Discussion: Do the Flames have a problem promoting young players?

[CSharp]

Tiffoli was a rookie when he won with the Kings and Sutter's the coach. So, ask him why Sutter gave him a shot.

[Yeah_Baby]

It's a reflection of the team's "always try to complete" model, isn't it? I know blow it up rebuilds aren't necessarily always a key to success but you're going to graduate more prospects in your system when you're not trying to win every year.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

https://twitter.com/user/status/1598745508138586112

I would love to see this done with each of the current head coaches, and then again with each of the top x (10? 15? 25?) all-time winningest coaches.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Canada 02

Valimaki - " I need someone to hold my hand"

I mean, if a little positive reinforcement has caused him to become a pretty solid player in Arizona - why didn't we do that?

A little criticism of your favorite team isn't the worst thing you can do. We're not going to do everything right.

[Canada 02]

Coronato will succeed under Sutter or any NHL coach because he plays a complete game. He is not just an offensive specialist. He might be a better PKer than PP.
High energy player, 2nd/3rd effort, excels at finer points of the game (faceoffs, checking, 50/50 battles etc).

[Canada 02]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I mean, if a little positive reinforcement has caused him to become a pretty solid player in Arizona - why didn't we do that?

A little criticism of your favorite team isn't the worst thing you can do. We're not going to do everything right.

most of his coaching exposure in the last year with the Flames was to Mitch Love; Was Love the problem?

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Canada 02

most of his coaching exposure in the last year with the Flames was to Mitch Love; Was Love the problem?

i don't know?

[Leeman4Gilmour]

I appreciate Bader's table, but his headline is terrible. Based on that, he concludes Phillips will never get a chance. Of all the players promoted when Sutter was head coach, 10% of them were under 5'11". Seeing how the smallest team averages over 6' (Article on player size), I'd say 10% probably isn't far off from....everyone.

[TheIronMaiden]

1. Jon Cooper - 2
2. Mike Sullivan - 2
3. Darryl Sutter - 2
4. Jared Bednar - 1
5. Craig Berube -1
6. Peter Laviolette - 1
7. John Tortorella - 1

7/32 coaches know first hand what it takes to win the cup. This is not a license to kill, but it should allow some patience. Sutter has a deserved reputation as a coach who prefers veterans, but he also has a reputation of taking lunch pail teams deep into the playoffs.

[Strange Brew]

The table is useless without context.

[dino7c]

Valimaki has played 18 games for a team trying to lose with zero pressure to win and great goaltending...I don't think he has proven anything at all yet.

He was outplayed in the AHL for an entire season and had a bad camp. 1 team of 32 thought he was worthy of a roster spot...but it's all on the coach.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I don't think it is an issue really. At least not specific to the Flames.

Tkachuk - straight from junior to the NHL.
Monahan - straight from junior to the NHL.
Gaudreau - straight from university to the NHL.
Ruzicka - graduated from the AHL relatively young.
Kylington - graduated from the AHL relatively young.
Mangiapane - graduated from the AHL relatively young.
Dube - graduated from the AHL relatively young.
Backlund - graduated to the NHL after only 1/2 a season in the AHL.
Andersson - graduated from the AHL relatively young.

Those are are just some of the recent and current Flames.

Not to mention guys like Gilbert ect who got some playing time when we had injuries

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by dino7c

1 team of 32 thought he was worthy of a roster spot...but it's all on the coach.

You don't know that. Arizona had second claim on waivers and picked him up. There are 29 teams that could have potentially made a claim.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Kasi

It’s probably going to lose us Coronato. Shame we can’t rectify it but it’s the direction this franchise is going.

Originally Posted by FanIn80

Wait... what?

We may find out this spring if Harvard is out before the reg season is over and he doesn't sign under his perfect circumstances to burn an ELC year then Treliving should trade him at the draft.

[Toonage]

^^ I believe it was reported that no one else made a claim

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Toonage

^^ I believe it was reported that no one else made a claim

how could that possibly be reported

[Toonage]

Ask Friedman I'm not the insider

[Ashasx]

I'm not the one here who stated that only one team made a claim.

It has very rarely been reported that multiple teams make claims on a single player on waivers - I have never seen a report of only a single claim being made for a player.

[Bingo]

I think the easiest way to answer this question is to look at two things.

1. Young players that Calgary didn't promote that went on to have big NHL careers
2. Players that Calgary had in the system for a decent amount of time that were thrown into trades and went on to have solid NHL careers

Without 1 and/or 2 the answer is no isn't it?

2015 Heat
Promoted Kulak, Hathaway, Jankowski and Kylington. No other players promoted by another team

2016 Heat
Promoted Jankowski, Mangiapane, Andersson
Lomberg gets away.

2017 Heat
Same names (Mangipapane, Andersson, Kylington, Hathaway)
Nobody gets away

2018 Heat
Promote Dube, Mangiapane, Kylington, Valimaki
Still only Lomberg

2019 Heat
Promote Ruzicka
Let Czarnik and Gawdin get away.

2020 Heat
Includes Ruzicka, Mackey
Gawdin gets away

2021 Heat
Mackey, Ruzicka
Valimaki and Gawdin get away

So it's Lomberg and Valimaki at this point ... and it would be pretty easy to find a pretty big majority of CPers saying Valimaki was done before he was claimed so that really can't be called a big loss.

Don't we need a list of impact players that have gone on to huge NHL careers elsewhere in order to prove the Flames won't promote players that should be promoted?

Only makes sense to me.

[Bend it like Bourgeois]

F me. Not another one of these …

People need to grab hold of context.

Every player who leaves an org like valimaki talks about the wonders of their fresh start and the confidence they are shown. From any org. To any org. Just as every new coach is a breath of fresh air and we all give 110% and take it game by game. Can we get a reporter older than 12?

As for the chart it’s 3 decades. I cannot imagine a less insightful way to look at this question than a chart by height across 3 eras of hockey, 5 teams, and no view of who was drafted or available. Twitter charts I expect to be 12 year olds so whatever.