Which is what SHOULD be said. But its not. Because those people dominating the headlines are those that want to literally defund and don't care what is left.
I feel like “Abolish Police” hits a lot harder and would have been the obvious choice, had that been the intent.
Yep, Azure is a textbook example of why they should have used a better word.
Well, he's a textbook example because defund has a textbook definition. And it's what he's saying it is, not what the intent is behind those slogans. The fact that people are wondering why people are taking the word defund as its meaning is really odd.
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They should probably stop using the word defund and go back to reform.
Agreed, it is tiresome to keep having to explain what the actual stated goals are to people who automatically jump to the conclusion that "defund the police" means people really want to remove every last dollar of funding. Even when you tell them otherwise, they put their fingers in their ears and still pretend it does.
Defund is the wrong word, but it's the word we're stuck with for now.
Yep, Azure is a textbook example of why they should have used a better word.
Azure is a classic case of someone taking something and blowing it out of proportion to distract from what is important. It's a tactic used by the ALM crowd constantly. They probably also share the bull#### posts trying to save Aunt Jemima that fraudulently claim it made the depicted woman a millionaire.
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Well, he's a textbook example because defund has a textbook definition. And it's what he's saying it is, not what the intent is behind those slogans. The fact that people are wondering why people are taking the word defund as its meaning is really odd.
This is a poster that the other day defended cops running over protesters, they know exactly what is meant but are manipulating things to change the conversation away from what matters.
This is a poster that the other day defended cops running over protesters, they know exactly what is meant but are manipulating things to change the conversation away from what matters.
Yup, also the same poster who attributed the looting to Anti-fa (and when people said "yeah, probably in part" said "Oh it must be so hard to admit left-wing anarchists are the problem!"), said the police brutality wasn't against peaceful protestors, said the protests which remain primarily peaceful are no longer about the issue but just about wrecking stuff, blamed the media for reporting on police brutality and "making the situation worse," and, despite being explained what "defund" means in this context with people admitting the term is a poor one, continues to define it only by the dictionary.
At a certain point, it's pretty clear what this poster's intentions are. Not one post focused on the issue being protested that I can see. Just post after post blaming the media, focusing on any act of violence from protestors, and excusing clear abuses by police as "what else could they do?"
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Maybe what is meant could be the proper definition of a word? It has nothing to do with manipulating things to change a narrative, and everything to do with the reality of definitions.
Like, they do kind of exist for a reason, no?
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Maybe what is meant could be the proper definition of a word? It has nothing to do with manipulating things to change a narrative, and everything to do with the reality of definitions.
Like, they do kind of exist for a reason, no?
As has been explained, yes, it could, and yes, it some cases people literally want the police to receive zero funding and have that money to go entirely to other areas that would better help the community. But no, that is not what most people are advocating for.
For example, this would be what a popular "extreme defunding" call looks like from the activist side:
Quote:
DEFUND THE POLICE
Immediately redirect a minimum of 50 percent of the $1.1 billion TPS budget toward the communities they have devastated by investing in secure, long-term housing for street-involved and unhoused communities, food security programs, public transit, public health, public libraries, and community-led anti-violence programs.
DEMILITARIZE THE POLICE
End Emergency Task Force (ETF) and Emergency Response Teams (ERT) (similar to the US-based SWAT teams), tactical squads, military grade weapons, and surveillance equipment.
Remove all weaponry from police and other law enforcement, including tasers, batons, firearms, rubber bullets, tear gas, pepper spray, and sound canons.
End the mass surveillance of our communities through the use of technologies such as stingray, facial recognition, and predictive policing technologies, drones, robots, and G20 surveillance technology that remained in Toronto.
REMOVE COPS IN SCHOOLS
Remove police and school resource officers (SROs) in all schools (Public, Catholic, Private, and Post-Secondary) in Toronto.
Remove police and school resource officers (SROs) in all schools, at all levels, across Canada.
REDUCE SCOPE OF POLICE
End all special constable programs and all policing on campuses.
End the policing of public transportation.
End the policing of minor bylaw infractions and noise complaints.
End paid-duty policing program (officers for hire by developers, street festivals, etc.).
End police collaboration with the CBSA.
Eliminate all stealth police cars and plainclothes operations.
Eliminate community policing patrols in highly racialized communities.
End Carding
DOCUMENT POLICE VIOLENCE
Mandate the public collection of data regarding police killing, and incidents of police brutality for all local, regional, provincial, and Federal police or law enforcement agency disaggregated by race, gender, age and citizenship.
