Critical Amber Alert

[Amethyst]

The idea that people who have stressful job, or do something that could be dangerous, need un-interrupted sleep so shouldn't get an alert at night, doesn't make sense. Most of those people (doctors, police, pilots, snow plough operators for instance) work shift work and don't tend to have a normal sleep pattern anyway.

For the rest, turning off your phone and using something else for an alarm seems like a much simpler "fix" than changing the entire system.

Or you can buy my phone. I still don't get the alerts. I did this time, because I have added the Alberta Emergency Alert app, but the one that is supposed to come straight to my phone doesn't.

[OutOfTheCube]

I think there's also some potential risk in bombing out an urgent emergency alert in this circumstance. It makes the entire program less effective going forward -- you can already see it with "Don't like it? Turn your phone off at night, idiot". -- So we're encouraging people to manually opt out. What if the one person who DOES have information in the future has started turning their phone off at night because of getting alerts that don't relate to them? Or someone dies in a flood or tornado or something because they were home alone and didn't have their phone on. Or people just start ignoring the alerts even when they do see them, since they have so rarely actually affected them. I could easily see that happen the other night, as the initial alert was for an event in the Edmonton area, when an update came through that was actually more pertinent to the Calgary area, it was likely swiped away with less people looking at it.

You can preach as much as you want, but people are inherently selfish. The more emergency alerts that are sent out that don't directly affect the people receiving them, the less effective the emergency alert program becomes.

[Amethyst]

They already do that at the other end. Not every missing child is an Amber Alert. There is certain criteria (I'm not sure of the details) such as they must be in imminent danger.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

I think there's also some potential risk in bombing out an urgent emergency alert in this circumstance. It makes the entire program less effective going forward -- you can already see it with "Don't like it? Turn your phone off at night, idiot". -- So we're encouraging people to manually opt out. What if the one person who DOES have information in the future has started turning their phone off at night because of getting alerts that don't relate to them? Or someone dies in a flood or tornado or something because they were home alone and didn't have their phone on. Or people just start ignoring the alerts even when they do see them, since they have so rarely actually affected them. I could easily see that happen the other night, as the initial alert was for an event in the Edmonton area, when an update came through that was actually more pertinent to the Calgary area, it was likely swiped away with less people looking at it.

You can preach as much as you want, but people are inherently selfish. The more emergency alerts that are sent out that don't directly affect the people receiving them, the less effective the emergency alert program becomes.

Exactly. That is a great point and will be a focus of the meetings next week as they debrief on Friday's alert. There will be a sense of urgency to focus the blast because they can only do it like this so many times before everyone gets pissed and people start disabling it any number of ways.

[stang]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I have parental apps on their phones that lock them down 8pm - 7am, so it isn't a problem.

So if you’re worried about the alerts take the phone out of the room, or make them shut them off.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by stang

So if you’re worried about the alerts take the phone out of the room, or make them shut them off.

I may do that. Friday was the first time I recall receiving on of these notifications in the middle of the night so I wasn't aware this could happen.

[Lubicon]

NSFW!

8

Originally Posted by Sliver

I had my phone on do not disturb and this service whitelisted itself against my permission. I think it should respect the do not disturb. I'll check Samsung forums and see if I can blacklist it when do not disturb is on, which I only turn on when I'm sleeping.

I would want to keep iminant danger-type problems whitelisted, though, so it'll be nice when the system gets smarter. Like location-based stuff for tornado warnings, etc.

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Again, there is only one level in Canada, which cannot be overridden or shut off. It is not the same as the US.

My understanding of the system is the alerts can be targeted to phones in certain geographic regions. Or at least this is going to be the end goal once the system is fully implemented. In this case it was a province wide amber alert so it goes to every phone. Which is how it should be. But a tornado alert will not, it will only go to phones in the area under threat.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

Or people just start ignoring the alerts even when they do see them, since they have so rarely actually affected them. I could easily see that happen the other night, as the initial alert was for an event in the Edmonton area, when an update came through that was actually more pertinent to the Calgary area, it was likely swiped away with less people looking at it.

If you are proposing that the message should have only been sent to Edmonton, how would they have ended up finding that person outside of Edmonton?

The message came through hours after the kid was determined to have been abducted and in danger. How is only targeting Edmonton helpful here?

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Amethyst

They already do that at the other end. Not every missing child is an Amber Alert. There is certain criteria (I'm not sure of the details) such as they must be in imminent danger.

Amber alerts are not for "missing" people (or Calgary would have 10+ a day), they are for "abducted" people only. There is an important difference between the two. Additionally, they have to meet these criteria:

1)A child or an adult with a proven mental or physical disability has been abducted;
2)The child or adult is in danger of serious harm or death;
3)There’s enough descriptive information to enable the public to identify: the child; and/or adult abductor; and/or mode of transportation;
4)There’s a reasonable expectation the abductee could be returned, or the abductor could be apprehended

I will note, since there often seems to be some confusion, the first point can be interpreted several ways, but will often be read as "a child (with/without proven mental or physical disability) and/or an adult with a proven mental or physical disability."

