You Know What Really Grinds My Gears? Now with 3x more gears...

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

cost of air travel in canada. jesus christ.

I'm flying from Dublin to London one way and its like.. 18 euros. Flights in 2 weeks

On a larf I had a look to see what the cost of Sydney to Montreal would cost in January. 4 months away. 400 dollars one way.

Originally Posted by Locke

I've 'Ground my Gears' on this a million times.

The cost of Air Travel within Canada is a travesty.

Why is it so significantly cheaper to travel abroad than within? And 'Distance' is a BS answer that I'll not accept. Its cheaper for me to fly to London (the good one) than Toronto.

Sort it out Canada. And its not because you're paying your pilots too much, I'm not having that answer either.

Look at the fare breakdown. Taxes and fees make up a huge portion of the ticket, airlines have no control over that.

And your 18 Euro flight? Add on all the extras and it's gonna be more than that.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Look at the fare breakdown. Taxes and fees make up a huge portion of the ticket, airlines have no control over that.

Whos blaming the airlines specifically? Everyone ####ing sucks involved

Originally Posted by Lubicon

And your 18 Euro flight? Add on all the extras and it's gonna be more than that.

25 Euro with my seat selection. Taxes and fees in. That 400 Canadian above? Would be 440 or 450 with seat selection.

Are you an Air Canada stock holder or something?

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Look at the fare breakdown. Taxes and fees make up a huge portion of the ticket, airlines have no control over that.

And your 18 Euro flight? Add on all the extras and it's gonna be more than that.

It's still no comparison. Toronto to Montreal is about the same distance as Dublin to London. The cheapest most bare-bones Air Canada equivalent to Ryanair costs $216 excluding taxes and fees.

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

Whos blaming the airlines specifically? Everyone ####ing sucks involved

25 Euro with my seat selection. Taxes and fees in. That 400 Canadian above? Would be 440 or 450 with seat selection.

Originally Posted by opendoor

It's still no comparison. Toronto to Montreal is about the same distance as Dublin to London. The cheapest most bare-bones Air Canada equivalent to Ryanair costs $216 excluding taxes and fees.

Fair points and I wont argue that. And yes it does suck, I'm just saying it's not an apples to apples comparison. We have so many differences here compared to the European model.

Dublin to London equivalent here would be Montreal Mirabal - Hamilton or Kitchener. That's another difference, the ULCC's don't serve the major airports a lot. And we expect our airlines to interline with others, the ULCC's don't do that. And boy do they shoehorn you into your seat, not a problem for a short flight but anything over 90 minutes would be agony.

I've flown them. Absolutely fantastic for a short point to point flight even if you pony up for seats, bags etc. Terrible for longer flights or if you need to connect.

[PepsiFree]

The Ryanair kind of airlines are basically notorious for failing in Canada.

You want those airlines? Fly them.

[habernac]

Originally Posted by GGG

If you asked RV owners do you need your RV to go camping I suspect the answer is 50-80% would say yes.

If you ask Truck owners if they need their truck 90+% will say yes.

I base the RV one on the number of people who when discussing camping without promoting say. I wouldn’t go if I still had to use my tent or My wife would never go if we had to use a tent. You might wonder how often this coversation comes up? It pretty much happens any time you talk about a camping road trip and someone finds out you use a tent.

The cause is mainly people being unable to define needs and wants as we have seen in this thread around the truck/SUV question.

I don’t want to sleep on the ground anymore. I’m over 50. I’ll tow my sweet trailer and comfy mattress out to my favourite campsites with my big V8 Sierra and won’t feel an ounce of guilt about it.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

The Ryanair kind of airlines are basically notorious for failing in Canada.

You want those airlines? Fly them.

Yeah, true, but all airlines in Canada seem to struggle. It really is a bit confusing when you look at how things are done internationally and then how Canadas pricing is. Like how are our costs THAT much higher? It can’t all be taxes and fees? But if it wasn’t, wouldn’t the airlines be massively profitable compared to Euro counterparts? All planes I’ve been on in the last little while have been jam packed.

But the airlines still struggle here. Air Canada pulling out of Saskatchewan and massively drawing down western flying. Just weird, I don’t get it. Would love with somebody with expertise in the airline industry to chime in.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Yeah, true, but all airlines in Canada seem to struggle. It really is a bit confusing when you look at how things are done internationally and then how Canadas pricing is. Like how are our costs THAT much higher? It can’t all be taxes and fees? But if it wasn’t, wouldn’t the airlines be massively profitable compared to Euro counterparts? All planes I’ve been on in the last little while have been jam packed.

But the airlines still struggle here. Air Canada pulling out of Saskatchewan and massively drawing down western flying. Just weird, I don’t get it. Would love with somebody with expertise in the airline industry to chime in.

Small population and big landmass. Europe has a pretty large population and lots of places you can check out over a weekend. I’m not going to fly to Edmonton because there is a 40 dollar round trip flight.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

The Ryanair kind of airlines are basically notorious for failing in Canada.

