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Old 01-27-2021, 07:10 AM   #321
heep223
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Default Flames lose to Toronto again, 4-3

I thought the Flames were the better team after the first period. Markstrom probably should have had that 4th backbreaking goal though heís been great so we let that slide.

My biggest concern was the lack of urgency on the late PP along with some coaching decisions.

Bennett is back to being my whipping boy...he hurts this team way more than helps. Whatís the opposite of ďthe puck follows a player aroundĒ? Heís got a magnet in his stick, but itís flipped the wrong way so that it pushes the puck away. Canít take a pass, canít make a pass, shoots when he should pass, passes when he should shoot, turns the puck over almost every time he gets it, never wins 50/50 battles.

This loss is not on Bennett but honestly he needs to be sat or moved. He is terrible.

On the other hand Hanifin has looked fantastic, imo heís been out best d man.
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Old 01-27-2021, 07:55 AM   #322
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As a fan that is tired of Gaudreau on this team I will say that last night he showed some of the fire & magic from his first 2 seasons. If he can bring that back with any consistency the team will grow a ton of confidence.

For all the doom and gloom around here youíd think we were blown out 8-0 or something. The Flames looked dangerous the last 40 and I believe will figure it out soon, Iíd hate to be one of those fans who post seething messages every loss and then pretend the wins are just luck.
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:02 AM   #323
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As I said in the pregame thread yesterday this looks like the same old Flames team to me. Not ready to play at puck drop, below average NHL coaching, too many passengers, etc. Such a Flames move to blow their wad in free agency on a goaltender only to cheap out on the head coach in an offseason where there several several proven winners available. I'm counting the days until Treliving is fired so the organization can move on from this mediocrity.

I know Valimaki is a rookie but he looks like an 18 year old rookie not a 22 year old rookie. He's not been very good at all this season and I don't know what was going on with Backlund last night but he needs to nip that in the bud fast as he's not been very good this season either.
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:03 AM   #324
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... is it just me or is CP even more bipolar than usual this season?
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:04 AM   #325
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... is it just me or is CP even more bipolar than usual this season?
In what way? Do we like winning/hate losing more than usual?
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:07 AM   #326
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To be fair, that is your best defensive centreman in Backlund. It's not like he put Ryan with Lucic and Nordstrom out there.
To be fair, the other two players are your worst defensive players on the team and can't skate with the likes of the players they were matched up against. Couple that with your weakest defensive pairing and its a match made in hell. Ward had last change and he chose to put those lines head-to-head, TWICE, and it cost the team. That was a mistake that should not be allowed to go by unnoticed.

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Backlund had a pretty bad game.
Backlund has been bad all season so far.

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To me the problem is mental with this team. After the last game, all you heard was the Leafs got lucky. That's loser talk. Winners look at themselves in the mirror and go out and kick ass the next night. If you lost, it's because YOU didn't do enough, it's not because of luck. You make your own luck. The Leafs drove the net and got shots to the net and the puck went in, don't be disrespectful and say they got lucky. Keep your mouth shut and just give the opposition their due when they beat you. If you were any good, you wouldn't have allowed those shots and opportunities in the first place. Stop with the loser talk because we've been hearing it for years with this group. Just go out there and win.
I agree. I hate the term luck. You make your own luck. It is up to the players to generate the luck. It is up to the coaches to set the players up for success so they will achieve their optimum performance and generate that luck. When the coaching staff mismanages the bench and does not play the right combinations of players so they can perform at their optimal levels, that is a failure and all the luck in the world is not going to manifest and help the team win. It is very much on the players to perform, but it is up to the coaches to put in place successful strategies and match up talent for specific roles. If the coaches can't make appropriate combinations that maximize the talent of the players, and don't employ those players at times when they are likely to be successful, then the players are not going to achieve optimum performance and the team will not achieve optimum success.

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I knew this team would come out and #### the bed in the first because they thought the Leafs lucked out a win in the previous game. They thought they could coast through and win this game because they were entitled to it, because "teams don't sweep these two game sets".

