Canadian Federal Politics Thread v5

[shotinthebacklund]

more gaslighting

[PepsiFree]

Point proven

[shotinthebacklund]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Point proven

- ESG stands for environmental, social, and governance. ESG investing refers to how companies score on these responsibility metrics and standards for potential investments. Environmental criteria gauge how a company safeguards the environment. Social criteria examine how it manages relationships with employees, suppliers, customers, and communities. Governance measures a company’s leadership, executive pay, audits, internal controls, and shareholder rights.



Argue what ever you want, you just spoke exactly about the principles around ESG. Im glad you took the point I was proving.



Maybe fire up that google machine and look into for yourself. That's if of course you dont know all about it already. Have a look at ESG investing

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Firebot

Case and point.



Also on the Liberal slant, from the 2010 article as it's under a paywall

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...rticle4352832/

OK, looks incriminating, but then it doesn't explain why they polled similarly to other pollsters from Sep 2023 on(and perhaps before, didn't look). If this was his goal through manipulated poll results, why take that time off?



Anyway, it's not super important at this point because we aren't going into an election yet and these numbers are bound to be all over the place as things change.

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by shotinthebacklund

- ESG stands for environmental, social, and governance. ESG investing refers to how companies score on these responsibility metrics and standards for potential investments. Environmental criteria gauge how a company safeguards the environment. Social criteria examine how it manages relationships with employees, suppliers, customers, and communities. Governance measures a company’s leadership, executive pay, audits, internal controls, and shareholder rights.



Argue what ever you want, you just spoke exactly about the principles around ESG. Im glad you took the point I was proving.



Maybe fire up that google machine and look into for yourself. That's if of course you dont know all about it already. Have a look at ESG investing

I agree with you that Carney is looking to implement an ESG strategy on our trading partners. But how do those relate to the Communist Party of China?? These are principals for investing and evaluating market based companies on items that go beyond pure financial numbers. I don't see how a market based evaluation equates to communism?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by shotinthebacklund

- ESG stands for environmental, social, and governance. ESG investing refers to how companies score on these responsibility metrics and standards for potential investments. Environmental criteria gauge how a company safeguards the environment. Social criteria examine how it manages relationships with employees, suppliers, customers, and communities. Governance measures a company’s leadership, executive pay, audits, internal controls, and shareholder rights.



Argue what ever you want, you just spoke exactly about the principles around ESG. Im glad you took the point I was proving.



Maybe fire up that google machine and look into for yourself. That's if of course you dont know all about it already. Have a look at ESG investing

Which at best is loosely related on some points to what I’m describing, and has nothing to do with communist China.

Again, it’s not hard to have a more thoughtful understanding of things. I didn’t peg you for someone who would react so defensively to the idea of not supporting countries like Saudi Arabia and India.

[shotinthebacklund]

Originally Posted by belsarius

I agree with you that Carney is looking to implement an ESG strategy on our trading partners. But how do those relate to the Communist Party of China?? These are principals for investing and evaluating market based companies on items that go beyond pure financial numbers. I don't see how a market based evaluation equates to communism?

China has been running a ESG for a long time. However, the added twist they run is the governance part. If they play along nice with the CPP you get endorsed and promoted, Have differing views? well you get the axe.

ESG is considered on the political spectrum as far left, drawing many principles from marxism. Carney started talking about running as a centrist, and yet, his released platform is already pushing the party further left. I thought we all agreed here we want to see Canada come closer to the Centre.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by shotinthebacklund

China has been running a ESG for a long time. However, the added twist they run is the governance part. If they play along nice with the CPP you get endorsed and promoted, Have differing views? well you get the axe.

ESG is considered on the political spectrum as far left, drawing many principles from marxism.

Just a general observation.
Once you refer to it as "a ESG", you've pretty much signaled to everyone that you have no idea what ESG actually means.

And to suggest that China is somehow leading the way on a principle that emphasizes environmental factors, is really something....

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Bring_Back_Shantz

Just a general observation.
Once you refer to it as "a ESG", you've pretty much signaled to everyone that you have no idea what ESG actually means.

He googled it, though.

Communists! Marxism!

Something something.

[shotinthebacklund]

Originally Posted by Bring_Back_Shantz

Just a general observation.
Once you refer to it as "a ESG", you've pretty much signaled to everyone that you have no idea what ESG actually means.

What would you prefer to call it? We can call it what ever you want, thats still what it is.

[shotinthebacklund]

Originally Posted by Bring_Back_Shantz

Just a general observation.
Once you refer to it as "a ESG", you've pretty much signaled to everyone that you have no idea what ESG actually means.

And to suggest that China is somehow leading the way on a principle that emphasizes environmental factors, is really something....

I mean... you are welcome to look it up yourself.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Azure

https://kitchener.citynews.ca/2025/0...en-incentives/

Finally the financial incentives are being added in, which is the proper way to reduce emissions because it creates actionable policies instead of stupid taxes with no plan in place.

But isn't it great that Carney is already blaming everyone else for the stupid Liberal plan?

"Yeah our plan was great, but because Canadians hate it we'll have to change it, but its not our fault, its the Conservatives fault for lying about it!"

What a bloody joke.

The Carbon tax method is far less invasive. The incentive method is the government picking winners and losers and interfering in the market. Pricing externalities and letting the market decide was far better. It’s hustling not politically palatable. See the liberals bailing out heating oil when the tax was doing exactly what it should.

This system using Industrial emitter money to make small changes locally is poor from a dollars per tonne removed standpoint.

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by shotinthebacklund

What would you prefer to call it? We can call it what ever you want, thats still what it is.

Ah, no. You can call it whatever you want, that's still NOT what it is.

