Adam Fox & the NCAA "Loophole?"

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by InternationalVillager

NY isn't lame and overrated. It's our bank accounts shortcomings which does not allows us to take full advantage of the NY experience.

When you're wealthy and are taking a helicopter in to work from the Hamptons every day and have a weekend home in Miami which you go to in a private jet, NY is a pretty freaking sweet place to live.

I know this because I have friends who do this. One of them took a helicopter on a Sunday from Hamptons to NYC. Paid $10K. Just to party for 2-3 hours.

That's neat for your friends.

Well helicopter rides would be fun, but it stops there.

I personally am not a fan of crowds and high population density, and having grown up around wealth I actually don't understand the appeal of going out and flaunting it either.

So, different perspective I guess.

We can agree that Fox sucks butts though.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by Sidney Crosby's Hat

Really makes you realize how much money Tony DeAngelo cost himself by being an idiot.

I might argue the Rangers are idiots for giving DeAngelo that contract. There is not a lot of proof that he was ever going to live up to it let alone earn another one like it. It's a good look for the Rangers. Team can have any player they want yet can't seem to much sweet FA with that advantage.

As for Fox...their playoff lives were on the line tonight...win and they have a shot. They got worked by the previously struggling Islanders. Screw you tampy mctamperson Rangers. I hope they trade Fox to Buffalo as part of a package for Eichel, and Fox wants to quit hockey two years from now. Hopefully someone kicked Tom Erixon in the nads today too for good measure.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

I might argue the Rangers are idiots for giving DeAngelo that contract. There is not a lot of proof that he was ever going to live up to it let alone earn another one like it.

Garbage take. He earned that contract.

The fact that he is a complete asshat doesn't take away from his play.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

Garbage take. He earned that contract.

The fact that he is a complete asshat doesn't take away from his play.

He had character issues before getting the contract. They should have known who he was as well as any other team in the league. There are many talented players who lousy personalities or work ethics that stop them from using that talent and become detrimetal to career earnings.

He only had the one really good season that got him that contract, and two months later the team is trying to get rid of him. There isn't a single team in the NHL that will take him on. Who the player is does count when it comes to giving out contracts.

[DSIM420]

The other option is if you are in a playing in the NCAA or have committed to a NCAA program, you are ineligible to be drafted. If you are in college and you want to play in the NHL you have to declare your eligibility for the NHL draft and forfeit your college eligibility and you would only be able able to play in a pro league. I believe this already exists for the NFL and NBA. This model should be adapted by the league.

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by DSIM420

The other option is if you are in a playing in the NCAA or have committed to a NCAA program, you are ineligible to be drafted. If you are in college and you want to play in the NHL you have to declare your eligibility for the NHL draft and forfeit your college eligibility and you would only be able able to play in a pro league. I believe this already exists for the NFL and NBA. This model should be adapted by the league.

well, the answer is simple; eliminate the 18 yr old draft if this is a concern.

The NBA and NFL do not allow 18 year olds to be drafted (the NBA you need to be 1 year out of HS and the NFL you need to be 3 years out of HS)

MLB, you can draft HS, but you have a very short signing window from the draft pick to signing him. Once the player chooses go to college, the team loses its draft rights (ie forfeits with no compensation) and they go back into the draft and can be selected by any team in MLB in the college draft.

the NHL, you can get drafted as an 18 year old whether you want to or not I believe...there is no opt in, though there might be an opt out option (I am not 100% sure on that)

[cannon7]

Could have had Pavel Buchnevich for free...

[Inglewood Jack]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1387467283283447813

[Jiri Hrdina]

Geez did anyone else know that Jacob Chychrun leads Dmen with 16 goals?!?!?!?

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Geez did anyone else know that Jacob Chychrun leads Dmen with 16 goals?!?!?!?

No offense to AZ fans, but its a bit of a black hole for hockey buzz.

16 goals...ugh... not bad for the 16th OA pick

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Geez did anyone else know that Jacob Chychrun leads Dmen with 16 goals?!?!?!?

Sure did, but he'll never get any hype. Top 15 D in the league and climbing. I think they're going to try and move OEL again, because Chychrun is their #1LD.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Geez did anyone else know that Jacob Chychrun leads Dmen with 16 goals?!?!?!?

I did, but only because the Coyotes game was on the radio after golf on Wednesday.

[Beatle17]

The college rule is the same as any other rule. If a player is drafted out of junior and doesn't want to sign before 2 years he goes back in the draft and the new team has his rights for 2 more years. The junior guy can just hold out on signing both times and is a free agent in 4 years, same as a college kid.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Beatle17

The college rule is the same as any other rule. If a player is drafted out of junior and doesn't want to sign before 2 years he goes back in the draft and the new team has his rights for 2 more years. The junior guy can just hold out on signing both times and is a free agent in 4 years, same as a college kid.

Who is the last junior player to do that?

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by dino7c

lol I think you are taking his sucks butts comment too seriously

Yup lol.

