[Trade] Frost + Farabee from PHI to CGY for Pelletier + Kuzmenko + 25 2nd + 28 7th

[Paulie Walnuts]

Over cautious play? They must not watch us.

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by Vinsta13

If two of those 2nd, 3rd and 7th round picks turn into half as good as Farabee and Frost (former first rounders under 25) Flyers and their fans are laughing.

Odds are a lot better that those 3 picks maybe get them 160 games in the AHL and less than 20 in the NHL.

It's a lot harder than I believe it's given credit for to draft a player who goes on to play 200 games for the team that drafted the player.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Bingo

And we don't know exactly what the gamble is.

My assumption is they wanted Frost, and to get him they either had to give up "X", or give up less but take Farabee.

That's my point. Farabee did not have a lot of positive value, if any.

The gamble is that Farabee may be an anchor contract. But it's a gamble Calgary could and should have taken.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

That's my point. Farabee did not have a lot of positive value, if any.

The gamble is that Farabee may be an anchor contract. But it's a gamble Calgary could and should have taken.

Philly is worried about cap space going forward (next couple of years), Calgary isn't.

But I wouldn't take that to the "anchor" level as you suggested.

It's fit.

A $5M cap hit won't likely be an anchor in this or the upcoming market, especially for a guy that has hit 20 twice, and is 25 with only three years left.

I'd guess the Flames saw it as a win / win when it came up from Philly and that's when Pelletier was on his way.

Wanted Frost, could get Farabee as well, and avoid a larger sweetener in the original Frost deal.

[Funkhouser]

If Farabee can find his niche on the Backlund line, and learn from Coleman...we could easily have a Coleman 2.0.

The goal for the Flames is to develop him into a:
-High compete
-defensively elite winger
-between 20-30G / year

Worth the $5M/yr investment IMO

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Philly is worried about cap space going forward (next couple of years), Calgary isn't.

But I wouldn't take that to the "anchor" level as you suggested.

It's fit.

A $5M cap hit won't likely be an anchor in this or the upcoming market, especially for a guy that has hit 20 twice, and is 25 with only three years left.

I'd guess the Flames saw it as a win / win when it came up from Philly and that's when Pelletier was on his way.

Wanted Frost, could get Farabee as well, and avoid a larger sweetener in the original Frost deal.

The fact that Frost would have cost more if Calgary didn't take Farabee suggests Farabee had negative value.

But I agree, that's an example of Calgary weaponizing its cap space.

It's decent gamble for them, one Philly was not preapred to take.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Funkhouser

If Farabee can find his niche on the Backlund line, and learn from Coleman...we could easily have a Coleman 2.0.

The goal for the Flames is to develop him into a:
-High compete
-defensively elite winger
-between 20-30G / year

Worth the $5M/yr investment IMO

And then you trade Coleman with retention to a contender who needs some two way help.

[FlamesAddiction]

I'm not too worried about Farabee or his contract. He has looked really good lately and probably just needed some time to settle in. Plus, 3 years past this one doesn't present a major issue. It's a relatively short term.

He also seems like the kind of player that can be effective down the line-up even if the production isn't always there.

[The Yen Man]

Is it really even a gamble at all, other than to Edward's pocket book? Given how much cap space the Flames have, plus having ample cap space to lock up their young core (Wolf, Zary, Coronato), and finally the cap also going up significantly in the next few years. If anything, Flames might still struggle to hit a cap floor.

Some people make it sound like Farabee is being paid $15M a year lol.

[Sylvanfan]

If the cap explodes as it's predicted to. In a couple years teams could theoretically average 5 million per player on a 23 man roster. So if you can get Farabee to be like Coleman and score 20 goals a season, you're pretty satisfied.

Over the next 2 years, these are guys you hope step into the roles that Backlund and Coleman currently hold.

[dino7c]

Yeah some posters are stuck on 2007 math. 5M is a.decent player these days. 15-20 goals and your laughing. Farabee has been the Flames best forward lately.

