I would say there are pretty strong signals there are antifa-type groups in the Western US - Seattle, Portland, Oakland. Haven't really seen much evidence beyond the west coast.
Sometimes I wonder if "Antifa" even exists anywhere outside of these people's heads.
Antifa is a bogeyman invented by the alt-right, because they need to see their enemies as organized and perceivable threats to continue generating the fear necessary for their grift job. Same with BLM which they equate to a modern Black Panther Party. The radical elements that might walk under those banners are more or less fringe anarchic individuals that would march under plenty of other names but there is no real organized alt-left militant structure that is combating them as their fear game requires. Having these made-up enemies is a tactic which also makes it easy to label and accuse any individual that doesn't agree with their beliefs as being part of antifa to instantly judge and ostracize them. It's similar to how authoritarian leaders like Putin and Hitler invent or puff up certain groups as a pretext for ethnic cleansing or war.
There were recent video/streams of the Freedumb Convoys where the truckers were calling out on their CB radios "antifa vehicles on my 6, keep your head on a swivel!" etc. like they were X-Wing pilots being hounded by imaginary Tie Fighters.
Last edited by Hack&Lube; 03-29-2022 at 04:24 PM.
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I would say there are pretty strong signals there are antifa-type groups in the Western US - Seattle, Portland, Oakland. Haven't really seen much evidence beyond the west coast.
Anti-fascist / black bloc protestors threw bottles and shot fireworks at police in Quebec City a few years ago, then assaulted two Global News journalists.
I don’t understand why some people are so stubbornly opposed to recognizing there are violent, bad actors on the extreme left. It’s like they’d be conceding points in some kind of game.
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And the funny part is the name is just a description of what they are against, fascists. Which really is something we should all be.
90 per cent of people are anti-fascists. But some of the people who are motivated by anti-fascism aren’t much better than those they oppose. The mid-20th century saw a brutal struggle between fascism and communism that killed millions. Fortunately a third option - liberal, pluralistic democracy - resisted the lure of polarization and saved much of the world from a grim fate.
The choice wasn’t between extreme left and extreme right then and it isn’t now, no matter how much extremists on both sides want to present that false choice.
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I think it's less a case of people refusing to concede that there are "violent bad actors on the extreme left", and more a case of "not every person who is opposed to far-right kooks is a violent bad actor on the extreme left'."
Right-wing activists use "Antifa" as a catch-all scapegoat so frequently that the accusation has lost all credibility. Whining about Antifa has become a shibboleth to identify right-wingers.
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Anti-fascist / black bloc protestors threw bottles and shot fireworks at police in Quebec City a few years ago, then assaulted two Global News journalists.
I don’t understand why some people are so stubbornly opposed to recognizing there are violent, bad actors on the extreme left. It’s like they’d be conceding points in some kind of game.
I don't think people reject the idea of violent people on the far left. There have been anarchists and left wing organizations for centuries.
The idea is that "Antifa" exists as some organizational entity similar to the KKK or Proud Boys that have leaders and hierarchies. Antifa isnt that. It's arguably similar to a political movement in the same way "anti-immigrant" groups are a movement. There are likely violent activist groups on the left with similar goals or ideals, but the coordination between them is suspect
Antifa is totally used a a bogeyman to infer that there is some overarching mastermind to these events - who are probably organized by George Soros or some cabal of lizard people.
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Location: In a land without pants, or war, or want. But mostly we care about the pants.
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Antifa are anarchists, organization is what they're against. It's like saying Calgary Flames fans are an organization, anything you can join by self-identifying as part of is only an organization in the loosest sense of the term.
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Anti-fascist / black bloc protestors threw bottles and shot fireworks at police in Quebec City a few years ago, then assaulted two Global News journalists.
I think the salient points in the Antifa situation are that it's nothing compared to extremism on the right, and those most concerned about Antifa are right-wing extremists.
Why do I think Antifa is miniscule:
1. If you compare impact of Antifa vs. the Alt-right/Freedom gang, it's apples and oranges. Antifa has resulted in very minor, localized violence and have almost no impact on politics anywhere. In contrast, Alt-right has invaded the US capitol, shut down cities and towns in Canada, raising militias, infiltrated the military and policing and taken over major right-wing political parties.
2. If you compare the total size of Antifa vs. the alt-right / freedom gang, Antifa is miniscule. Not only in members, but also reach of their message.
There is nothing for Antifa like Fox News, Rebel Media, etc. There is no QAnon on the left side.
