoly. If you define that as monopoly you have a very very loose definition. Walmart has never been the sole seller or had enough of a marketshare to be considered the sole provider of anything. The only way that argument is legitimate is if you take that to the local town level where you could say Walmart Supercentre has a monopoly on groceries in my town.

Having bargaining power over vendors isnt a monopoly unless you are the only available seller of that product.

Is Costco a monopoly because they refuse to sell a single bottle of syrup vs a case or a 5L jug? Is Costco a monopoly because the wont allow mail-in rebate products in their stores? Is Costco a monopoly because they only have certain shelf space for toys and thus vendors have to bid to be available in their stores?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Yeah, but you're a bit of an alarmist when it comes to social ills.

It's actually experts who are ringing the alarm bells on this stuff. Depression, anxiety, screen time, social isolation - we have more and more data showing this stuff is linked and is all trending the wrong way. The UK has even appointed a minister of loneliness to address the issue.

I'd link to the articles, but I'm trying not to waste so much of my time on this site.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

People need to adapt.

Not everyone - or even most people - can become software developers, open artisanal bakeries, or become urban planners. If we can't find livelihoods for unskilled workers, they'll get their pound of flesh out of the winners. One way or another.

[The Reverend]

Originally Posted by temple5

? I assume the above is a misprint and you mean monopoly. If you define that as monopoly you have a very very loose definition. Walmart has never been the sole seller or had enough of a marketshare to be considered the sole provider of anything. The only way that argument is legitimate is if you take that to the local town level where you could say Walmart Supercentre has a monopoly on groceries in my town.

Having bargaining power over vendors isnt a monopoly unless you are the only available seller of that product.

Is Costco a monopoly because they refuse to sell a single bottle of syrup vs a case or a 5L jug? Is Costco a monopoly because the wont allow mail-in rebate products in their stores? Is Costco a monopoly because they only have certain shelf space for toys and thus vendors have to bid to be available in their stores?

I do mean monopsony. A monopsonist means that it is so big that they have bargaining power strong enough to force its supplier to offer prices as low as possible. Which in Walmart's case, they've done for some time now.

Here's a great article that shows how the declining quality of Levi's can be tied to Walmart's monopsony. https://foreignpolicy.com/2013/04/29...ng-up-walmart/

[The Yen Man]

Originally Posted by The Reverend

I do mean monopsony. A monopsonist means that it is so big that they have bargaining power strong enough to force its supplier to offer prices as low as possible. Which in Walmart's case, they've done for some time now.

OT, thanked for learning a new word.

[AFireInside]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

People need to adapt. You sound like one of those guys getting mad at his neighbours for buying a model T because it will put the blacksmith out of work.

That's a silly comparison and you're ignoring main point. I never said these companies should go away. People need to try and be a little more caring and responsible. Order from companies like that when it makes sense. Obviously paying 200-300% more makes no sense, and getting something that you can't get locally of course makes sense.

Can we cut the crap with trying to make points that are obvious to anyone with a brain? It's exhausting when people are intentionally obtuse to try and make a point.

Giving a company that is known to be awful money because we're lazy or making up excuses/lies like we're spending time with loved ones etc is annoying. It's impossible to completely avoid it but we could make some effort.

As for the post regarding breweries and people spending more time together. They aren't, data doesn't support that.

Someone else suggested that wages and treatment of employees will improve. There's nothing to support that notion. It actually doesn't make sense. The bigger and more powerful a company like Amazon becomes the worse they can treat employees.

[zamler]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

The same % as in retail stores

Good point, I didn't think my question through very well.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by AFireInside

But people aren't spending more time with people they know and like, that just isn't true.

I mean get out and support companies that actually employ people in your community. Your statement illustrates exactly what I'm talking about. We're becoming more and more selfish and less empathetic.

I get it, we're all above those pathetic workers that are treated terribly, they didn't try hard enough to get a better position in life like the rest of us so they deserve what they get. You don't require a local retail job to get by so you don't care. As these giant corporations take more and more control over every aspect of our lives it will at some point have a negative effect on you. Keep supporting companies that treat workers like trash, and provide no benefits while making tremendous profits though.

But hey we all need to save $3 dollars on a USB cord right?

These companies have their place but everyone acting like life is soooo difficult makes me laugh. I'm definitely not perfect but I do try and make an effort to support actual businesses /workers in my actual community.

Sorry, nothing you said here makes me want to spend more money and go spend my time at the mall as opposed to doing what I want to do with the people I know. If I don't spend my money in the community it doesn't make me selfish good grief.

[Russic]

Something I hadn't thought about until the Hasan Minaj bit on Amazon was how they have the ultimate guide on what products to make next, because they own the metrics.

I know a friend of a friend who is upending their entire life savings into this product that – to put it gently – is overwhelmingly simple to reproduce. They've done a really good job marketing it and getting some traction, but they want it on Amazon. So what happens if they're a massive success? Amazon can just find a way to make it for $10 cheaper and bam! They now compete against the Amazon Basics version of their product. And it's at the top of the page. And it has a little "recommended" tag on it. Thanks for selling with Amazon, we'd have no idea so many people wanted this thing you poured your life into without you doing all the heavy lifting up front!

I'm a big talker though. I ordered 3 things off Amazon yesterday.

[zamler]

I know a guy that made a custom electronic board and sells it on Amazon. It was quickly copied in China and now they sell 100x as many as he does I imagine that is very disheartening.



BTW anyone can sell products on Amazon.

[rubecube]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

It's actually experts who are ringing the alarm bells on this stuff. Depression, anxiety, screen time, social isolation - we have more and more data showing this stuff is linked and is all trending the wrong way. The UK has even appointed a minister of loneliness to address the issue.

This isn't a controversial statement, and I wouldn't have argued that point. Jumping from that to this...

I honestly believe I'll live to see a day when most people rarely leave their homes. Pathological behaviours that we see on the fringes of Japanese society today will become common across the developed world within a few decades.

...is alarmist.