They were over confident and ill prepared and it showed in a turd of a first period.
Is it not the coaching staff's responsibility to prepare the team for the game and get their heads straight? When the team "collectively" comes out and plays like that, it is usually something systemic. It is not like one or two guys came out and looked like deer in the headlights, it was the whole damn team. They were not properly prepared for what was coming their way and that is partially on the coaching staff. They are the ones who get to design and implement the game plan. Yes, when the players don't execute there are problems that land on the players. But when the team is collectively out of sync, you have to ask why? When the coaches continue to put bad matchups against the opposition, leading to getting run over, that is on the guys managing the plan and the bench.

Trust me, I'm willing to run guys over who aren't performing and showing they can play at this level. I'm willing to back that bus up and make sure they have the appropriate level of tread marks on them. The players have to get #### done and when they don't they get called out. But this is clearly on the dip####s behind the bench. This loss is on them. And not surprisingly, the same guys that I like to point out as weak links on this team were the ones on the ice when the Leafs won the game. Its funny, but when you have a culmination of bad performers, terrible match up, and bad zone assignment you regularly achieve a negative outcome. That was achieved last night in a soul crushing way and was completely avoidable with a simple coaching decision. A decision repeated within minutes of each other. The players didn't execute, but the coach put out his weakest against the opposition's best, TWICE, and thought it was a going to lead to success. That's a massive problem.
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:09 AM   #327
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Ugh I wish tkachuk just walked off the ice after the scrum. Leaf nation enjoying "living rent free".

How many pld level isolation shifts did Sam Bennett have last night? How many this season? He sucks. I was vocal about giving him more opportunity and good linemates to play with, but he's been terrible. Someone should post isolation videos on him from every game until he gets scratched, or better, yet traded. What a regrettable pick that has been.
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:22 AM   #328
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After having cooled off:

Nobody is perfect or plays perfect every game and from second period onwards all CGY played really well.

It's just like Tanev said when they play together and commit to playing their style their game they truly are an incredible team.

They have certain keys to their game that were applied to start second in terms of how they need to skate, to check, to forecheck, to compete, to win battles, to get pucks on net, to get traffic and rebounds. When they do it looks great. The plays will be there if they do those things early. That effort has to come first - right from the start.

Play the entire game with that mentality.

Last edited by Jeff Lebowski; 01-27-2021 at 08:38 AM.
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:40 AM   #329
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Originally Posted by Jeff Lebowski View Post
After having cooled off:

Nobody is perfect or plays perfect every game and from second period onwards all CGY played really well.

It's just like Tanev said when they play together and commit to playing their style their game they truly are an incredible team.

They have certain keys to their game that were applied to start second in terms of how they need to skate, to check, to forecheck, to compete, to win battles and when they do it looks great. The plays will be there if they do those things early. That effort has to come first - right from the start.

Play the entire game with that mentality.
That's very typical, teams with a 2 goal lead don't skate as hard anymore nor do they attack as much.
Flames always look good when behind by a couple goals, especially in the 3rd periods. The look awesome then.
It's been their specialty for a while. Look like crap, get behind and then storm out in the third to make it close and give fans false hope.
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:47 AM   #330
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That's very typical, teams with a 2 goal lead don't skate as hard anymore nor do they attack as much.
Flames always look good when behind by a couple goals, especially in the 3rd periods. The look awesome then.
It's been their specialty for a while. Look like crap, get behind and then storm out in the third to make it close and give fans false hope.
There is some truth to this. Not unlike in football when a team gets up by multiple scores and throws out a vanilla prevent defense which leads to garbage time yards and scores where fans of the losing team at the end of the game try to convince themselves the the offense was really good with 400 yards and over 20 points when the reality is that when the game was on the line the offense just wasn't good enough.
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:47 AM   #331
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red View Post
That's very typical, teams with a 2 goal lead don't skate as hard anymore nor do they attack as much.
Flames always look good when behind by a couple goals, especially in the 3rd periods. The look awesome then.
It's been their specialty for a while. Look like crap, get behind and then storm out in the third to make it close and give fans false hope.
It's all mental. All that is overcome by mindset.
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:50 AM   #332
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Quote:
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That's very typical, teams with a 2 goal lead don't skate as hard anymore nor do they attack as much.
Flames always look good when behind by a couple goals, especially in the 3rd periods. The look awesome then.
It's been their specialty for a while. Look like crap, get behind and then storm out in the third to make it close and give fans false hope.
Exactly. The coach will also give the green light to a more of a aggressive, offensively focused game plan once behind. Not to mention the opposition takes their foot off the gas. There's a reason corsi numbers when a team is behind looks better than when ahead typically. Last night, the flames got their teeth kicked in whenever the game was tied.

