Kal Tire won't give me my car keys back?!?!

[sworkhard]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Replacing just one tire is also dangerous from a traction perspective. One tire with better grip than the others will cause you to spin out, guaranteed.

Replacing just one tire with a newer copy of what you have, assuming the others still have good tread, will not even be noticeable. It's only dangerous if you have substantially different tires with substantially different grip levels in various conditions. Even then, your more at risk of a spinout if you replace both tires on an axle then one as the grip difference between axles is now doubled vs just replacing one. This is why it's dangerous to have winter tires on just one axle, or summer tires on just one axle, when you get near the edge of grip, if your in conditions that favor the grip the front tires provide, your vehicle will spin out. Vice versa isn't as dangerous as the car will just go straight, which is generally considered the safer option at limits of grip, but since you can't really predict which set will have more grip in any particular condition, it's best to at least have similar tires on all 4 wheels.

[GP_Matt]

Since this is turning into the tire advice thread.
I have one tire that was destroyed (sidewall) on a FWD vehicle last fall. Put the winters on a week early and stored three tires plus wheel in the garage.

Now that spring is approaching (it is coming soon right?) I need to sort out new tires. The three survivors have at least 50% or more tread on them. The tire I have is no longer manufactured though so the tire shop suggested that I replace all four tires or they could special order 2 from someone who still has stock but the cost was pretty steep for just two.

Do I need four new tires?

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

"More than 50%" still sounds pretty worn. I'd suggest getting two.

[GP_Matt]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

"More than 50%" still sounds pretty worn. I'd suggest getting two.

Try to get the shop to match the original two as close as possible?

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by GP_Matt

Since this is turning into the tire advice thread.
I have one tire that was destroyed (sidewall) on a FWD vehicle last fall. Put the winters on a week early and stored three tires plus wheel in the garage.

Now that spring is approaching (it is coming soon right?) I need to sort out new tires. The three survivors have at least 50% or more tread on them. The tire I have is no longer manufactured though so the tire shop suggested that I replace all four tires or they could special order 2 from someone who still has stock but the cost was pretty steep for just two.

Do I need four new tires?

No, I'd just grab 2 if you are cheap like me. Put the new ones on the front. They don't need to be matching tires to the rear, just size. Or look on Kijiji for 2 used, and get 4 new ones when needed.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

OP, Im guessing there was some merit in kal tire urging you to change all 4 tires, regardless of the methods they used. For your safety and others, I would strongly recommend you do your best to get all 4 done- the roads are horrendous right now.

I think if the method they used to get the OP to buy 4 new tires was to wreck one and then impound his car until he caved I'd have an opinion about whether that had merit (and whether I'd ever go to that/any Kal Tire...)

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

If it's practical. Honestly, for summer tires, it hardly matters. I ran different tread patterns on my 370z for years, front and rear.

[squiggs96]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

No, I'd just grab 2 if you are cheap like me. Put the new ones on the front. They don't need to be matching tires to the rear, just size. Or look on Kijiji for 2 used, and get 4 new ones when needed.

If you are buying two new tires they should go on the back, regardless of whether your car is front or rear wheel drive. The best way I’ve had it explained to me was think of a dog running through a house and it tries to make a turn on a linoleum kitchen floor. The rear legs kick out and go flying. It’s hilarious. If the dog had better grip on his rear paws he wouldn’t slide as much.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by squiggs96

If you are buying two new tires they should go on the back, regardless of whether your car is front or rear wheel drive. The best way I’ve had it explained to me was think of a dog running through a house and it tries to make a turn on a linoleum kitchen floor. The rear legs kick out and go flying. It’s hilarious. If the dog had better grip on his rear paws he wouldn’t slide as much.

In winter yes, in summer I don’t think it matters

[Fuzz]

Ya, it kinda depends if you want grip for going or stopping. It isn't going to make a whole lot of difference with summers, that advice is more for people who think they can get away with 2 winters on the drive wheels and 2 "all seasons" on the rear. That's when you get stopping pendulum problems. I recommended new on the front becuase the drive tires wear quicker, so they'd end up more closely matching the rears eventually.

