The Home Improvement Thread

[Nyah]

Originally Posted by redforever

You must be on the same street as me? in Killarney? my neighbor across the street has that problem. I phoned 311. Their next door neighbor said they were calling the contractor as that house was just recently completely refinished and new owner moved in less than a month ago. Contractor might know phone number for owner.

I'm in the south, my guess is it's a city wide issue at the moment! What did 311 say? Is there anything they can do?

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Flames_Gimp

duct tape a lit propane torch or heat gun to a drone and melt the ice?

How to burn your house down in 3 easy steps!

[redforever]

Originally Posted by Nyah

I'm in the south, my guess is it's a city wide issue at the moment! What did 311 say? Is there anything they can do?

They said they would respond within an hour and an Enmax truck showed up within that time frame. What they did, I don't know.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by cSpooge

anyone have an recommendations for clearing out a frozen exhaust vent for a tankless hot water system with the kicker being it's vented out the roof?

Did you get this figured out?

[Fleury’sOTGoalCelebration]

I’m wonder if anyone has any suggestions on preventing ice build up in my exhaust vent for my hot water tank (exterior of house)
As you can see in the photos the ice builds up on the bottom of the pvc cone which then causes my hot water tank to stop working. I have removed the cone/elbow and left is as seen in the picture during the cold snaps and it works fine but not sure if I am doing any harm leaving this cone off. Taking it off and thawing the ice works but it just ices back up again over night.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[speede5]

I'm surprised that little bit of ice is causing enough restriction to shut off the heater. Maybe drill a couple holes where its collecting so the melt can drain but in extreme cold that might not work for long.

I wouldn't run it without the cap as the exhaust can be drawn straight back into the intake, but in a pinch for a few hours it shouldn't hurt anything.

Can you see the rest of the vent from inside? Make sure the slope is good and you don't have a water collection issue further up the pipe. I had one that had about a 20' run and it would sag in the middle and fill up blocking the vent.

[Fleury’sOTGoalCelebration]

Originally Posted by speede5

I'm surprised that little bit of ice is causing enough restriction to shut off the heater. Maybe drill a couple holes where its collecting so the melt can drain but in extreme cold that might not work for long.

I wouldn't run it without the cap as the exhaust can be drawn straight back into the intake, but in a pinch for a few hours it shouldn't hurt anything.

Can you see the rest of the vent from inside? Make sure the slope is good and you don't have a water collection issue further up the pipe. I had one that had about a 20' run and it would sag in the middle and fill up blocking the vent.

Thanks I’ll certainly take a look on the inside and check it out.
I took that picture a day or 2 into the cold snap. If I had left that cone on the whole bottom fills with ice in time ( happened previous years)

Thanks for the suggestion!

[speede5]

Originally Posted by Fleury’sOTGoalCelebration

Thanks I’ll certainly take a look on the inside and check it out.
I took that picture a day or 2 into the cold snap. If I had left that cone on the whole bottom fills with ice in time ( happened previous years)

Thanks for the suggestion!

I had lots of issues with my furnace intake getting clogged with snow and frost in certain conditions so I know the pain.

I bought the same type on vent as you have but din't get it installed before I sold my place. One other thing I'm thinking, because it exits the house with a slight downward slope, to allow the vent pipe to drain outside, perhaps when you install the cap you should tilt it upwards a bit. You should have some leeway so that rather than the condensate dripping into the cap and standing it would continue to drain out.

Not sure if that makes sense without a drawing. Basically tip the end upwards before securing it with those screws.

Once it starts freezing before draining it will just accumulate exponentially. The heat from the vent only keeps it liquid so it runs out it isn't enough to evaporate it.

[Fleury’sOTGoalCelebration]

Originally Posted by speede5

I had lots of issues with my furnace intake getting clogged with snow and frost in certain conditions so I know the pain.

I bought the same type on vent as you have but din't get it installed before I sold my place. One other thing I'm thinking, because it exits the house with a slight downward slope, to allow the vent pipe to drain outside, perhaps when you install the cap you should tilt it upwards a bit. You should have some leeway so that rather than the condensate dripping into the cap and standing it would continue to drain out.

Not sure if that makes sense without a drawing. Basically tip the end upwards before securing it with those screws.

Once it starts freezing before draining it will just accumulate exponentially. The heat from the vent only keeps it liquid so it runs out it isn't enough to evaporate it.

Thanks for the recommendation, once the weather warms up a bit I will take a look at it and see if I can make any improvements.

[sa226]

Anybody ever seen, basically icicles streaking down vinyl siding, coming out of the drain holes?

I went out to have a look at the vents today to see how they're holding up and discovered it. I've never seen that before

I'm kinda puzzled by it. It's on the "wet" side of the house, ie: where 90% of the plumbing fixtures are. My best guess is vapour from the bathroom and kitchen sink window escaping through to the cold side and started to drain on those warm couple of days, then froze again as the deep freeze re-visited.

No vapor barrier is perfect, but I'm a bit surprised by the discovery. If my guess, is what's going on.

[timun]

Originally Posted by speede5

One other thing I'm thinking, because it exits the house with a slight downward slope, to allow the vent pipe to drain outside, perhaps when you install the cap you should tilt it upwards a bit. You should have some leeway so that rather than the condensate dripping into the cap and standing it would continue to drain out.

Not sure if that makes sense without a drawing. Basically tip the end upwards before securing it with those screws.

