2022/2023 Trade Speculation and Rumours

[OptimalTates]

Makar, McDavid, Mackinnon, Draisaitl, Gaudreau, Matthews, Kucherov, Hedman, Barkov, Crosby. Don't see how he's top 10 at all. Can't argue he's ahead of any of those guys.

Ovechkin, Bergeron, Kaprizov, Stamkos, Huberdeau, Marner, Josi, Panarin, McAvoy, Fox, Ekblad, the goalies. Lots of rooms for a list of 15 players that wouldn't include Tkachuk.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Makar, McDavid, Mackinnon, Draisaitl, Gaudreau, Matthews, Kucherov, Hedman, Barkov, Crosby. Don't see how he's top 10 at all. Can't argue he's ahead of any of those guys.

Ovechkin, Bergeron, Kaprizov, Stamkos, Huberdeau, Marner, Josi, Panarin, McAvoy, Fox, Ekblad, the goalies. Lots of rooms for a list of 15 players that wouldn't include Tkachuk.

Age matters.

I mean, Ovechkin is a 1st ballot HOFer, but no one in their right mind would trade Tkachuk from him (unless the goal was to win now, and then blow it up - even then, bad trade)

[OptimalTates]

Not really when the guy prefaces it with "in today's NHL". Ovechkin just scored 50, again, in today's NHL.

If he wants to go with most value, then players like Lindholm who actually have a contract (that is amazing) probably enter the equation. Plus all the ELC players and long-term contracts.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by shutout

Almost no leverage.

If he has given the Flames five teams that he will sign long term than those five are really the only ones that will provide anything of value. Two of the five are not realistic because of cap issues (FLO/VEG). Two of the other three will need to move cap costs out to make it possible (DAL/NAS). The last one is probably his preferred landing spot so they can wait a year and get his for nothing (STL).

If the Flames want to move him and have to move him they are negotiating from a position of weakness. Hence they have limited leverage.

God, some people are terrible negotiators.

The Flames have a rare and coveted asset for sale. Many teams will want him. They hold more power than any one team that wants to acquire him, because they have other teams to negotiate with. The acquiring teams do not.

Literally every trade situation t he Flames are in, fans say "we have no leverage"

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Makar, McDavid, Mackinnon, Draisaitl, Gaudreau, Matthews, Kucherov, Hedman, Barkov, Crosby. Don't see how he's top 10 at all. Can't argue he's ahead of any of those guys.

Ovechkin, Bergeron, Kaprizov, Stamkos, Huberdeau, Marner, Josi, Panarin, McAvoy, Fox, Ekblad, the goalies. Lots of rooms for a list of 15 players that wouldn't include Tkachuk.

It's more than just his scoring though as there's been a lot of talk about teams coveting his "unique" skill set. There aren't a lot of players in the league like him and Marchand that can put up elite offensive numbers while being solid 5 on 5, while also having elite pest skills. You could make a case that if he was an above average skater he would be a top 3 player the league as I think some of the players listed above don't have as much pure skill as he does.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Makar, McDavid, Mackinnon, Draisaitl, Gaudreau, Matthews, Kucherov, Hedman, Barkov, Crosby. Don't see how he's top 10 at all. Can't argue he's ahead of any of those guys.

Ovechkin, Bergeron, Kaprizov, Stamkos, Huberdeau, Marner, Josi, Panarin, McAvoy, Fox, Ekblad, the goalies. Lots of rooms for a list of 15 players that wouldn't include Tkachuk.

Yep, just criminally underrating Tkachuk. 8th in league scoring, 4th in P/60, 4th in ESP/60.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1549488361173405703

https://twitter.com/user/status/1549825530777804802

It baffles me how underrated Tkachuk seems to be by some people.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Not really when the guy prefaces it with "in today's NHL". Ovechkin just scored 50, again, in today's NHL.

If he wants to go with most value, then players like Lindholm who actually have a contract (that is amazing) probably enter the equation. Plus all the ELC players and long-term contracts.

Spin it any way you want. Tkachuk is a rare commodity to be available.

And here's a wild thought: some people might have different opinions on a player than you do

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Makar, McDavid, Mackinnon, Draisaitl, Gaudreau, Matthews, Kucherov, Hedman, Barkov, Crosby. Don't see how he's top 10 at all. Can't argue he's ahead of any of those guys.

Ovechkin, Bergeron, Kaprizov, Stamkos, Huberdeau, Marner, Josi, Panarin, McAvoy, Fox, Ekblad, the goalies. Lots of rooms for a list of 15 players that wouldn't include Tkachuk.

There's a few guys on your list that I would definitely take Tkachuck over if we are assuming its apples to apples an 8 year contract... He's only 24 and has a lot more left in the tank than some of these guys.

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

It's more than just his scoring though as there's been a lot of talk about teams coveting his "unique" skill set. There aren't a lot of players in the league like him and Marchand that can put up elite offensive numbers while being solid 5 on 5, while also having elite pest skills.

So what's your top 10 players in today's NHL list?

Which of Makar, McDavid, Mackinnon, Draisaitl, Gaudreau, Matthews, Kucherov, Hedman, Barkov and Crosby do you not have?

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Spin it any way you want. Tkachuk is a rare commodity to be available.