You want those airlines? Fly them.

Originally Posted by Bonded

Small population and big landmass. Europe has a pretty large population and lots of places you can check out over a weekend. I’m not going to fly to Edmonton because there is a 40 dollar round trip flight.

This is true to some extent but it is also because of government intervention and regulations. LCC/ULCC have some degree of success in the US with Southwest and Sprint and others. There really is no reason, other than protecting our legacy airline, for not having a NAFTA type environment for airlines where low cost options can freely fly around the continent.

The introduction of LCC/ULLC hasn't eliminated legacy carriers such as KLM/BA/Air France so airlines such as Air Canada/WestJet and US carriers like Delta/United should be fine.

[timun]

#### you Duolingo #### ####ing app.

[ResAlien]

Originally Posted by timun

#### you Duolingo #### ####ing app.

En francais s'il vous plait

[PaperBagger'14]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

En francais s'il vous plait

Donde esta la biblioteca

[Barnet Flame]

Originally Posted by Locke

I've 'Ground my Gears' on this a million times.

The cost of Air Travel within Canada is a travesty.

Why is it so significantly cheaper to travel abroad than within? And 'Distance' is a BS answer that I'll not accept. Its cheaper for me to fly to London (the good one) than Toronto.

Sort it out Canada. And its not because you're paying your pilots too much, I'm not having that answer either.

It’s cheaper for me to fly Air Canada to LA via Calgary than it is to fly to Calgary. That has ground my gears for years.

[Barnet Flame]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

Look at the fare breakdown. Taxes and fees make up a huge portion of the ticket, airlines have no control over that.

And your 18 Euro flight? Add on all the extras and it's gonna be more than that.

€14 for me including all the luggage I needed.

I DGAF what seat I’m allocated on a one hour flight. As it happened, I was allocated an aisle seat in row 29. There were steps at the rear, so I was off the plane in less than a minute after the doors opened.

[CliffFletcher]

Air travel in Canada expensive? It’s never been cheaper. Look up how much it cost in inflation-adjusted dollars to fly Calgary-Toronto in the 90s.

We live in a golden age of cheap air travel. But with carbon pricing and the growing backlash against over-tourism, it probably isn’t going to last much longer. Enjoy your incredibly cheap air travel while you can.

[BigThief]

Never been cheaper still doesn't mean cheap lol. Air Travel in Canada is insanely expensive compared to the rest of the world.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Air travel in Canada expensive? It’s never been cheaper. Look up how much it cost in inflation-adjusted dollars to fly Calgary-Toronto in the 90s.

We live in a golden age of cheap air travel. But with carbon pricing and the growing backlash against over-tourism, it probably isn’t going to last much longer. Enjoy your incredibly cheap air travel while you can.

But shouldn’t we compare cost to the world, we we live in, and not 40 years ago, which it isn’t?

Relative to the world, yes it’s very expensive. And how do we square the circle that is distance? Air travel in Canada is going a far distance, but Calgary to anywhere in Canada last I checked is still shorter than Calgary to London England and it’s cheaper to fly there in many instances. So the issue then must be just supply and demand, okay, but all these planes are jam packed. So, what gives. Something is weird about airline pricing in Canada. Probably has to do with lack of competition. Canada loves its oligopolies so I’m assuming there’s probably some crazy high barriers to entry from a regulatory / getting going standpoint. I’m just curious with the economics because I don’t get how Europe flies people for 18 Euro and Canada requires $400. Like- somethings truly weird. I don’t buy the distance thing.

[DownInFlames]

Jesus. Half of the people in this province are living paycheque to paycheque and you’re complaining about paying too much for magical sky carriage rides.

Europe gets to fly cheap? You know what they don’t get to do cheap? Drive gigantic vehicles and live in gigantic houses and eat gigantic meals.

And Cliff is right about over-tourism backlash. Sure, visiting other cultures and having amazing experiences is great, but hauling your family thousands of kms to sit on a beach is ######ed. Relax at home, or visit a local day spa. Camp in your backyard. Or don’t. I’m sure you’ll find a way to justify your travel like you justify your Canyoneros. I’m going for a walk.

[CliffFletcher]

It’s about density and economies of scale.

Region A: Densely populated with dozens of major cities clustered within a 500 km radius of one another; includes many of the most popular travel destinations in the world; 35,000 commercial flights per day; 7 of the 50 busiest airports in the world.

Region B: A half-dozen major cities stretched out in a 5,000 km line; none of them global travel meccas; 1,500 commercial flights per day; 1 of the 50 busiest airports in the world.

Is it really surprising that it’s cheaper to deliver mass air travel to region A?

[BigThief]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Is it really surprising that it’s cheaper to deliver mass air travel to region A?

No, but don't pretend that it's inexpensive because it's slightly less expensive than 20 years ago.