This page: (https://www.alberta.ca/amber-alert.a...BtRQToapcBgTCY) explains more about Amber Alerts, what they are broadcast to, and a some more info.

[Acey]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I may do that. Friday was the first time I recall receiving on of these notifications in the middle of the night so I wasn't aware this could happen.

Was it the middle of the night? Was it not two, one at 9 pm then one at 11 pm?

[Smartcar]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I can't have my phone off. I'm a business owner and the only one that can respond to alarms going off. My alarm company is whitelisted on my do not disturb profile. I'm the only family member my 70 year old mom has in Calgary and she lives alone - her numbers are white listed as well. I have a sick uncle with cancer and I'm his emergency contact - another whitelist. I also have a few others whitelisted like my wife and kids, but those were irrelevant last night as everyone was home.

I had my phone on do not disturb and this service whitelisted itself against my permission. I think it should respect the do not disturb. I'll check Samsung forums and see if I can blacklist it when do not disturb is on, which I only turn on when I'm sleeping.

I would want to keep iminant danger-type problems whitelisted, though, so it'll be nice when the system gets smarter. Like location-based stuff for tornado warnings, etc.

I'm the same, so I put my phone on do not disturb when I go to sleep but have it set to get calls from people listed in favourites. I wasn't asleep when the amber alerts came in, and I didn't have my phone on dnd, but I'm pretty sure that if you want to avoid having alerts wake you up you can turn off cellular data, it's on the same screen as where you set dnd. Unfortunately, you wouldn't get emergency alerts.

[midniteowl]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1107305293107478528


I wonder anyone here did that?
Meanwhile I was saying to my friend that us Albertan are better than Ontarian.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by midniteowl

I wonder anyone here did that?
Meanwhile I was saying to my friend that us Albertan are better than Ontarian.

By 'here' do you mean Calgary, or CPuck?

[midniteowl]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

By 'here' do you mean Calgary, or CPuck?

I meant CPuck, anyone call 911 to complain.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by midniteowl

I meant CPuck, anyone call 911 to complain.

They'd have to fess up to it themselves. But I can tell you that between folks complaining, clueless or telling CPS how to investigate, that I know of about 40 instances of that happening.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

They'd have to fess up to it themselves. But I can tell you that between folks complaining, clueless or telling CPS how to investigate, that I know of about 40 instances of that happening.

I hope there is nobody that dense that they would complain to 911.

Btw, if such s call was made, can the person be charged with making frivolous calls to 911?

[midniteowl]

Originally Posted by Wormius

I hope there is nobody that dense that they would complain to 911.

Btw, if such s call was made, can the person be charged with making frivolous calls to 911?

Didn't a bunch called to 911 the last time Ontario issued an Amber Alert? And that little girl wasn't as lucky.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Wormius

I hope there is nobody that dense that they would complain to 911.

Btw, if such s call was made, can the person be charged with making frivolous calls to 911?

I am aware, personally, of about 15 complaints to 911 for disturbed peace, sleep and/or tv programming. I am not aware of them all. Those are just the ones I dealt with personally, or overheard my co-workers dealing with. There were more.

While there is a charge for misuse of 911 (and it goes up to $10,000), none of the people who called to complain can really be charged with it. It's for chronic misuse over anything else. While the complaint calls were incredibly annoying (as it was already a SUPER busy night), there isn't a lot that can be done beyond hurry them up, get them off the emergency line, and hope that the next call is a real emergency or legit tip (of which, a goodly number came in, as well).

[Frequitude]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Waking up people in the middle of the night is useless and unnecessarily disruptive. Why not just be useless at that point? I'm not going to throw on my coat and start driving around. Should my kids hop on their bikes and start searching, too?

It woke me up too. The first thing I did was look up and down the street to see if I saw the car parked. The second thing I did was go back to sleep.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

I am aware, personally, of about 15 complaints to 911 for disturbed peace, sleep and/or tv programming. I am not aware of them all. Those are just the ones I dealt with personally, or overheard my co-workers dealing with. There were more.

While there is a charge for misuse of 911 (and it goes up to $10,000), none of the people who called to complain can really be charged with it. It's for chronic misuse over anything else. While the complaint calls were incredibly annoying (as it was already a SUPER busy night), there isn't a lot that can be done beyond hurry them up, get them off the emergency line, and hope that the next call is a real emergency or legit tip (of which, a goodly number came in, as well).

I wonder if after the operators asks, “what is the nature of he emergency?” It dawns on them that what they are calling about isn’t an emergency.