And here's a wild thought: some people might have different opinions on a player than you do

I'm not spinning anything. One guy said he was a top 10 player in today's NHL, and I listed 10 players better, at least based on my opinion but backed up by general consensus. So which of the top 10 do you not have?

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

So what's your top 10 players in today's NHL list?

Which of Makar, McDavid, Mackinnon, Draisaitl, Gaudreau, Matthews, Kucherov, Hedman, Barkov and Crosby do you not have?

My top 10 list is pretty irrelevant as I'm not a GM and I don't think teams look at it that simply. They look at what's already on their roster and what they are lacking. Almost every team in the league is lacking a Matthew Tkachuk on their roster including the ones that already have those players you listed on their roster.

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by Psytic

There's a few guys on your list that I would definitely take Tkachuck over if we are assuming its apples to apples an 8 year contract... He's only 24 and has a lot more left in the tank than some of these guys.

What does a contract have to do with being the best player?

The guy said he was a top 10 player in the NHL. Not that he had top 10 value in trades.

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

My top 10 list is pretty irrelevant as I'm not a GM and I don't think teams look at it that simply. They look at what's already on their roster and what they are lacking. Almost every team in the league is lacking a Matthew Tkachuk on their roster including the ones that already have those players you listed on their roster.

"Spin it anyway you want" lol.

Spit it anyway you want and Tkachuk is not a top 10 player in the league right now. And the "I'm not a GM so I can't say" is equally true in saying he is or isn't a top 10 player then but it just avoids discussion when all we do is defer to authority.

[sa226]

I still think they should try to move Monahan and Lucic.

[timbit]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Not really when the guy prefaces it with "in today's NHL". Ovechkin just scored 50, again, in today's NHL.

If he wants to go with most value, then players like Lindholm who actually have a contract (that is amazing) probably enter the equation. Plus all the ELC players and long-term contracts.

37 year old physical 50 goal scorers are not as valuable or important as 24 year old physical 100 point players “in today’s NHL“, IMO.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by sa226

I still think they should try to move Monahan and Lucic.

What's the point? Don't need the cap now

[OptimalTates]

When someone says so-and-so is a top 10 to top 15 player in the league or anything, I don't know why you guys would bring up contract situations. That doesn't affect their on ice abilities.

There's clearly at least 10 players ahead of him when it comes to actually lacing up the skates and playing the game, there's a second tier of players who could all make cases to be in those next 5 or so spots, Tkachuk included, but no room to argue top 10. If so, post your top 10s.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

I'm not spinning anything. One guy said he was a top 10 player in today's NHL, and I listed 10 players better, at least based on my opinion but backed up by general consensus. So which of the top 10 do you not have?

Saying something is "backed up by general consensus" does not make it actually backed up by general consensus.

If you can show the "general consensus" that might support your argument.

I don't know who or what Andy & Rono are, but they have him as one of the best wingers, if not one of the best players, in the NHL.

JFresh has him in the 97% percentile, meaning, assuming 20 players per team (12-6-2) and 32 teams for 640 players, is in the top 19 players by that metric. Top 2% makes him one of the top 12 players, so by this metric he is in the 12-19th range.

My math includes goalies. If we take them out, as I do not know if they are included in the same WAR%, the range closes to 11-17th best player (below 2% and above 3%).

So ya, based upon 2021-22, he could definitely be in the top 10 players in the league, depending upon what you are looking for.

Edit: Bill Simmons used to do a ranking of NBA players, and he based it upon a one-for-one trade, right now, who would you take.

Using your list, taking into account, age, injury history, and what they still have to produce, in building a team:

I would trade Tkachuk for Makar, McDavid, MacKinnon, Matthews, Hedman, and Barkov one for one. Meaning, I have Chucky, and give him up for the other player.

I would not trade Tkachuk for Kucherov (injury history) or Crosby (2-3 years left).

I am not sure about Draisaitl (could be anti-Oiler bias, but I just don't like him as a player), or Johnny (age and intangibles).
So, using your list, I have him top ten, on a current NHL, going forward basis.

The analysis is likely different if I am in a one-year, win now and don't care about anything else situation.

[boogerz]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

"Spin it anyway you want" lol.

Spit it anyway you want and Tkachuk is not a top 10 player in the league right now. And the "I'm not a GM so I can't say" is equally true in saying he is or isn't a top 10 player then but it just avoids discussion when all we do is defer to authority.

Have you looked at his AST voting record? Tkachuk garnered 44% of the first team RW AST votes this past season. The only player with more was Marner with 46%. Third place was Rantanen with 7%.

He might not be a a top 10 player in the NHL, but he's top 10 winger entering his prime and he can play both wings (on top of everything else).

Anything less than an Eichel-esque return for Tkachuk is failure by BT

[Psytic]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

What does a contract have to do with being the best player?

The guy said he was a top 10 player in the NHL. Not that he had top 10 value in trades.

He said this "At the end of the day, Tkachuk is a top-10 to top-15 player in today’s NHL. He’s going to get a good return."

He's talking about it in terms of the value of the return. Anyways I dont really care. This board has a tendency to devolve into semantics and go on for pages. He's a good player and we want a good return. The nitpicking on this board sometimes....