3. It's frustrating that anybody who disagrees with Freedom Protesters, alt-right etc are all lumped as Antifa. It's a lazy way for people to dismiss anybody who has an opinion they don't like.
So to me (at least), it's extremely hypocritical to hear right-wing extremists and their enablers to focus continually on Antifa, while not sounding alarms about the much larger, more organized and more violent extreme alt-right.
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Claiming that Antifa organized the infiltration and attack on The Capitol is akin to saying that the Edmonton Oilers are attacking the City of Calgary.
In reality it would just be a few disconnected spandex wearing mullethead fans of the Edmonton Oilers pissing on the C-Train.
That's the difference.
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My comment was in response to someone literally posting:
Quote:
Sometimes I wonder if "Antifa" even exists anywhere outside of these people's heads.
Just because bad people exaggerate something doesn’t mean we have to pretend it doesn’t exist. You’re not carrying water for the far right just by acknowledging that groups like antifa, black bloc or whatever they call themselves actually exist. When violent political actors are ignored or dismissed for partisan reasons it just discredits the people ignoring the violence.
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I think it's less a case of people refusing to concede that there are "violent bad actors on the extreme left", and more a case of "not every person who is opposed to far-right kooks is a violent bad actor on the extreme left'."
Right-wing activists use "Antifa" as a catch-all scapegoat so frequently that the accusation has lost all credibility. Whining about Antifa has become a shibboleth to identify right-wingers.
thanked for the use of shibboleth, I love that word
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I didn't see Fuzz's earlier post until after I'd made mine:
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Originally Posted by Fuzz
Sometimes I wonder if "Antifa" even exists anywhere outside of these people's heads.
... but I've often wondered the same thing. I treat "Antifa" like I treat "mainstream media", "fake news", "woke (left)/woke-ism", "cancel culture", "Critical Race Theory", "Laurentian elites": just another right-wing shibboleth. It's meaningless gobbledy#### to the rest of us. It's supposed to be...
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I didn't see Fuzz's earlier post until after I'd made mine:
... but I've often wondered the same thing. I treat "Antifa" like I treat "mainstream media", "fake news", "woke (left)/woke-ism", "cancel culture", "Critical Race Theory", "Laurentian elites": just another right-wing shibboleth. It's meaningless gobbledy#### to the rest of us. It's supposed to be...
Right. As much as people want to theorise on how others are denying the existence of these things as part of some greater moral or social game where they would lose points for admitting they exist, it’s mostly just the fact that none of them actually exist in the form they’re most often presented.
Is antifa real? Yes.
Is antifa real in the way it’s presented by right wing media, politicians, and commentators? No.
So thinking it’s a myth isn’t really wrong since the legend is far bigger than reality. Just like cancel culture, or the evils of “mainstream media,” or the others named above. Their primary functions are as dogwhistles for dumb suckers and rubes on the right, primarily coming from pseudo intellectual grifters.
The strategy is basically just taken from the book the religious right wrote in their efforts against gay folks and now primarily trans folks. Stir idiots up into a frenzy and moral panic and they’ll do whatever you say.
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Right. As much as people want to theorise on how others are denying the existence of these things as part of some greater moral or social game where they would lose points for admitting they exist, it’s mostly just the fact that none of them actually exist in the form they’re most often presented.
Is antifa real? Yes.
Is antifa real in the way it’s presented by right wing media, politicians, and commentators? No.
So thinking it’s a myth isn’t really wrong since the legend is far bigger than reality. Just like cancel culture, or the evils of “mainstream media,” or the others named above. Their primary functions are as dogwhistles for dumb suckers and rubes on the right, primarily coming from pseudo intellectual grifters.
The strategy is basically just taken from the book the religious right wrote in their efforts against gay folks and now primarily trans folks. Stir idiots up into a frenzy and moral panic and they’ll do whatever you say.
Antifa is for the emotional, cancel culture is for the intellectuals.
Several antifa members assaulted the dude Peterson was talking to a couple of years ago.
We're taking Andy Ngo at face value now? The same Andy Ngo who has doxxed members of the left repeatedly over the years, been caught fabricating/exaggerating stories on several occasions, worked alongside the Proud Boys, and speaks with a fake British accent? That guy?
Antifa are anarchists, organization is what they're against. It's like saying Calgary Flames fans are an organization, anything you can join by self-identifying as part of is only an organization in the loosest sense of the term.
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Anarchists believe in voluntary organization. They don’t believe in state coercion.