[Naitix]

I love what I am seeing from these two so far.

Frost should have more points, just being a bit unlucky. I like his wide, low skating stance, and he has great hands and vision. He has been quite useful on the PP for zone entries. I can definitely see him having 50+ point season with us, and being a good second line center. I like his defensive game as well. He has 5 point sin 13 games, but he could easily have 8-10 points if Sharky scored from some of his feeds.

Farabee has been great the last 3 games, and is fitting in very nicely. He had a goal taken away on a BS goal tender interference and did not get an assist on the Backlund goal. So he would also have 5 points in 13 games. Pretty good for new acquisition. As Flyers fans also mentioned, he is still recovering from his neck surgery so I expect him to be even better next year.

Either way, absolute robbery by Craig, even if it does not work out, the only thing of value we gave up was a 2nd round pick

[traptor]

Yeah Farabee at 5m is fine right now, as long as his recent play continues.

5m is middle 6 money and that's what he is. We're not desperate for cap space. We have room on the roster (for now..).

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by traptor

Yeah Farabee at 5m is fine right now, as long as his recent play continues.

5m is middle 6 money and that's what he is. We're not desperate for cap space. We have room on the roster (for now..).

When you factor is ELCs, young player drafted in the mid rounds, cheap vets and back up goalies. You should be able to have 8 bodies on your roster around $10-$12 mil. Leaves $84-$86 mil for 14 guys. Cap teams usually don't have 23 man roster.

That's $6 mil or more per player. The Flames for 3 players north of $6 mil right now. $5 mil top 9 players should gain you some cap to pay elite players.

Cap is supposed to climb 3 years in a row. $5 mil will be close to 4th line money soon. Next year that is a decent 3rd line contract

[Torture]

While we didn't 'broker' any deals by taking on dead cap space, this is a good example of 'weaponizing' cap space.

If you can take on a reclamation project that's slightly overpaid while we're spending so little, you do it. Worst case, you lowered the asset cost of acquiring Frost. Best case, you get another player that can either contribute to the team or be traded for more assets later on.

Originally Posted by Vinsta13

If two of those 2nd, 3rd and 7th round picks turn into half as good as Farabee and Frost (former first rounders under 25) Flyers and their fans are laughing.

What are the odds that 2 of a 2nd, 3rd, and 7th round pick turn into half as good as Farabee and Frost? 5%? Even if the Flyers get amazingly lucky and pick a superstar hall of famer in the 7th round this is a good trade for the Flames. Flyers fans should not be laughing. A 2nd, 3rd, and 7th doesn't seem like good value at all for a potential 2nd line centre and whatever Farabee is.

[CliffFletcher]

The Flyers are clearing cap to go big game hunting in the offseason.

[Strange Brew]

Still absolutely love this trade for the Flames since other than the 2nd rounder, IMO they really only gave up spare parts. I'm actually surprised Philly could even get a 3rd for Kuzmenko.

That said, F&F are going to need to produce more. Granted the whole team is not scoring, but a combined 8 points in 26 games isn't going to be good enough over the long term.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The Flyers are clearing cap to go big game hunting in the offseason.

GL with that

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

When you factor is ELCs, young player drafted in the mid rounds, cheap vets and back up goalies. You should be able to have 8 bodies on your roster around $10-$12 mil. Leaves $84-$86 mil for 14 guys. Cap teams usually don't have 23 man roster.

That's $6 mil or more per player. The Flames for 3 players north of $6 mil right now. $5 mil top 9 players should gain you some cap to pay elite players.

Cap is supposed to climb 3 years in a row. $5 mil will be close to 4th line money soon. Next year that is a decent 3rd line contract

Imagine Rooney making $5M lol.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

The Flyers are clearing cap to go big game hunting in the offseason.

Other than Marner I don't think there is much for big game this off season. Mostly a bunch of land mines.