[81MC]

There is no ‘depends’ with new tire placement.
New tires go in the back, end of story. Every single tire manufacturer and maintenance authority says this. Traction loss is more controllable and easier to predict on the front.
Under no circumstance should worn tires be placed on the rear axle while new ones are put on front.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by 81MC

There is no ‘depends’ with new tire placement.
New tires go in the back, end of story. Every single tire manufacturer and maintenance authority says this. Traction loss is more controllable and easier to predict on the front.
Under no circumstance should worn tires be placed on the rear axle while new ones are put on front.

This.

It's physics and the way the braking systems work. You want the better tires on the back.

Just think about slamming on your brakes with bad tires on the back and good ones in the front. The front will slow down but the back will want to keep that forward momentum going. The result is a spin.

Drive wheels don't matter. If you can't get going, then you probably don't want too because once you start moving braking will be an adventure

[Fuzz]

Interesting, I guess the recommendations have changed over the years with more rigorous testing. I found this explanation, which is why we used to do it that way back in the '90's.

The problem with this is that since most cars wear their front tires faster, you will never be able to rotate them properly, will never get the best wear out of you tires, and if you have a mileage warranty, it will be voided because you haven't rotated your tires. (As a side note, the requirements for mileage warranties are not too easy to meet, so trying to do so may not even be worthwhile, (see our "Mileage Warranties" page.))
To elaborate: The old school of thought, (which we subscribed to before Continental's demostration) was that as your tires wear, the front tires normally wear faster. Also, front tires tend to wear more on the edges, and rear tires more in the middle. Since these things are true, not only would wear be distibuted more evenly on all four tires, but all four tires would wear more evenly across the tread face, and therefore wear longer. This is why all manufacturers require regular rotations for any mileage warranty.
So, if in the interest of safety, you decide to keep the better tires on the back, you will probaly only rotate them if you're buying two tires. Since most vehicles wear their front tires faster, within a few thousand miles, the front tires will be more worn than the backs so you won't want to rotate them then. Then, since the front tires can wear out much faster than the rears, you will want to probably want to replace only the fronts, and then move the rear tires to the front. Sadly, you can't have it both ways, unless your vehicle is one of the "exceptions", you have to choose either wear (economy), or safety. At Souza's, we still leave this decision to the customer, but we're leaning more and more toward safety.

https://www.souzastireservice.com/ti...t-or-rear.aspx


So you are then stuck unable to rotate your tires, becuase the rear will always have more tread. If the tires were still fairly new with loads of grip I'd still be tempted to put new ones on the front until the first rotation.

[lazypucker]

Not siding with the OP or anyone, but will it be possible that Kal Tire knew that the car would be tolled to another shop for repairs and that they couldn't extort any more money, thus they purposely f-ed up a tire so that they covered their butt and trying to save face?

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by squiggs96

If you are buying two new tires they should go on the back, regardless of whether your car is front or rear wheel drive. The best way I’ve had it explained to me was think of a dog running through a house and it tries to make a turn on a linoleum kitchen floor. The rear legs kick out and go flying. It’s hilarious. If the dog had better grip on his rear paws he wouldn’t slide as much.

Originally Posted by GGG

In winter yes, in summer I don’t think it matters

Does this apply for front wheel vehicles?

Aren't the rear wheels just along for the ride and not really "driving" the vehicle.

[northcrunk]

Had to replace my rims on my navigator and because of the bolt pattern and sizing almost no where in the city had anything in stock. Ended up going online and ordering a new set of rims and tires for cheaper than it would cost to order cheap steel rims and lower quality tires locally.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Does this apply for front wheel vehicles?

Aren't the rear wheels just along for the ride and not really "driving" the vehicle.

It applies especially for front wheel drive cars.

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Does this apply for front wheel vehicles?

Aren't the rear wheels just along for the ride and not really "driving" the vehicle.

Yeah still true for FWD. It's about braking

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Aren't the rear wheels just along for the ride and not really "driving" the vehicle.

They're bearing thousands of pounds of weight.

Basic physics - regardless of front or rear wheel drive, if the front tires have good grip, and the rear tires lose traction when the vehicle is moving, what do you think is likely to happen?

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

They're bearing thousands of pounds of weight.

Basic physics - regardless of front or rear wheel drive, if the front tires have good grip, and the rear tires lose traction when the vehicle is moving, what do you think is likely to happen?

Some sweet drifting, if you do it right.