Being personally invested in NYC as an Albertan to the point of being mildly offended by comments jokingly slighting NYC is next level strange i must say.

[TheChief]

Spoiler!

Adam fox is a shame. We were all hyped for him, its sad that I cant be happy to see him turn out so good. Another one that shouldn't have got away but really what could we have done... The NHL is a privilege to play in not a right. I dont think any player especially a 3rd round pick should be able to decide his destination. These players should be team controlled for their first 4 years pro. If you dont wanna play for the flames....have fun in Russia (or sitting out)! NHL would have to back the teams up.


I would even be in favor of giving up a year or two of the RFA years to have these player controlled so we dont have a Adam Fox situation. Oilers lost a good D too in John Marino, would easily be on their top pairing right now and cost controlled because he didn't want to play for them.

[Beatle17]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Who is the last junior player to do that?

Not sure but both Matthew Lombardi and Jarrett Stoll reentered the draft one time. Just saying that it is an option open to all players no matter where they play. If the NCAA guys want to play 4 years in college and choose where to play is an option. Why they decide to stay 4 years for this option is there own personal choice to give up a few million dollars up front, because even when they sign as college free agents they still get rookie contracts.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by Beatle17

Not sure but both Matthew Lombardi and Jarrett Stoll reentered the draft one time. Just saying that it is an option open to all players no matter where they play. If the NCAA guys want to play 4 years in college and choose where to play is an option. Why they decide to stay 4 years for this option is there own personal choice to give up a few million dollars up front, because even when they sign as college free agents they still get rookie contracts.

College players taking advantage of the loophole I have no problem with since they are completely following the rules.

But I do think that it's a loophole that the NHL should look into addressing so this doesn't continue to happen for players that become blue chip prospects in college, and as a result want to dictate wherever they go once they are done school. The teams should have the opportunity to at least retain their rights for one year post declaration of turning pro. If they do not sign, then they should reenter the draft so then a top pick team has the opportunity to pick and sign them.

I don't believe that NCAA players that were drafted before/while in school should be UFAs right out of school unless they are of older age.

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by Beatle17

Not sure but both Matthew Lombardi and Jarrett Stoll reentered the draft one time. Just saying that it is an option open to all players no matter where they play. If the NCAA guys want to play 4 years in college and choose where to play is an option. Why they decide to stay 4 years for this option is there own personal choice to give up a few million dollars up front, because even when they sign as college free agents they still get rookie contracts.

totally agree... also don't forget Craig Anderson, who the Flames drafted, didn't sign and went back in the draft in 91

Originally Posted by Joborule

College players taking advantage of the loophole I have no problem with since they are completely following the rules.

But I do think that it's a loophole that the NHL should look into addressing so this doesn't continue to happen for players that become blue chip prospects in college, and as a result want to dictate wherever they go once they are done school. The teams should have the opportunity to at least retain their rights for one year post declaration of turning pro. If they do not sign, then they should reenter the draft so then a top pick team has the opportunity to pick and sign them.

I don't believe that NCAA players that were drafted before/while in school should be UFAs right out of school unless they are of older age.

This isn't that different from any player though. The nhl draft rules explicitly say that players unsigned after 4 years of college are UFA. Same with European players (sans KHL) are also UFAs after 4 years. Whereas CHL follows a 2 + 2 model before UFA status.

in fact, the only league where players rights can be held in perpetuity is the KHL, which has no transfer agreement with the NHL.

Its not an NHL thing; its an NHLPA thing. Owners would like nothing better for UFA age to go back up to 31 and have players rights owned wholly until that time.

Again, just change the age limit to match the NBA/NFL or treat the HS draft like the MLB. Problem solved.

Of all the players ever drafted in the history of the current system, we have Hayes, Vesey, Wheeler, Kerfoot, Shultz as the notable college players that spurned the system and actually graduated.

Wheeler and Fox both only played 3 years and have a year of eligibility left - so they used the threat of playing all 4 years to get their wishes.

The Flames got burned - not sure if that's on the rules or on the Flames for not getting an idea of what Fox's true intentions were - but it's only an issue because Fox is looking great...if he turned into another Erixon, no one would really care, at least they shouldn't based on the history of this actually happening

I would agree that re-entering the draft after 4 years is good solution - this is what MLB does for kids that get drafted out of HS but elect to go to college. Again, its an NHLPA thing that they would need to agree to

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by Beatle17

Not sure but both Matthew Lombardi and Jarrett Stoll reentered the draft one time. Just saying that it is an option open to all players no matter where they play. If the NCAA guys want to play 4 years in college and choose where to play is an option. Why they decide to stay 4 years for this option is there own personal choice to give up a few million dollars up front, because even when they sign as college free agents they still get rookie contracts.

I know I've brought this up before, but the reason you can't compare them is there's more incentive to do it for College players. For the most part, they love the college lifestyle. They get to stay there longer, finish their education, and the cherry on top is they're a UFA at the end of it all.

Whereas the CHL sucks to play in, players wanna get out of there and play pro asap. If they want to be a UFA, they truly have to sacrifice for it