I would ask you to point out a single policy of the Chinese government that could be considered an analog of ESG principles, you know those principles that are meant to guide companies/corporations, not freaking governments. but I suspect you'll just tell me it's marxism.....


The whole point of ESG policies is that it is above and beyond what is required by a government, or guidance to make decisions that may not make the most direct financial sense in an effort to achieve various goals (such as minimizing environmental impact).

Governments (especially the Chinese government) are pretty much by definition unable to have an ESG policy, because whatever they do is now the law, and therefore not above and beyond the law/government policy....


So yeah, go ahead and explain to me how the Chinese government "has a ESG", and what exactly that has to do with marxism.

Oh, also I'd love to hear exactly how China does their "a ESG" differently by adding Governance... you know the G in "ESG".

I guess every company that claims to have an ESG policy really just has "a ES".

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Firebot

I mean he pretty much vowed to use everything he has at his disposal to make sure Poilievre never gets elected PM.

What kind of poll releases numbers 4 times in 2 weeks (2 in 2 days?)

EKOS January 29, 2025 [1] 33.9 32.0 18.0 7.6 3.4 4.9 0.2 ±3.1 pp 1,025 telephone/online 1.9
EKOS January 27, 2025 [1] 35.7 32.7 13.1 7.1 4.7 4.9 1.9 ±2.6 pp 1,448 IVR 3.0
Leger January 26, 2025 [2] 43 25 16 9 2 4 1 ±2.51 pp 1,527 online 18
Abacus Data January 26, 2025 [3] 43 22 18 9 3 5 0 ±2.2 pp 2,205 online 21
Nanos Research January 24, 2025 [4] 42.0 24.9 18.0 7.4 1.8 5.6 — ±3.1 pp 1,023 (1/4) telephone (rolling) 17.1
EKOS January 21, 2025 [5] 38.5 31.7 14.2 7.1 3.1 3.2 2.1 ±3.1 pp 1,018 IVR 6.8
Nanos Research January 17, 2025 [6] 45.2 20.8 18.7 7.7 1.9 5.3 — ±3.1 pp 1,040 (1/4) telephone (rolling) 24.4
EKOS January 16, 2025 [7] 39.0 28.0 17.4 7.4 2.5 4.5 1.2 ±3.0 pp 1,036 IVR 11.0

A rolling poll does. It allows us to see trends that are happening as they happen. I wouldn’t look at the raw percentages and instead the deltas from
Their prior polling.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

Incentives are nice and I love when the government gives me money but most incentive programs really only help well-to-do people who can afford to do retrofits or purchase electric cars and whatever else. These types of incentive programs are really just an offshoot of trickle down economics where they think that giving breaks to wealthy people will help the environment overall. Taxes from the poor and middle class are just going to subsidize purchases made by people above them financially.

The point being that encouraging people to buy a heat pump by actually rebating or giving a grant for the heat pump is the proper way of reducing emissions.

Most families cannot afford $15k changes, and therefore the carbon tax that punishes a family for having a natural gas furnace but doesn't give that same family a way to get a heat pump or electric furnance is the dumbest frickin' idea that was ever conceived wrapped up in the guise of Liberal tax everything to crap policy.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by shotinthebacklund

So Carney's plan is a carbon tax...where large emitters pay, then charge everyone else anyway. But LOOK, THEY CAN BUY MYTHICAL GREEN CREDITS! that will solve the world problems.
Lets see those green slush fund documents and who profiteered off of them first, then lets talk about a carbon tax of a new shiny colour.

and all the Liberal apologists are happy walking off the edge of the cliff thinking Carney is their savior.

Smoke and mirrors wrapped up in a giant turd.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by shotinthebacklund

You are 100% to a tee describing economic ,Social, Governance. Now go one step further and you have the Communist party of China.

Friedman supported the pricing of externalities to fight pollution. The Carbon tax with rebate is straight Chicago school economics.

[shotinthebacklund]

Originally Posted by Bring_Back_Shantz

Ah, no. You can call it whatever you want, that's still NOT what it is.

I would ask you to point out a single policy of the Chinese government that could be considered an analog of ESG principles, you know those principles that are meant to guide companies/corporations, not freaking governments. but I suspect you'll just tell me it's marxism.....


The whole point of ESG policies is that it is above and beyond what is required by a government, or guidance to make decisions that may not make the most direct financial sense in an effort to achieve various goals (such as minimizing environmental impact).

Governments (especially the Chinese government) are pretty much by definition unable to have an ESG policy, because whatever they do is now the law, and therefore not above and beyond the law/government policy....


So yeah, go ahead and explain to me how the Chinese government "has a ESG", and what exactly that has to do with marxism.

Oh, also I'd love to hear exactly how China does their "a ESG" differently by adding Governance... you know the G in "ESG".

I guess every company that claims to have an ESG policy really just has "a ES".

You are looking at ESG thru the lens of Corporation. I agree. Now take the exact same principles and apply them to the lens of Government controlling the factors of what they consider the pillars of ESG. Which, Carney speaks directly about doing in his book Values.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Azure

and all the Liberal apologists are happy walking off the edge of the cliff thinking Carney is their savior.

Smoke and mirrors wrapped up in a giant turd.

It’s funny because you just said incentives are the right way to do it and then turned around to try to criticize the person who proposes switching to incentives.

And for the love of god, if you’re going to keep going for dumb soundbites, make them make sense. What you were looking for is “a giant turd wrapped up in smoke and mirrors.”

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by Azure

and all the Liberal apologists are happy walking off the edge of the cliff thinking Carney is their savior.

Smoke and mirrors wrapped up in a giant turd.

Holy crap you are sooo triggered. hahahaha