That being said, this flames team always plays way too tentative, "let's feel things out" to start games. Been that way for years, and I am not expecting that to change with the current iteration of players.
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Old 01-27-2021, 08:57 AM   #333
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The Flames are the Minnesota Wild of Canada. Minus the playoff appearances.

Occasionally impressive, mostly mediocre. Seemingly always middle of the pack.

Sure they had a great season 2 years ago, and then quit on it in March of that year. On a micro and macro level just no commitment to consistency. Doesn't seem to matter who wears the jersey, doesn't seem to matter who is coaching them.

They're just stuck.
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Old 01-27-2021, 09:04 AM   #334
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We often talk about Gaudreau likely leaving to go back east at the end of next season for a variety of reasons but really why would he really want to re-sign with the Flames? He's never going to get the opportunity to play for a proven, winning head coach in Calgary. Ward is like every other head coach Gaudreau has had with the Flames in that when he's fired he's never going to work in the NHL again as head coach. This organization is so frustrating in that they supposedly want to win a Cup but never show the true commitment to winning. Hiring a head coach because he's the cheapest option out there isn't committing to winning.
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Old 01-27-2021, 09:13 AM   #335
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Bennett should sit. Ruzika, Gawdin, or Phillips would be much better in his position. Nordstrom should also be eating popcorn.
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Old 01-27-2021, 09:15 AM   #336
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We often talk about Gaudreau likely leaving to go back east at the end of next season for a variety of reasons but really why would he really want to re-sign with the Flames? He's never going to get the opportunity to play for a proven, winning head coach in Calgary. Ward is like every other head coach Gaudreau has had with the Flames in that when he's fired he's never going to work in the NHL again as head coach. This organization is so frustrating in that they supposedly want to win a Cup but never show the true commitment to winning. Hiring a head coach because he's the cheapest option out there isn't committing to winning.
I agree that Ward should never have been retained as Head coach. Asinine decision that will cost Treliving his job, no doubt.
I am more worried about Tkachuk leaving than Gaudreau. At this point it is what it is with Johnny, but if we don't show signs of life we will lose the most important player in our franchise, and probably the most important in the last decade, in a few years.
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Old 01-27-2021, 09:16 AM   #337
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I've rewatched the video a few times. Does Muzzin even see Tkachuk is there? Tough to say but seems like his head is facing elsewhere.
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Old 01-27-2021, 09:34 AM   #338
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Ugh I wish tkachuk just walked off the ice after the scrum. Leaf nation enjoying "living rent free".

How many pld level isolation shifts did Sam Bennett have last night? How many this season? He sucks. I was vocal about giving him more opportunity and good linemates to play with, but he's been terrible. Someone should post isolation videos on him from every game until he gets scratched, or better, yet traded. What a regrettable pick that has been.

Agreed re Tkachuk. Laughing at Muzzin and casually leaving the ice would have been a better move.
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Old 01-27-2021, 09:38 AM   #339
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... is it just me or is CP even more bipolar than usual this season?

You could build up one heck of an ATL with the gold in here.

A lot of keyboard Tkachuks
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Old 01-27-2021, 09:41 AM   #340
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Matthew Tkachuk overreacted in the end there in my opinion, should have let that go and better yet brought that passion in the game when it would have actually mattered.
What the Flames are missing up front is a character guy like Giordano, Someone that can carry and break open a game, I don't think Tkachuk is that guy.
I thought the Flames top players played well, Johnny fanned on a shot that would have been the tying goal.
It's the bottom six that's not to great and worse than last year so far from the players the Flames let walk.
I would consider trading Bennett to upgrade the bottom six if there's something available in a trade.

Last edited by Macman; 01-27-2021 at 09:44 AM.
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