DECRIMINALIZE POVERTY, DRUGS, HIV & SEX WORK
Release and expunge record for all poverty-related charges (including bylaw infractions, solicitation, sleeping outside, public urination, loitering, solicitation).
Decriminalize drugs, sex work, and HIV status.
Release and expunge records of all drug-related and sex work charges.
CREATE ALTERNATIVES
Create Crisis Intervention and Mad co-lead support teams; work with communities to develop models that work for them.
Create police-free, community-led, trauma-informed emergency service for mental health/psychiatric distress and other forms of crisis.
Invest in community support for shelters, drop-ins, after-school programming in low-income, Black, and Indigenous neighborhoods.
Create restorative services, mental health services, and community-run health centres
Invest in harm reduction, including safe supply, safe injection/inhalation sites, and harm-reduction outreach workers.
Establish a community-based and trauma-informed emergency service for people who have experienced gender-based violence.
Implement of civilian transportation safety service and better/safer road infrastructure for pedestrians, cyclists and public transit
Create a civilian conflict resolution resolution service to replace policing of minor bylaw infractions/noise complaints
Provide permanent, secure housing options for all people who need housing.
Some of those things we might agree on, others maybe not. But they're asking for a 50% reduction and showing exactly what crime-prevention measures they believe that money should fund.
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Agreed, it is tiresome to keep having to explain what the actual stated goals are to people who automatically jump to the conclusion that "defund the police" means people really want to remove every last dollar of funding. Even when you tell them otherwise, they put their fingers in their ears and still pretend it does.
Defund is the wrong word, but it's the word we're stuck with for now.
defund[ dee-fuhnd ]SHOW IPA
verb (used with object)
to withdraw financial support from, especially as an instrument of legislative control: Many university programs were defunded by the recent government cutbacks.
to deplete the financial resources of: The cost of the lawsuit defunded the company's operating budget.
See the usage in bold, in neither case does it suggest eliminating funds, defunding is simply decreasing.
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defund[ dee-fuhnd ]SHOW IPA
verb (used with object)
to withdraw financial support from, especially as an instrument of legislative control: Many university programs were defunded by the recent government cutbacks.
to deplete the financial resources of: The cost of the lawsuit defunded the company's operating budget.
See the usage in bold, in neither case does it suggest eliminating funds, defunding is simply decreasing.
Exactly this (out of thanks). It still applies, it just isn’t the first use that jumps to your brain. English isn’t perfect, no one is arguing that.
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My guess is they go with Pigskins. Non-offensive, can keep the same color scheme and secondary nickname, then they can either go without a pronounced logo like the Browns, create a W or DC logo, or simply add an image of a football to their helmets. I'll be shocked if they do a full re-branding.
My guess is they go with Pigskins. Non-offensive, can keep the same color scheme and secondary nickname, then they can either go without a pronounced logo like the Browns, create a W or DC logo, or simply add an image of a football to their helmets. I'll be shocked if they do a full re-branding.
Oh...so now they're tossing around the flayed flesh of Police Officers? Thats going a little far dont you think?
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Exactly this (out of thanks). It still applies, it just isn’t the first use that jumps to your brain. English isn’t perfect, no one is arguing that.
That's pretty much why it's the wrong word to use. Not because it doesn't mean what it means, but because if your message is designed for export, you need to make sure as many people as possible understand your message on the first try and that it is exceedingly difficult for bad actors to twist your message into something it's not.
Defund according to Oxford Dictionaries:
Pronunciation /diːˈfʌnd/
VERB
[WITH OBJECT]
US
Prevent from continuing to receive funds.
‘the California Legislature has defunded the Industrial Welfare Commission’ https://www.lexico.com/definition/defund
The above definition will lead most people conclude that defund means turn off funding entirely. Whether you rely on the definition as presented by Merriam-Webster or Oxford or any other source will change how someone interprets the statement. Semantics matter very much in this instance.
I think we can all agree it's not the best word and understand that it does need to be explained and accept that as inevitable. But I also don't think it's unreasonable to question why someone needs it explained to them multiple times.
But I also don't think it's unreasonable to question why someone needs it explained to them multiple times.
I think there's a reasonable suspicion that there's a motte and bailey argument happening with respect to the use of that phrase.
I think what's actually happening is that the people who say "defund the police" have wildly varying notions about what doing so would actually entail.
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