This touches on a really, really common misconception with regard to direct-vented appliances. Your flue should slope back to the inside of the house, not to the outside. The end of the flue vent should be tipped "up" to drain back to the furnace/water heater/boiler, usually a minimum 2% (or ~1/4 inch per foot of length). It should not drain to outside.

Fleury'sOT, you've got a few things going on that are wacky. First of all the cone fitting you took off should be glued on. It's hard to tell but the ice pooling inside the cone may be from condensate in the exhaust stream (the smaller pipe) leaking through the unglued joint into the intake (the bigger pipe). The source of your issue may be that right there: the fact that the cone isn't glued on and it's leaking.

Second of all, what's up with the screws? There should be any. Make sure the pipes are glued, not screwed.

Lastly the pipe should slope down into the house, back to your water heater. If you have access, look at the pipe run on the inside of the house. Both the intake and exhaust should slope toward your heater. If they're relatively flat, or there are any sags in the run, that's a problem that needs to get rectified.

[Fuzz]

How close can you have a HW heater vent to a furnace vent and combustion air intake?


I'd like to replace my HW heater with a direct vent, but need to know how close I can put these outlets.

[timun]

Generally if your appliances are <100,000 BTUh you can install the direct-vented flue from one appliance as close as 1 ft from the combustion air intake of another.

[Fuzz]

Ah, excellent, thank you! Presumably the HW tank is much lower than that, and the furnace? Just a 1000 sqft bungalow, so it's not a beast. Looks like maybe 60 000?

[timun]

Yeah, usually your furnace should be in the ballpark of 45,000-70,000, while a water heater... could be whatever you want really. I've seen 50 gallon models with 100,000 input. A tankless could be 200,000 or more. In that case generally the clearance will be 3 ft minimum, but it'll have to be double-checked against the manufacturer's instructions; it may be more.

[Fuzz]

Cool, even 3 feet is probably workable without too much difficulty.

[speede5]

Originally Posted by timun

This touches on a really, really common misconception with regard to direct-vented appliances. Your flue should slope back to the inside of the house, not to the outside. The end of the flue vent should be tipped "up" to drain back to the furnace/water heater/boiler, usually a minimum 2% (or ~1/4 inch per foot of length). It should not drain to outside.

Fleury'sOT, you've got a few things going on that are wacky. First of all the cone fitting you took off should be glued on. It's hard to tell but the ice pooling inside the cone may be from condensate in the exhaust stream (the smaller pipe) leaking through the unglued joint into the intake (the bigger pipe). The source of your issue may be that right there: the fact that the cone isn't glued on and it's leaking.

Second of all, what's up with the screws? There should be any. Make sure the pipes are glued, not screwed.

Lastly the pipe should slope down into the house, back to your water heater. If you have access, look at the pipe run on the inside of the house. Both the intake and exhaust should slope toward your heater. If they're relatively flat, or there are any sags in the run, that's a problem that needs to get rectified.

This is why you should be careful getting internet advice. Someone can steer you 180 degrees the wrong direction.

timun is right. I spun myself around somehow.

I would be a little hesitant to glue that end on until you solve the issue though. You don,t have a lot of extra pipe there if you don’t get it right the first time.

[Fleury’sOTGoalCelebration]

Originally Posted by timun

This touches on a really, really common misconception with regard to direct-vented appliances. Your flue should slope back to the inside of the house, not to the outside. The end of the flue vent should be tipped "up" to drain back to the furnace/water heater/boiler, usually a minimum 2% (or ~1/4 inch per foot of length). It should not drain to outside.

Fleury'sOT, you've got a few things going on that are wacky. First of all the cone fitting you took off should be glued on. It's hard to tell but the ice pooling inside the cone may be from condensate in the exhaust stream (the smaller pipe) leaking through the unglued joint into the intake (the bigger pipe). The source of your issue may be that right there: the fact that the cone isn't glued on and it's leaking.

Second of all, what's up with the screws? There should be any. Make sure the pipes are glued, not screwed.

Lastly the pipe should slope down into the house, back to your water heater. If you have access, look at the pipe run on the inside of the house. Both the intake and exhaust should slope toward your heater. If they're relatively flat, or there are any sags in the run, that's a problem that needs to get rectified.

Thanks for the input timun, The only part that is glued is the cone to the male pvc pipe. Not sure why but the home builder used a screw for the cone and a screw for the elbow.
For the last 4-5 days I did re-attach the cone with the elbow removed and so far no issues. I am going to take a look at it today to see if any minor ice has built up.

I do have access inside the house so I will take a look (and a picture) and see how it’s configured.

On a side note - does anyone know where I can get a duplicate of this set up made or purchased? Cone with the pipe and elbow? I understand a trades person could but just wondering if I can go to a specific store and get it.

Thanks!

[Fleury’sOTGoalCelebration]

I was able to get some pictures from the inside, the pvc from the HW tank is shown, arrows show it goes straight up then basically straight out (90 degree) 2nd pic

This may be a dumb question but is that ice build up in the 1st picture normal?

[timun]

Originally Posted by Fleury’sOTGoalCelebration

On a side note - does anyone know where I can get a duplicate of this set up made or purchased? Cone with the pipe and elbow? I understand a trades person could but just wondering if I can go to a specific store and get it.

The pipe is PVC meeting ULC standard S636. It's commonly known by the brand name "System 636" (made by Ipex). It's sold in the big box stores, it's not hard to get.

Keep in mind you need a specific primer and glue ("cement") for it. You can also get that at Home Despot, Blowes, etc.

In your photos it's hard to tell what's going on. The ice formation is definitely not good, but it looks like you're missing vapour barrier...